HomeRoast Digest


Topic: New roasted coffee guide (71 msgs / 1555 lines)
1) From: Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee
I am working on a new version of the Roasted Coffee Pictorial Guide 
with much improved pictures. It is NOT finished but worth taking a 
look at. Click on the mall images to see the larger versions. -Tomhttp://www.sweetmarias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.html-- 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                   "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
            Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting  -  Tom & Maria
                      http://www.sweetmarias.com                Thompson Owen george

2) From: R.N.Kyle
Thanks Thom I like the new pictures
RK

3) From: Edward Spiegel
At 5:32 PM -0700 8/18/04, Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>
Hi Tom,
Looks great. A couple of things:
Second crack -- rather than say that it sounds like a snap, I would suggest 'finger snap' . When I hear 'snap' (without a modifier), I think of a fairly sharp sound. 'Finger snap' I think is less ambiguous.
The pictures seem a little washed out on my Mac. I don't know if this is a Mac vs. PC gamma thing, but the colors look a bit lighter for City and Full City than I would have expected.
Great job.
Best,
Edward

4) From: Oaklandguy
I like the new pictorial, Tom.  Much more info on where you're at in a
roast, and that's very helpful for us new folks.  At one time, you had a
page that had all the pics right next to each other in a "window pane"
arrangement.  That was helpful, too, in comparing the roast stages to each
other.  But I can't find that one any more.
Thanks.
Brent

5) From: Gene Smith
<Snip>
on my
<Snip>
And, granting the difficulties of this process, they seemed so on my Windows
XP computer as well.
Gene Smith
riding the wild learning curve, in Houston

6) From: Jim and Tina Wheeler
Nicely done images.
They displayed well on my PC, perhaps because we do a lot of image work and
the system (monitors and printer) is calibrated (or I got lucky).  Both
monitors showed the same quality of image.
Jim in Skull Valley

7) From: John Blumel
On Aug 18, 2004, at 9:52pm, Lissa wrote:
<Snip>
I think they look pretty close on my PowerBook display. One thing I did 
notice is that "14. Full French roast" seems to be in B&W. (And, 
obviously, those two beans did not actually appear in public together.)
Pretty brave taking the Probat up to the immanent fire stage.
John Blumel

8) From: Dennis Parham
I think they are great on my POWERBOOK G4  maybe if you guys are using 
CTR monitors well any I gues... make sure you have your temp setting 
correct.. that can thow off the pics...
Dennis
On Aug 18, 2004, at 8:21 PM, John Blumel wrote:
<Snip>
Dennis Parhamhttp://www.parhamguitars.com

9) From: Dennis Parham
I apoligize for my bad politically correctlness... I didnt only mean 
guys.. I mean EVERYONE!!!  used to term loosely... sorry!!!!!
Dennis
On Aug 18, 2004, at 8:24 PM, Dennis Parham wrote:
<Snip>
Dennis Parhamhttp://www.parhamguitars.com

10) From: Peter Barnes
As others have said, I would think the "washed out" look is more about 
monitor calibration than anything else. 
I like the pics.  They're informative not necessarily about how my beans 
should look, but what the roast progression looks like in general.  This 
is great.
The one suggestion I would make is related to scale.  Personally, I 
would find it helpful on the front page to have all the pics scaled 
together, so you can see what happens as the beans grow in size.  There 
seems to be quite a bit of variation there.
All in all, though, it's great.  Thanks Tom.
cheers
peter
Lissa wrote:
<Snip>

11) From: Lissa
On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 17:42:41 -0700, Edward Spiegel wrote
<Snip>
They seem a bit washed out (with the exception of the various charcoals) on my
work Windows computer, too.  I tend to keep contrast turned down, but they
looked like my contrast was dialed up.
I was debating mentioning it, and decided it was probably just my computer. 
Granted, there is no way to get these pics 100% accurate on every computer, or
even close.  
Be well,
Lissa

12) From: Barbara Greenspon
It looks really great and helpful.  Thanks!
Barbara
On Aug 18, 2004, at 7:32 PM, Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>

13) From: Barbara Greenspon
They look great on my powerbook g4 too, and I just went and checked my 
G5 with the 23 inch flat screen (not bragging or anything), and they 
beans look like they are real!   They are fantastic.  So its probably a 
calibration issue for those with problems (?).
Barbara
On Aug 18, 2004, at 8:27 PM, Dennis Parham wrote:
<Snip>

14) From: Dennis Parham
hehehe  yea.. I just put in my order for  the dual G5 2.5 with 8gig ram 
and 30" screen !!!  OH YEA!!!! be here in a week! it will go GREAT with 
my Aircraft aluminum G4 Powerbook (wireless on a T1)   ehehehe I sure 
hope it will all sync to my new ipod mini.... no BMW though... Range 
Rover...lol but.. hmm.. it WAS made and owned by BMW... hmm...maybe it 
WILL WORK!! now to monster garage to make my Rover a riding espresso 
machine and roaster!!!!
Dennis
On Aug 18, 2004, at 9:28 PM, Barbara Greenspon wrote:
<Snip>
Dennis Parhamhttp://www.parhamguitars.com

15) From: H Hurd
Thank you for the new pictures and descriptions.
The change in bean surface texture from one level 
of roast to the next is very clear on my monitor.
I have been using your description of the texture change to 
estimate the start of second crack.  It helps to see a picture.
Holly

16) From: Pecan Jim Gundlach
Tom,
      Nice work.   I never roast with a thermometer so seeing the 
temperature with these is quite helpful.  I know that this is not what 
you had in mind, but  I've been wanting to do a white coffee roast for 
some time.  The directions call for roasting to about 350 cooling, 
roasting to about 350 again, cooling, and finally roasting to about 350 
again.  With these pictures I can roast to yellow-tan, #4 on your 
guide, take it to where it starts to get a little more marbled, cool, 
and finally take it to a little more marbled again.  Then, I'll see 
what I have.  Would you say cinnamon is right at #5?
     Jim Gundlach
On Aug 18, 2004, at 7:32 PM, Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>

17) From: Nospam
Is there a way to get all the different stages of beans lined up together
and taken in one shot?  To me at least it seems each pic was auto
color/exposure/etc corrected by the camera.  By taking one pic with all the
beans in one shot, all the beans would be treated to the same correction and
the colors relative to each other would be maintained.
There was an exercise we did in a photography class where we manually
adjusted the exposure setting and also the f-stop for educational purposes
just to see the difference in exposure and f-stop settings (darker vs
lighter).  You had to tell the finishing lab not to auto correct or else all
your shots would end up looking the same.
Btw, my monitor was calibrated as best I could with Avia.

18) From: Rob Stewart
Good job Thom.... Pictures work good for me and the text will be a good
reference.
Rob

19) From: Michael Vanecek
On:
9. 1st crack finishes
You misspelled "smoothed" - it's currently smmothed.
On the last one, if based on immediacy and high chance of fire:
16. Immanent fire
Should be spelled "imminent" - unless you're refering to the potential 
of fire immanant within the bean. :)
That's all I found right now. Perhaps with more coffee in me, I'll find 
more. :)
Are those images of beans created directly on the flatbed scanner?
Cheers,
Mike
Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>

20) From: GHHOLT
In a message dated 8/18/2004 8:34:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
tom writes:
I am working on a new version of the Roasted Coffee Pictorial Guide 
with much improved pictures. It is NOT finished but worth taking a 
look at. Click on the mall images to see the larger versions. -Tomhttp://www.sweetmarias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.htmlNice Macro shots Tom
George Holt

21) From: DJ Garcia
Beautiful, Tom & Maria! Would there be degrees of oilyness in the oil in
the darker roasts?
DJ
On Grand Jury Duty

22) From: DJ Garcia
They also looked well on mine, which I also calibrate for my photo work.
DJ

23) From: Johnny Kent
At 12:19 AM 8/19/2004 -0500, Michael Vanecek wrote:
<Snip>
LOL. Don't you mean 'referring'  ;-)

24) From: Jason & Loraleigh Epp
Hi Tom.  As someone still new to roasting, I can definitely say that I find
this new guide extremely helpful.  I find it breaks down the different roast
stages very clearly & provides more detail than before.  I also like the
close-up shots of the beans (although other's suggestions to put them all
together for a quick glance at roast progression is also a great idea).  It
looks like you put a lot of effort into this... great job!
Jason

25) From: Dan Bollinger
Tom, Here's neat trick. If you want "455 f" to read "455° F"  (yes, is =
should be capitalized) here is the trick:  Type 455. Then, while holding =
down your [ALT] key, type in USING THE NUMERICAL KEYBOARD ON YOUR RIGHT =
"0176."   Again, Hold [ALT] Type 0176.  You gets: °   Dan
<Snip>
- - - -
<Snip>
unsvbscribes) go to =http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

26) From: John Abbott
Or use Linux ©  and get about 200 ±  symbols built in along with a dozen
languages.
On Thu, 2004-08-19 at 07:30, Dan Bollinger wrote:
<Snip>

27) From: Dan Bollinger
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
John, The IBM PC is also 'built-in' in the extended keyboard and almost =
all TrueType and PostScript fonts have the characters in place. Keep in =
mind your audience, too. Tom is a newbie to html and not as computer =
savvy as you or I. The [ALT] trick is a simple way for him to improve =
his website. S-M is probably the poorest designed and most difficult to =
navigate website I know. Dan

28) From: John Abbott
On Thu, 2004-08-19 at 08:14, Dan Bollinger wrote:
<Snip>
Dan, I wouldn't put Tom in a newbie category.  He's been at this awhile
now.  Aside from the fact that he's above average bright.   The web site
has evolved with additions flowing to their own pages.   To redesign
would make it more navigable to some, but would be a mystery to the long
standing list of visitors.   You haven't seen poorly designed until you
check out some I've done!  Before I learned to use PHP I did everything
with Publisher and Front Page.   But I could throw up a site in about 20
minutes - then everyone who visited go to throw up next :O)

29) From: Gregg Reno
I'm wondering if there are any general taste guidelines that could go =
along
with the degree of roast descriptions.  For example, what would make a
person (in general) choose a City+ vs. a Full City+ roast? Or do the
variations in growing regions make any general taste guidelines by =
degree of
roast impractical?
I also agree about the SM layout - it could use a re-design.  Two
suggestions:
- Don't make the user scroll down to see the main site links
- Don't make the user read through a lot of text to get to the Green =
Coffees
link. 
Just my 2¢ 
(cents symbol entered using the Alt-0162 technique on my Windows =
machine.
You can also enter special characters by running the CHARMAP utility =
that
comes with Windows.  Just do a Start->Run and enter CHARMAP and hit =
enter)
-Gregg R.

30) From: Angelo
I'm not a M$ shill, but it seems like switching to Linux just to be able to=
 
type a degree sign is a bit extreme, but I agree, that in general, Linux 
is  probably a good idea.
Besides the trick with the alt + xxxx, one could access the character map 
(Start > all programs > accessories > system tools > character map) and be=
 
able to find almost every esoteric character needed. If one uses many of 
these characters, one could make a shortcut of Character Map and put it in=
 
a more available place.
Ciao,
Angelo
<Snip>
 
<Snip>
 
<Snip>
http://www.sweetmar=ias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.html
<Snip>
 
<Snip>
http://lists.sweet=marias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast
<Snip>
http://sweetmari=as.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings
<Snip>
tmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast
<Snip>
ias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

31) From: John Abbott
On Thu, 2004-08-19 at 09:32, Angelo wrote:
<Snip>
Angelo,  We usually see eye to eye.  But in this case I think using M$
is the extreme.  Its a form of thrill seeking that I couldn't adapt to
well.  OK - how many hours can I run before the OS crashes - or I get
nailed by a virus - or ....
I switched to Linux in 99 when I was IT for a national bank.  A
professor at Purdue gave me an early version of Red Hat and I liked it. 
When I discovered that I could make copies and GIVE them away I was more
impressed. I was running a Unisys mainframe when we converted to Linux
from UNIX on several desktops and I was hooked.  I just did a uptime
check and I've been running for 38 days 14 hours.  The last time it was
powered down was because of a power loss and I wanted to save the UPS
battery in case I needed it.  I used to time NT crashes with a stop
watch.

32) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Claus_Th=F8gersen?=
Hi,
The visual design may be bad,  but I am sure it is not the worst ever!!
As a blind user I do not care for the visual design, but the general design
in terms of using html as it is intended this site is very good designed!!
really in the top end of sites that are not specifically created to meet
html or other standards.
And another thing this site is more like a reference site that a small group
of regular users use on a regular bsis. Why design a visually very fancy
site do you really have reason to believe that this would turn the casual
surfer into a home roaster!?
Claus Thøgersen

33) From: Dan Bollinger
<Snip>
group
<Snip>
fancy
<Snip>
casual
<Snip>
Screw the casual user! What do they know about good coffee?  I want it =
to be easy for us. Here's an open challenge. Anyone may play. Using the =
shortest number of links, direct me to the page showing all of our =
home-built roaster images.  Begin with www.sweetmarias.com and LIST =
EVERY PAGE you visit on the way to that page. The person who can get =
there in the fewest 'clicks' wins a hearty thanks from me.  dAN

34) From: Dennis Parham
well... my only thing.. it seems a little hard for the newbie to figure 
out what beans to buy for their kinda of drinking... Id like to see 
that if I clicked on a list with only the ratings... and maybe 
something like... Best fo espresso..french roast... ect...  its a VERy 
good site to me just a little broken up... also.. needs a lottery!! 
hehehe   when you order you choose to add 1 $ to your order and every 
month or 2  there is a drawing for a new something kewl... hehehe   and 
PUSH it to newbies who haven't seen the site... maybe get them to order 
something! + it is fun...:-P  also.. a way to see your shopping cart 
more easily...  maybe on the LIST of beans... a section on... what it 
is cupped for... espresso, ect...  it would be a great way to jump 
strait to the ones most generally used for certain things... hu??  I 
think that was worth .04cents
those yeas in Advertising school.... sheesh! hehehe
dparham
On Aug 19, 2004, at 10:43 AM, Dan Bollinger wrote:
<Snip>
Dennis Parhamhttp://www.parhamguitars.com

35) From: Jeffrey A. Bertoia
Claus Thøgersen wrote:
<Snip>
That's how I got started...
jeff

36) From: Jeffrey A. Bertoia
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
John Abbott wrote:
<Snip>
LOL I think this is a touchier nerve than "those wimpy centrals". :-D
<Snip>
It's a little better now....  My W2K server here reports: Uptime 
Computer: 161 days 03:28:12  YMMV
jeff

37) From: John Abbott
three clicks!  http://www.sweetmarias.com/reading.html Tom puts all of
this type listing under the Library pages - which is the compendium of
non-retail information that Tom offers up. 
On Thu, 2004-08-19 at 10:43, Dan Bollinger wrote:
<Snip>

38) From: Dan Bollinger
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
John, What are those clicks, please?  Please list them, thanks, Dan

39) From: Edward Spiegel
At 10:32 AM -0400 8/19/04, Angelo wrote:
<Snip>
Guys. This is possible in Mac OS, PC or Linux. There is no reason to do web page editing in any OS other than the one that you know. There are a billion shortcuts and utilities on each PC -- but not everyone knows all of the tricks which is not their fault. Everyone thinks that whatever they use is best and people are often suggesting that another OS doesn't do things or allow things that are actually possible. So, please, lets lay off the OS advocacy.
Best,
Edward

40) From: Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee
Thanks for the suggestions with the new guide. The camera was set 
entirely manually for White Balance, for exposure and focus. Its done 
on a copy stand one after the other, then corrected in Photoshop 
using the same curve. I am not thrilled with the results but I think 
they are a great improvement for sure. I could composite all the 
photos into one, but it looks like the suggestion for "all roast 
stages in one shot" is a better idea. I'll do that.
As far as descriptions, the page is far from done. I just wanted to 
get some feedback. And I got lots of it!
I checked the page on different monitors here and thought it was near 
enough on all. My monitor is fairly well calibrated. Remember, I did 
color correction for a living a while back and I know all the caveats 
with representing color. Trying to represent it on a illuminated 
screen adds another layer of problems to the mix. I do think the pics 
went from brown to black quite dramatically. Then again (and someone 
was very perceptive on this) I used #14 from a different set of 
photos because somehow I skipped it one the last run through the 
stages (I photographed the single beans 4 times. I also photographed 
the tray full of 40-50 beans several times but I felt that looking at 
one bean was more informative. The problem, and it does bug me, is 
that the size, seed to seed, varies. You get the general idea of bean 
expansion but it is obscured by he variation in original bean size.)
Lastly, I don't see why this thread, when I have just spent 2 days 
working on a project, is an appropriate time to criticize our site. I 
think it is really rude, Dan. Look at the "easy to navigate" sites 
out there for coffee. Do they do this kind of work? No, they just buy 
coffee from the nearest broker and sell it as cheap as they can, and 
there's a few that even steal my photos from our site. I really don't 
give a crap about making a site that can be navigated in a few 
clicks. What we are trying to do is offer content, and if the 
experience of reading about coffee topics at sweet marias takes time 
and is circuitous, so is the experience of roasting itself. If you 
want a web where everything you want pops up in one screen, then you 
can spend time on million dollar sites, and you can learn nothing. We 
choose quality of information over appearance.
Interesting that the only complaints we get about web design come 
from designers. That's not really the issue, the issue is how 
incredibly rude you are in your criticisms. And based on previous 
emails, this really comes out of nowhere. I don't get it.
Tom
-- 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                   "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
            Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting  -  Tom & Maria
                      http://www.sweetmarias.com                Thompson Owen george

41) From: John Blumel
On Aug 19, 2004, at 8:30am, Dan Bollinger wrote:
<Snip>
is 
<Snip>
<Snip>
Unfortunately, this is a Windows trick, so a) if Tom is using a Mac (as =
believed) to put these pages together it won't work (Option+0 would) 
and b) in HTML terms this would result in an illegal character in the 
HTML document that may or may not display correctly, depending on the 
browser used to view the page.
The correct way to insert a degree symbol into HTML is to use the  
Latin-1 character entity reference for that symbol or, for 
compatibility with more browsers, the decimal character reference. For =
the degree symbol, these would respectively be '°' or '°' 
(And, I think it's worth noting that, on Windows at least, it doesn't 
really require significantly more typing to do it right.)
Many HTML editors will insert/convert these entities for you but it's 
always best to view the source to verify this. Obviously, if using a 
text editor, you have to type them yourself. More information can be 
found at:
   http://www.htmlhelp.com/reference/html40/entities/John Blumel

42) From: Dan Bollinger
<Snip>
Tom, I guess that calls the question, "When would be an appropriate time =
to make suggestions?" Like I said, the site's content and product are =
first rate. I'll throw in terrific service, too! 
<Snip>
When it comes to selecting coffee, I only take the advice of coffee =
experts like yourself. Maybe we designers know something that will be of =
value to you, too?
<Snip>
Considering my commentary over the past few years, maybe, just maybe, I =
wasn't being rude. Regardless, I won't discuss your website on your =
forum any longer. yours, Dan

43) From: Dennis Parham
tom... throw a little mm ruler next to photo of each bean... problem 
solved.. hu?? hehe  I have a decent background in graphic arts 
(illustration and also photography) I know where you are coming from!!
I think they look great for the most part!!  HELPS ME!
Dennis Parham
On Aug 19, 2004, at 11:53 AM, Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>
Dennis Parhamhttp://www.parhamguitars.com

44) From: Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee
You are right John ... I use Dreamweaver (and 
while I have the current MX I actually use the 
older version for a couple reasons...) on  a Mac 
and I can make º symbols, but prefer just to use 
an f to ensure it shows up right, The point is, 
do people know what I mean when I put 350 f ? If 
so, then that is the point.
Tom
<Snip>
-- 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - =
-
                   "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
            Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting  -  Tom & Maria
                      http://www.sweetmarias.com                Thompson Owen george

45) From: Rick Farris
A couple of points that can be inferred from John's post are that the HTML
4.01 Entities, if entered using the second example he shows, are *exactly
the same numbers* you'd type if you were using the Win Alt-key trick.  Makes
it easy to remember.
Also, it's been my experience that the number-form of the entities works in
more situations than the word-form. i.e. ° is more reliable than
&#deg;.  Note that the semi-colon is part of the entity.
In addition to the reference that John posted I try to keep this one up to
date:
http://www.big-rick.com/ref/entities.html(Press the "Show" button listed under "ISO 8859-1 Symbol Entities" to see
the most common symbols.
-- Rick
----
8/19/2004 10:09:36 AM
Weather(0): Uninitialized
Tommy Bolin - Post Toastee - 1976

46) From: Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee
<Snip>
The list is funny - we have all these people who are very proficient 
on one thing or another and forget that not everyone is, and not 
everyone has to be or wants to be. It's great that people bring their 
expertise to the discussion, but we need to respect each other, even 
those of us who use a Mac! The computer is just a tool to get 
something done and each of us uses it differently. I don't understand 
people who learn to use the tool beyond their needs, for its own 
sake, but that's just a different type of person. So as Edward wrote, 
lets not get into the OS thing again. There were other comments 
recently about Mailman etc and I just want to remind you all that we 
are a low tech business here. We don't have the MONEY to hire outside 
help and we would totally lose focus on what we do if we learned to 
do it differently. The site is served remotely on a Unix box, the 
secure server is separate, Mailman is on another box (a problem with 
getting them to upgrade to the latest Mailman version), all of this 
done through an ISP. I don't serve anything here at the warehouse nor 
would I want to. We would have much more down time, and a lot of 
other unforeseen problems if we did. I seriously doubt that someone 
serving their own site can do it as securely as a good remote ISP 
hosted at one of these fancy data centers who spends all day looking 
for security problems. But since we use Macs and PCs here, if I did 
it I would serve it off a fast Mac simply because you are such a 
smaller target for hackers and viruses ...
Tom
-- 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                   "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
            Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting  -  Tom & Maria
                      http://www.sweetmarias.com                Thompson Owen george

47) From: Sue Stevenson
Tom,
I just checked out the new version of your Roasted Coffee Pictorial Guide. It's really fantastic! The photos are great. I can tell you, I visit your web site daily, to read, see if anything is new or just to make sure I'm not missing out on any new coffee offerings or sale items I can't live without.  I wanted to tell you how much I appreciate the effort you put in. I'm sure I would not still be home roasting if it were not for your web site.  The best purchases come with a good user manuals and service departments. Your site provides that. I really believe it's what makes a good company great, and one that will endure and prosper!  ue
 
Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee  wrote:
I am working on a new version of the Roasted Coffee Pictorial Guide 
with much improved pictures. It is NOT finished but worth taking a 
look at. Click on the mall images to see the larger versions. -Tomhttp://www.sweetmarias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.html-- 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting - Tom & Mariahttp://www.sweetmarias.comThompson Owen george

48) From: Edward Spiegel
At 10:14 AM -0700 8/19/04, Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>
 actually use the older version for a couple reasons...) on  a Mac and I can=
 make º symbols, but prefer just to use an f to ensure it shows up right,=
 The point is, do people know what I mean when I put 350 f ? If so, then=
 that is the point
I agree with you Tom. It is perfectly clear. Also, by avoiding using a=
 special char, you ensure that if someone saves the page as plain text that=
 it is readable. If one has special chars, saving as plain text results in=
 having gobbledygook. So, I like the way that you have done it.
Best,
--Edward
p.s. I am sorry if my comment about the picture appearance seemed like a=
 criticism. It was not intended as such and I really really appreciate your=
 great work.

49) From: Johnny Kent
Tom,
your website is very imformative and conveys a wealth of information. I
treasure it and really appreciate how much work you have put into it.
 The essence of the written word is to carry information and if the reader
understands what is written then spelling and absolute correctness,
formatting, etc.,  are irrelevant except to those who value form over=
 content.
Besides as with roasting where there is no one correct roast level for a
bean there is no one correct approach to web design and opinions will=
 differ.
what the ° F? ;-)
At 10:14 AM 8/19/2004 -0700, you wrote:
<Snip>
 -
<Snip>
unsvbscribes) go to=
http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>

50) From: John Blumel
On Aug 19, 2004, at 1:14pm, Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>
And a good point it is. The degree symbol really is superfluous.
John Blumel

51) From: Johnny Kent
At 02:03 PM 8/19/2004 -0400, you wrote:
<Snip>
And has been dropped internationally with the Kelvin

52) From: Tom Ulmer
I remember when an ASCII character chart was mandantory.
Thanks. I never knew it was in system tools.

53) From: Pecan Jim Gundlach
On Aug 19, 2004, at 10:35 AM, Claus Thøgersen wrote:
<Snip>
Claus,
       I seem to remember that Dan, aka The Scarlet Wombat, who I 
haven't seen on the list for a while is also blind and was quite 
creative in dealing with some of the challenges that roasting and 
brewing coffee presented to the blind.  Does anyone remember Dan's 
email address?
      Jim Gundlach

54) From: Angelo
Ed,
I wasn't advocating anything... I started out on a Mac with 128 k of 
memory..Remember those? And I would probably love to try Linux, but I've 
been warned of the learning curve....
I was merely offering a tip on how to get the more arcane characters from 
the system that was under discussion at the time.
I saw where someone else offered the same solution, sans shortcut....
If you're going to quote me, please quote the whole thing, thank you...
Ciao,
Angelo
<Snip>

55) From: Rick Farris
Good god, no!  Trim your attributions!
-- Rick
----
8/19/2004 7:40:10 PM
Partly Cloudy in Sierra Vista, AZ
79°F (26°C)  -  30% RH 
Wind Variable at 6 mph (19:35:10)
Jethro Tull - Life's a Long Song - 1988

56) From: John Blumel
On Aug 19, 2004, at 10:45pm, Rick Farris wrote:
<Snip>
I agree with Rick.
John Blumel

57) From: Angelo
Sorry Rick,
But I haven't got a clue as to what your talking about. Care to explain?
Angelo
<Snip>
http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

58) From: Michael Vanecek
Shhh, don't tell anyone. :)
Cherrs,
Mike
Johnny Kent wrote:
<Snip>

59) From: Robert Cantor
<Snip>
Sounds like Kelvin is Hobbled
(think boy with tiger...)
Bob C.
rcantor

60) From: Peter Barnes
Wow.  I just had a chance to check out the new picture, and I continue 
to be absolutely amazed at your attention to detail.  At this moment, 
four years into roasting, there's no going back for me, but I do have to 
say that if it weren't for the fact that you and Maria weren't so 
dedicated to customer service, educating customers, and providing an 
AMAZING product, I doubt that I would have come this far.  I love 
explaining to people where I buy my beans from, and how I can know that 
I'm getting some of the best beans in the world.  They usually don't 
believe me.  Then they try the coffee, and realize that something is 
really going on here.  So Tom, at the end of a really long and fun day 
on the list, I would just like to let you know just how much I 
appreciate everything you do. 
cheers
peter
Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>

61) From: AlChemist John
Tom,
That is very nice.  I was able to "guess" the stage and crack based on the 
color and texture before I hit the descriptions.  Good job.
Sometime around 05:56 PM 8/18/2004, Oaklandguy typed:
<Snip>
--
John Nanci 
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.dreamsandbones.net/blog/http://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

62) From: AlChemist John
When I was designing Chocolate Alchemy, my coder said the same thing about=
 
SM when I said I want to model off of them.  I occasionally can't find 
something on SM, but it is so MASSIVE and built up overtime.    Speaking 
with Tom at the PNWGII, he said he makes something on the order of 10 
changes a day on it.  I can't imagine something that large and fluid and 
changing to be simple and concise.  Especially with a non-IT person doing 
the work.  Besides, it is a "web" all to itself and I think that is cool 
and appropriate.
Sometime around 06:14 AM 8/19/2004, Dan Bollinger typed:
<Snip>
 
<Snip>
 dozen 
<Snip>
 
<Snip>
 
<Snip>
http://www.sweetmar=ias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.html
<Snip>
 
<Snip>
http://lists.sweet=marias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast
<Snip>
http://sweetmari=as.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings
<Snip>
tmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast
<Snip>
ias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings
--
John Nanci 
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.dreamsandbones.net/blog/http://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

63) From: Ed Needham
Oh, wow!   The coolest desktop wallpaper ever...http://www.sweetmarias.com/roastprocess-singlebean/roasting-allin1.jpgThanks Tom!
*******************************
Ed Needham
"To absurdity and beyond!"
ed at homeroaster dot com
*******************************

64) From: Ben Treichel
Ed Needham wrote:
<Snip>
I'm trying it out; however I don't know about that bottom line of 
charcoal ;-)
Tom, its a great shot, one I can relate to instantly since I can watch 
the colors change with my hurricane lamp.
<Snip>
-- 
Ben Treichel
Program Manager
S.E Michigan
SwRI
248-232-7365 (o)
248-935-6845 (m)

65) From: AlChemist John
When I was designing Chocolate Alchemy, my coder said the same thing about 
SM when I said I want to model off of them.  I occasionally can't find 
something on SM, but it is so MASSIVE and built up overtime.    Speaking 
with Tom at the PNWGII, he said he makes something on the order of 10 
changes a day on it.  I can't imagine something that large and fluid and 
changing to be simple and concise.  Especially with a non-IT person doing 
the work.  Besides, it is a "web" all to itself and I think that is cool 
and appropriate.  I can only hope my site is like that one day.  It IS 
something I am aiming for, that quantity of information.  SM is one of the 
beacons I follow in my fledgling business.
*resent because I think it bounced*
Sometime around 06:14 AM 8/19/2004, Dan Bollinger typed:
<Snip>

66) From: Angelo
I've gotten to the point where I do not even try to proselytize coffee 
roasting anymore. If the slightest bit of interest is shown, I immediately 
send them to SM....I know they will be in good hands...
Angelo
<Snip>

67) From: Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee
I am still trying to work on the page more so be patient... but 
thanks for the comments and I am glad the new picture that you all 
suggested is useful! And works as wallpaper!
If any of you have read the guide that Carl Staub wrote to accompany 
the SCAA color tile kit, you will get a brief synopsis of the 
difficulty with representing roast color. One odd thing that Ben 
mentioned is those charcoal roast colors, how quickly it passes a 
threshold (the last 3 roast levels pictured) that turn really black. 
I think this has to do with the change in reflectance that Carl Staub 
discusses, not just in color but in surface. It just absorbs light! I 
used photoshop to get the right color balance (the camera was white 
balanced etc, but Photoshop can do it better) ... nontheless I could 
not recover additional color gradiation from those last 3 charcoal 
levels. When coffee goes black, it does it quickly.
BTW, I think a few of you are surprised that the F City+ and Vienna 
range are so brown and light looking. But if you take your next roast 
at those levels and look at them under a strong, focused 
daylight-balanced light, you see how much color you see in them 
...then take it into normal room light and it looks so much darker.
Tom
-- 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                   "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
            Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting  -  Tom & Maria
                      http://www.sweetmarias.com                Thompson Owen george

68) From: DJ Garcia
I've been into computers all my life, since age 11 (relays, switches and
indicator lights). I've been designing software in all kinds of
environments for over 30 years.
I dislike "standard look and feel driven" GUIs as boring. That doesn't
mean I like hard to use GUIs either, they need to be as intuitive as
possible within the context of the theme and task. But such is not
always possible when design evolves as you develop rather than being
designed up-front, the former being the norm because of the
"time-to-market" frenzy. The plus side is you get to discover things you
may not have initially been able to think of. Software design is always
a compromise.
But one thing the years have taught me is this: show me a system even a
fool could use, and I'll show you a system only a fool would use ...
OK, I'm back on hermit mode now.
DJ

69) From: Ben Treichel
Tom & Maria - Sweet Maria's Coffee wrote:
<Snip>
Actually what I find interesting is not the color difference between 11 
& 12 but the 'smoothing' of the surface. Its that change that I rely on 
at that stage of the roast. FYI, my roasting cabinet has a light in it 
about 4 inches away from the beans.
<Snip>

70) From: rick jackson
Can you please re post the link to the new roasted coffee guide. I deleted it. My bad. :P
Thanks,
Rick J.
--
Find what you are looking for with the Lycos Yellow Pageshttp://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp?SRC=lycos10

71) From: GHHOLT
In a message dated 8/21/2004 8:12:26 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
finaddic writes:
Can you please re post the link to the new roasted coffee guide. I deleted 
it. My bad. :P
Thanks,
Rick J.http://sweetmarias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.html


HomeRoast Digest