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Topic: Aged Java - ugh? (22 msgs / 380 lines)
1) From: TFisher511
Tim,
I am one of the Aged Java fans. I roast it up to the second crack or a little 
beyond, which is a dark roast by my standards. I always rest it 2 days and I 
never, ever drink it straight! I usually blend it 1/3 Aged Java with 2/3 
Columbian, or Costa Rican, or any mild type that somewhat lacks its own 
distinct character. It gives a deep, rich flavor and a pleasing coffee 
aftertaste for about a half hour. 
Maybe that combination will change your opinion, and please cut me a little 
slack on the 'distinct character' comment. After all, I too am an expert at 
my opinion.
Terry
<< Aged Java drinkers, please help me troubleshoot.  No matter how I brew 
 the coffee, it tastes terribly over-extracted.  There is an
 overwhelming bitterness to it.  Have you ever ground your coffee to a
 powder, and then boiled it on your stove for about half an hour?
 That's what my Aged Java tastes like. >>

2) From: Tim Culver
<Snip>
tfisher511> Tim, I am one of the Aged Java fans. I roast it up to the
tfisher511> second crack or a little beyond, which is a dark roast by
tfisher511> my standards. I always rest it 2 days and I never, ever
tfisher511> drink it straight! I usually blend it 1/3 Aged Java with
tfisher511> 2/3 Columbian, or Costa Rican, or any mild type that
tfisher511> somewhat lacks its own distinct character. 
Thanks for the suggestion, Terry Fisher, and for the encouragement,
Terry Braun.  I have a couple of Mexican beans on hand, and I'll try
blending as you suggest.
We're having dinner guests tonight.  Shall I serve Aged Java or Kopi
Luwak?
-- 
Tim Culver
Chapel Hill, NC ... not sharing my Lerida with anyone ... press pot

3) From: Mandy Willison
<Snip>
What sort of guests?!
-bean'wild!

4) From: Tom & Maria
<Snip>
I cupped Aged Java with some other extreme coffees a few days back. I
really like it. There's actually some great dimension to the cup after you
absorb the shock of the first sip. I know there were some negative
comments, but I think if you read the review for the coffee you would be
completely prepared for what was coming. The Aged Java is a true aged
coffee, and there are rumors of "fast aged" (does that make sense?) or even
smoked coffees. I spoke with a really big name broker and she said they had
some Sumatra PWANI  aging adn it would be ready in 2 months. This really
made me suspicious ...dont think I asking for a sample from that source.
Aging is dangerous. You are allowing the coffee to degrade under supossedly
controlled circumstances. I have cupped aged coffees with absolutely no
positive cup qualities, just 100% nasty from start to finish. But a good
aged coffee can only yield about 40% nasty, 60% positive at best, but it
will hopefully strike a balance that is really interesting on the pallete.
If you read about the effects of  age on coffee chemistry in Illy's
Espresso: Chemistry of Quality, you realize how great the effect is. Fats
absorb odors, cellulose structure breaks down ...etc. It truly is a
specialty coffee if you use the definition that it is NOT for a broad
audience. I really try to stock a range of coffees. That dos not mean you
will like them all, and its still up to you to figure out your tastes in
coffee: I really wouldnt ever presume to be an expert on YOUR tastes!
I am waiting for coffee to be included in an episode of The Iron Chef. That
may be a long wait... My other great thought while cupping the new Costas
again today (with the new Panama Hartmann due in next week --milder than
previous, simple, but very nice ) is comparing coffee cupping to
curveballs, sliders, sinkers, fastballs ...I think I can make this theory
fly but its going to take a few more cups...
:-)
Tom
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
             * Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting Supplies *
                  Tom and Maria * info
                   web:http://www.sweetmarias.com

5) From: drg
Did Tom really say:
 comparing coffee cupping to
<Snip>
Please! No sports metaphors.
    Jim Gundlach
        roasting in a wok
           on a wood stove
               for the total roasting experience

6) From: Tim Culver
<Snip>
tom> I cupped Aged Java with some other extreme coffees a few days
tom> back. I really like it. There's actually some great dimension to
tom> the cup after you absorb the shock of the first sip. I know there
tom> were some negative comments, but I think if you read the review
tom> for the coffee you would be completely prepared for what was
tom> coming. [...] I
tom> have cupped aged coffees with absolutely no positive cup
tom> qualities, just 100% nasty from start to finish. But a good aged
tom> coffee can only yield about 40% nasty, 60% positive at best, but
tom> it will hopefully strike a balance that is really interesting on
tom> the pallete.  
Tom,
Thanks very much for your post.  I'm glad to hear you describe it as a
combination of nasty and nice---that's the way I was starting to think
of it.  There's a really lovely, sweet aroma, and there's also a
nasty, bitter stench.  They seem to be two separate personalities.  If
I let it rest for about a week, and I concentrate while drinking, I
can really taste the sweetness over the bitterness, and the sweet side
does remind me of Monsooned Malabar.
I hope I didn't give the impression that I was disappointed in the
Aged Java!  I think it's very interesting, and experimenting with this 
kind of thing is what I like about this hobby.  It's just that the
"nasty" aspect was so surprising, and so reminiscent of overextracted
coffee, that I figured I must have been doing something wrong
technically.  Thanks to all for your suggestions, and I'll keep
experimenting with this unusual bean!  
By the way, I settled on the Colombian Excelso decaf for the
guests.
-- 
Tim Culver
Chapel Hill, NC ... popper ... trespade ... press pot

7) From: Prabhakar Ragde
<Snip>
I'm not sure I'd look forward to this. A friend lent me two episodes
of The Iron Chef on tape (we don't receive broadcast TV) and if the
commentators know as little about coffee as they seem to about food,
it will be a painful experience. --PR

8) From: Bryce Decker
Message text written by INTERNET:homeroast
<Snip>
Dismay! If you took out the all sports metaphors, you'd eliminate a huge
chunk of the American language, and stand oblivious to its history.  There
is rich heritage there. 
 I reacted similarly yesterday to a group of healthy young folks in my
wife's workplace deciding not to drink coffee anymore because it was just
"junk food" with no obvious nutritional benefits.   What of the pleasure
you share over that cup with your friends, and the millions of others
around the globe, from slaves to kings, who also share it?   It's a link
with all the historical geography and romance of the coffee trade.  The
simple human pleasure over a cup of coffee  transcends barriers of social
class and geography and time.  It's living!
Let's hear it for coffee and sports metaphors!    -Bryce

9) From: Prabhakar Ragde
<Snip>
Thought the language was called "English". And some of us are not in
America. I second the ban on sports metaphors. I have enough trouble
with "body" and "acidity" without having to figure out what the hell
"infield fly rule" means applied to coffee. --PR
-- 
Prabhakar Ragde, Professor/Assoc Chair (Curric)    plragde
Department of Computer Science             DC 1314, (519)888-4567,x4660
Faculty of Mathematics                 Waterloo, Ontario CANADA N2L 3G1
University of Waterloo                http://plg.uwaterloo.ca/~plragde

10) From: Robert Cantor
That's when you're just starting to sip and a fly lands in your coffee.  Rather than throw the coffee, you're supposed to manuver yo
ur upper lip to keep the fly out of your mouth until a polite sip is taken, whereupon you may deftly extract the fly as you set your
cup down.  Extra points if done without fingers - either by a flick of the cup heaving the fly and less than one cc of coffee into a
safe receptacle, or with a utensil
Bob C.
rcantor

11) From: Spencer W. Thomas
Bryce Decker wrote:
<Snip>
Depends on what they're substituting for it.  If they switch to Coke, that's
even worse.  It has *negative* nutritional "benefits".
=Spencer

12) From: Steve Baragona
<Snip>
    Actually, there's some conflicting research on this.  Coffee has been linked
to stomach cancer (not trying to scare anybody, but that's what I've read), but
it also apparently contains antioxidants.  One step forward, one step back.

13) From: Ken Mary
Rancid fats and those "cooked" at a high temperature are definitely linked
to cancer. This is where homeroasting is an outstanding health *benefit*.
The coffee cannot be fresher, eliminating the rancidity. We may want to
avoid very dark roasts, assuming possible creation of carcinogens, but I
have not researched this yet, and there may be nothing to worry about. And
if coffee does have antioxidants (as tea is known to have), then drink up,
while keeping track of the caffeine of course.
--
Ken Mary - Aromaroast - whirlyblade - French Press
----------
<Snip>
<Snip>
linked
<Snip>
but
<Snip>

14) From: Ken Mary
PR,
Although you are correct in referring to the "English" language, in view of
the gross differences from the British in word meanings, pronunciations, and
spellings built up over the years, we in the USA speak "American". It is a
dialect of the English language, just as Australian and South African are.
And keep those flies out your coffee, you *know* where they have been.
--
Ken Mary - Aromaroast - whirlyblade - French Press
----------
<Snip>
<Snip>

15) From: Eric Bear Albrecht
 
At 3:48 PM -0400 5/3/00, Steve Baragona wrote:
<Snip>
Well yeah, but the headline that National Lampoon ran a few years ago 
says it all:
              "Laboratory Rats Linked to Cancer"
And then we have the colon cancer cures by way of coffee enemas.  I know four
women who will each attest that her mother was thus cured (the same mother).
So ... drink up!!
-- 
      Eric Bear Albrecht     ebear    http://www.newmex.com/ebear      Tired of the same old crap?  Note that crap, gore, and bush are all
      four-letter words.  Want to see anything change?  Vote for Nader.
      Anything else is just more insanity.  Two-party system?  HA!!

16) From: Tim Culver
<Snip>
ken> PR, Although you are correct in referring to the "English"
ken> language, in view of the gross differences from the British in
ken> word meanings, pronunciations, and spellings built up over the
ken> years, we in the USA speak "American". It is a dialect of the
ken> English language, just as Australian and South African are.
ken> And keep those flies out your coffee, you *know* where they have
ken> been.
No flies on me, mate.
-- 
Tim Culver
Chapel Hill, NC ... popper ... vegemite ... press pot

17) From: Eric Bear Albrecht
 
I thought I sent this a half a week ago ... better late than nevah.
At 4:19 PM -0400 5/3/00, Ken Mary wrote:
<Snip>
True dialects within a language are mutually unintelligible even though they
share the same grammar (structure).  British and American are not really
dialects.  Australian, on the other hand ...
;B
-- 
      Eric Bear Albrecht     ebear    http://www.newmex.com/ebear      Tired of the same old crap?  Note that crap, gore, and bush are all
      four-letter words.  Want to see anything change?  Vote for Nader.
      Anything else is just more insanity.  Two-party system?  HA!!

18) From: Mandy Willison
  British and American are not really
<Snip>
Is there any other Aussies on this list - a bit of support please! (this is
the Bear we are up against and my english is not that elequent (good)
-bean'wild!

19) From: Mike Geis

20) From: Eric Bear Albrecht
 
At 7:18 AM -0400 5/7/00, Mike Geis wrote:
<Snip>
Then there are the Kurds who have no army, navy, civil rights, etc.,
but they do have a language.  Nasrudin* was once asked if he could
teach the Kurdish language and he said sure -- and then proceeded
to sign up for lessons himself, and stayed one lesson ahead of his
student.  One day while "teaching" he said "the Kurdish word for
hot soup is 'allagash'".  The student said "how do you say cold soup?"
Nasrudin replied "You don't.  They like it hot."
Too bad I don't know the Kurdish word for hot coffee to bring this
back on topic.  I think I'll go out for coffee.  That'll have to do.
*a mythical middle-eastern character
;B
-- 
Jim Bidzos:
They have to standardize on a random number first
Lynn McNulty:
I am at a loss for a comeback on that one
Dennis Branstad:
The standard random number is 29
(1993 RSA Data Security Conference)

21) From: Tim Culver
<Snip>
mandy> Is there any other Aussies on this list - a bit of support
mandy> please! (this is the Bear we are up against and my english is
mandy> not that elequent (good) -bean'wild!
Not an Aussie myself, but I did spend a year there in the mid-1980s.
While we're on the subject, I have a question regarding the unofficial
Australian national song, Waltzing Matilda
.  A DJ on the local
student radio station claimed that "Waltzing Matilda" was an old
expression for some particular activity, possibly involving drinking.
A link from the page above, though, suggests that it means "hitting
the road with your possessions in a bag slung over your shoulder."
Any opinions from Australians or Australophiles?
-- 
Tim Culver
Chapel Hill, NC ... popper ... vegemite ... hundred-dollar bill

22) From: Mandy Willison
Tim Culver wrote:
<Snip>
This will qualify you to be one!
<Snip>
- it was an old expression for some particular activity, possibly involving
drinking. (not coffee in those days - full of chicory, cant blame the old
swaggie)
regarding "hitting the road with your possessions in a bag slung over your
shoulder."
I qualify for that as I am off to Sydney (big smoke) to check out the coffee
again - it wont be SCAA but its a lot closer and I wont need any
possessions! see ya!
-bean'wild!


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