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Topic: new Andreja (39 msgs / 736 lines)
1) From: Sue
OHHHH MY!  I must have the best brother in the world! Brown just
dropped off an Andreja Premium from SM's, as a gift from my brother!!
I have know idea what I'm doing, but I'm going to go try to find out!
I stopped reading all the espresso how to's because I never thought I
would be able to get a machine!!!! Off to play!  I would gladly take
any advice or tips!
This machine is really beautiful!

2) From: Bob Yellin
I've had one in daily use since last August and it's a winner! Ask away =
and I'll
try to answer.
Bob Yellin
unsvbscribes) go to =http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

3) From: Gary Townsend
 Sue  wrote:
Sue, that's very nice of your brother to give you such a nice machine!
Congratulations! Obvious he thinks highly of you enough to give you
one of the nicest machines a home owner can have.
1st tip...read the owners manual 2X !!!
2nd tip...read Tom's reviews and tips next !!!
Don't get discouraged, it takes a little while to get 'everything'
just right, plan on running through a # or 2 of 'regular' coffee,
before you try the 'good stuff' !!!
Enjoy your weekend...
BTW,  I just made a couple of nice shots of COE #12, enjoying a little
choclatey Americano and a nice warm sunny day in central Kansas !!!
"Not all things that are countable, count, and not all things that count,
are countable". Albert Einstien

4) From: miKe mcKoffee

5) From: Jared Andersson
Congrats on the new family member.  My best advise for learning fast
is to cut the bottom off of the portafilter.  I know you just met her
but be brave.  Second and maybe more importantly don't be afraid to
throw an off shot down the drain.  Be it bitter or sour, by just
tasting enough to figure out what you want to adjust next you will be
able to make a lot more practice shots in a sitting without becoming
uncomfortably full of caffeine.  And lastly push some shots to
extremes of grind and tamp to get a feel for the machines range.  Good
luck and congrats again.  Jared
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:33:20 -0500, Sue  wrote:

6) From: Steve
Lucky lucky lucky YOU!  Brown should be dropping off the parts I need
to PID Miss Silvy next Thursday, and while that's certainly exciting,
I'm sure it's not nearly as exciting as hefting an Andreja into the
house.  I'll probably be sticking with the Miss for a while, but I
have my sights set on Andreja if and when the time comes.  Let us know
how it goes (and pictures are always appreciated).
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:33:20 -0500, Sue  wrote:

7) From: Les
I am open to be adopted by your brother.
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:33:20 -0500, Sue  wrote:

8) From: Elliott H. O'Reilly
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Wow is right!  Nice brother.  My wife are just finishing up a complete
gutting and rebuild of our kitchen and I think the Andreja would fit in very
nicely with all the rest of the stainless steel that we have added:http://webpages.charter.net/ehore/Kitchen/New/ 
Enjoy your new toy!
Elliott O'Reilly

9) From: Bob Baker
Nice job!
Love the colors, the charcoal, red and stainless are a nice combination.
You're right you need the Andreja..
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 18:03:12 -0600, Elliott H. O'Reilly   

10) From: john kahla
Nice kitchen except dont see any stash ????? Looks like you still have
room for about 300#

11) From: John Blumel
On Mar 18, 2005, at 3:33pm, Sue wrote:
Well, since no one else has asked...
What kind of grinder are you going to be using with that?
John Blumel

12) From: Sue
Thanks for all the congrats! It is very exciting!
My brother has a Livia that he just loves. I haven't even had a chance
to speak with him and thank him yet! I don' t know how he decided on
the Andreja, maybe he spoke with Tom.  He saw the Andreja on the SM
web site and asked me about it, I thought he was just wondering how it
compared to his Livia that he got a few months back. I reminded him
that he had  more experience that I do! I He tried to pin me down as
to which machine I liked better and was saving for. He said he wanted
to buy me some cups or something to start off with. I never dreamt he
would buy me the machine!! I told him I always thought I would get the
Livia  (you know, in my dreams!) but that the Andreja sounded great
also. I told him the only good thing about not ever being able to
afford either one was that I  would never have to decide between them!

13) From: Sue
I have a machine I bought used last fall, actually bartered for. It's
a Nueva Simonelli. It's huge. Seemed to work pretty well. Definitely
better than my old whirly blade. Someone suggested I get new burrs and
I have been thinking I should as there does seem to be a little dust.
Anyway, now that I'm trying to make espresso, I really think I should
get new burrs - and figure out how to change them!
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 19:18:01 -0500, John Blumel

14) From: Dan Bollinger
Sue, Have you fired it up yet?  The Andreja is quite like my Millenium.
The most confusing thing for me about starting it up the first time was
'burping' it.  What some people call preventing an air lock. If you haven't
turned it on, the opening steps go like this:
Fill the water tank.
Turn it on.
You will hear the pump turn on and run, and run, and run. It is filling the
boiler for the first time.
While the pump is running, the heater light will switch from green to red,
meaning the heating element is on.
When the pump stops you will see the boiler pressure slowly come up to
Now comes the 'burping'.
When the gauge passes 1 bar, open the steam wand valve for 5 seconds, the
boiler pressure will drop, that's OK.
The pump will probably turn back on, topping off the water level in the
Repeat the two steps above two more times.
Let the boiler get to full pressure, the heater will turn off.
That's it!  Don't forget to add more water to the tank. enjoy, Dan
unsvbscribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

15) From: Terry Stockdale
At 02:33 PM 3/18/2005, you wrote:
"I would gladly take any advice or tips!"
Since no one else said it, "Protect yourself!  Ship it off right now before 
you fall further down that slippery slope of coffee fanaticism."  My 
address is ...
Seriously, congratulations on receiving such a wonderful present and on 
having such a thoughtful, generous brother.
Terry Stockdale -- Baton Rouge, LA
Visit my computer tips, coffee pages and forums at:http://www.terrystockdale.com

16) From: John Blumel
On Mar 18, 2005, at 7:39pm, Dan Bollinger wrote:
 From some of the sales literature I've seen, the Andreja is supposedly 
not subject to "air lock" like the Isomac's are and it, also 
supposedly, works well running off a timer -- just make sure it's a 
high wattage timer.
John Blumel

17) From: Sue
Does anyone know - the lever on the Andreja kind of has two positions
- you pull it up a little and there is kind of a stop, then you can
pull it up all the way - The pressure gage rises at the first stop,
then drops as you open it up all the way.  It's totally clear that I
have no idea what I am doing!  I pulled a few shots of espresso that
really didn't taste very good. Bitter. Then, I went to Mary's Kitchen
Port down the block and bought a can Illy thinking that, along with
poor technique, my grind  and grinder may be part of the problem.  It
does seem better with the Illy, but I still don't really know what I'm
doing! I read the instructions over,  again, but they are pretty
brief, and don't say anything about the lever positions.
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 19:47:21 -0500, John Blumel

18) From: Terry Stockdale
I think that first stop is the pre-infusion setting -- where you get the 
grounds wet and then open it up the rest of the way to brew.
At 07:16 PM 3/18/2005, you wrote:
Terry Stockdale -- Baton Rouge, LA
Visit my computer tips, coffee pages and forums at:http://www.terrystockdale.com

19) From: Sue
Thanks Terry, I think I've read something about pre-infusion in the
past. I'll look into it more.
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 19:53:32 -0600, Terry Stockdale

20) From: Gary Bennett
Let me qualify this by saying that I don't have an Andreja, but I do
have a lever machine.
Whilst brewing I never keep the lever in the middle position. Mine is
down for off and up for brewing.
I'm guessing that at least some of the bitterness is due to a too-high
brewing temperature. With HX machines you need to flush water through
the group to get the temp down. The water in your shot comes through a
pipe in the middle of the boiler and so the first 10-15 ounces of
water is usually too hot. People have conducted extensive trials on
the temp coming through the group and there are a few methods that
people use to get to the right temp. In my case I run enough water
through the brew head to fill two 7 oz latte glasses. Once done, I
pull the first shot. It's not scientific, and it may not even be
accurate, but it is repeatable.
Hope that's a start.
Regards, Gary
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:16:24 -0500, Sue  wrote:

21) From: John Blumel
On Mar 18, 2005, at 8:16pm, Sue wrote:
I think it works like the Millenium. If you lift the lever part way up, 
it dumps the water from the grouphead onto the puck. When you lift it 
all the way, the pump will come on and the pressure should start to 
build. The Millenium doesn't have a grouphead pressure gauge but I 
believe I've heard Tea (which does) owners state that it takes 
somewhere around 8 seconds for the pressure to build to 9 bars -- 
that's the built in pre-infusion period. (I'm not sure which pressure 
gauge you are referring to.)
You can use the two positions to experiment with different pre-infusion 
times, although, I think most Isomac owners have not found much of a 
difference from extending the pre-infusion and lifting the lever all 
the way up in one motion seems to work just as well. The Andreja could 
be different.
I'll just throw out a bunch of other things and I'm sure others can add 
to these or offer differing opinions...
You do need to let the machine warm up for at least half an hour before 
using it -- an hour is better.
You don't mention what tamper you are using and, if it's one of those 
plastic things that espresso machines often come with, get a good 58mm 
tamper as soon as you can.
A lot of people use their bathroom scale to practice tamping with 30-35 
pounds of pressure until they get a feel for it.
If the grinder is old you might need new burrs for it.
If the machine has been idling for more than 15 minutes beteen shots, 
you should draw about 6-8 oz. of water through the grouphead to cool it 
off, otherwise the temperature will be very stable and you don't need 
to wait between shots.
Also, most people seem to prefer the shots from the double filter 
baskets and the E-61 doubles like to be filled so that the puck swells 
into contact with the shower head during the shot -- to the top of the 
ridge, around 18g, on average.
It's important to fill the basket as evenly as possible so that you 
don't get spots in the puck where channeling will develop easily and 
it's also important to get a level tamp. Do a light leveling tamp 
first, then, after releasing the pressure but before lifting the 
tamper, spin the tamper around to break the adhesion with the grounds. 
Tapping the portafilter with the top of the tamper to loosen the 
grounds off the sides of the basket (above the puck) seems to have 
fallen out of favor but I haven't find that it makes a noticeable 
difference as long as you do it with a light touch. On the other hand, 
it doesn't really hurt anything to not do it. Then do your 30-35 pound 
tamp, making sure to keep the puck level and then spin it again to 
break the adhesion with the grounds
Adjust the grind until, with your consistent 30-35 pound tamp, you get 
2 - 2.5 oz. of espresso in 25 seconds but, if the stream turns light 
and/or gets twisty, end the shot immediately.
John Blumel

22) From: Sue
I'll give that a try, thanks for the tip Gary!
On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 13:00:44 +1100, Gary Bennett  wrote:

23) From: Sue
Wow! Thanks John!
Turns out my brother Bill originally ordered A Livia, but it was out
of stock. Derek called him and suggested the Andreja. The accessories
were mailed separately and were shipped before the order was changed. 
The tamper I have is 57.5mm - for the Livia!  I didn't think .5mm
would matter, but I think it does. A little bit of coffee pushes up
the side of the basket.
Hmmmmmmmmmmm..... I wonder if I still have a bathroom scale?
I was just looking for replacement burrs. I guess my grinder is
actually a Rossi RR45 made by Nuova Simonelli.
I'll try all of your suggestions, it is really helpful for an extreme beginner!
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 21:09:16 -0500, John Blumel

24) From: John Blumel
On Mar 18, 2005, at 9:09pm, John Blumel wrote:
... also...
If you haven't read Jim Schulman's Insanely Long Water FAQ. it's well 
worth reading:
  http://tinyurl.com/5e6zoIt's a good idea to leave your "blank" basket (the one for 
backflushing) loaded in one of your portafilters and use it to rinse 
the grouphead off between shots. You can do this by putting the 
portafilter with the blank loosely into the grouphead and lifting the 
lever like you would to pull a shot. Stop it when water starts coming 
out around the sides of the portafilter. Dump the water from the blank 
and repeat once.
After I finished pulling shots, I use a paper towel to wipe any 
residual grounds from the grouphead. I wipe off the blank portafilter 
and the drip tray screen to wet the towel a bit and then stuff it up 
into the groove between the grouphead sides and the shower screen and 
run it around there once and then wipe the screen. This usually picks 
up a small amount of grounds from the gasket and shower screen. But, be 
careful if you do this because the grouphead is HOT and you can easily 
burn your fingers,
John Blumel

25) From: John Blumel
On Mar 18, 2005, at 9:31pm, Sue wrote:
I don't have a metric ruler handy to measure one of mine but I believe 
all the tampers are slightly under size. Your tamper is probably fine 
and it's normal for some grounds to end up stuck to the sides of the 
basket above the puck. I think I mentioned this in my first reply.
John Blumel

26) From: Elliott H. O'Reilly
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
John, the roasting and stash was relegated to the basement even though the
range hood has a 1200cfm roof mounted blower to handle the indoor grill
which would definitely handle the smoke.  Occasionally we have to make small
concessions to the wife so I had to work my roasterie into my
destroy-it-yourself work area.  It's here that I plot ideas like using my
gas 2-cycle power drill with paint mixer auger to make whipped potatoes if
my DW hadn't let me get that 475 HP (I mean watt) KitchenAid mixer:http://webpages.charter.net/ehore/Coffee/ 

27) From: Dan Bollinger
Sue, Gary is right. Disregard the middle position, it is for an extra,
manual pre-infusion. Just lift the lever all the way up for brewing, you'll
still get about 8 seconds of pre-infusion, since this is a built in feature
of the E-61 grouphead the Andreja uses.
I've found, and others like Jim Schulman, that a 6 ounce 'flush' is all
that's required if it has been more than 20 minutes since the last time you
made an espresso shot.
Buying a can of Illy is a smart idea. It takes one variable out of the
beginner's equation. Don't expect too much crema from it, though.
hope this helps, Dan

28) From: Sue
Oh I see. I guess I did miss that the first time around!

29) From: Bob Yellin
Yes the lever does have two positions, or three, really. Straight down =
and it's
closed down. The middle position allows some water through - a kind of
pre-infusion - but the water is not pumped through or under pressure. The=
or up position activates the pump.
The main thing here is that you don't need the middle position. The way =
E-61, HX works, the preinfusion is sort of "automatic". You can tell that=
is happening because no significant flow comes out of the PF for the =
first 6 to
8 seconds while the pump is building up pressure. I hope I explained that=
 in an
understandable way. I'm dancing around too technical and not technical =
But the bottom line is - push the lever all the way up to pull the shot =
forget about the middle position.
Bob Yellin

30) From: John Blumel
On Mar 18, 2005, at 11:13pm, Sue wrote:
Yes, well, don't forget to get some sleep over the next couple of days, 
if you can.
John Blumel

31) From: Sue
O.K. I see. 
Don't worry about not being technical enough - this all very, very new
to me!  I really appreciate everyones help. I'm sure I will have many
questions coming up here! Thank you all for teaching Remedial Espresso
99. Maybe I'll graduate to 101 soon!
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 23:20:11 -0500, Bob Yellin  wrote:

32) From: Sue
know what a true espresso buzz feels like!  :)
On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 23:28:25 -0500, John Blumel

33) From: Sue
I need to make myself stay away from the computer for awhile also! I
should have been studying more last night. I need to go over to the
local college to take a test today, and just couldn't stay away from
the espresso machine and the computer! I'm taking an open course, you
know, where you are supposed to be disciplined enough to do your work
on your own in a timely manner!  Sue
On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 09:11:02 -0500, Sue  wrote:

34) From: Dennis Parham
HAHAHA!!  yea... I remember that BUZZZZZZZZZZ.. um...everyday!! lol  
tell me.. have yo had an Americano???  its kinda my drink of choice!  I =
have a pasquini Livia... and being it has similar boiler setup and 
capacity (little bigger water reservoir, little smaller boiler 1.5L vs. =
your 1.6L) I can get about 2 cups 200 water from the hot water tap 
then grind/dose/tamp/load portafilter then I slide the cup up under it =
(2 maybe 3  mins.... water still 195) pull shot into cup..leaves =
of crema on top (if it is a high crema coffee)  let it sit until about =
185 then start enjoying!!!   maybe try this with your new machine!!
I do a 10oz. 200 water and pull a triple 2.5-3oz. shot on top.... 
YUMMMY!!!! )))
Dennis Parham
On Mar 19, 2005, at 8:11 AM, Sue wrote:

35) From: Sue
O.K. back from taking my exam, time to play again!  The BUZZZZZZZZZ is
wearing off so I'll go try your method Dennis. I love a good Americano
also! Now I just have to learn how to make them well!
On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 09:02:32 -0600, Dennis Parham  wrot=
ribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>

36) From: John Blumel
On Mar 19, 2005, at 1:56pm, Sue wrote:
Notice that Sue doesn't seem to care how she did on her exam.
John Blumel

37) From: Sue
Ohhh, I think I did pretty good. I hope. Actually, I wish college was
this easy  the first time I went through it!  If I only knew then what
I know now!!!  I shouldn't say that.... I still have a way to go! This
time the hard part is coming up with the money and the time.
Dennis, the Americano is pretty good. I think I'm geting a little
better with each shot I pull!  I used some of the Brazil - lot 141
this time.
I just can't say enough about these Brazils - they are all great! 
On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 14:15:39 -0500, John Blumel

38) From: Dennis Parham
Try the Bolivian Organic!!!! )))) YUMM!!!
Dennis Parham
On Mar 19, 2005, at 2:02 PM, Sue wrote:

39) From: Ben Treichel
Elliott H. O'Reilly wrote:
Nice! I especially like the simplicity of the flat front drawers, since 
everything else is so plush/lavish that are a great counterpoint.

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