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Topic: 5min. City plus tasting green (6 msgs / 154 lines)
1) From:
Hey, that caught my attention!  I've only been roasting for a month or so, and I'm sure I've been asking the same questions over and over again, so please forgive me.
But, that seems to be my problem when I try to do a light city roast.  I am now using an air popcorn popper (Popcorn Pumper to be exact) and I would love to know how to do a light City roast, that takes more than 5 minutes, and does not taste green.  Every time I roast the coffee to the point where it does not taste green, it is no longer a light city roast.  ARGHHH!!

2) From: AlChemist John
Somehow you are going to need to stretch out your roast time.  In general 
you can do this a number of simple ways (or LOTS of complicated 
ways:-).  Try a couple and see how much longer you can get your 
roast.  Tilt your popper up 1-2".  Putting a 2x4 under the back is about 
right.  That will change the circulation pattern of your fluidized bed, 
give you more air flow, and a resulting lower ramp profile, thus a  longer 
roast.  Also, depending on how much of a change that makes, you can also 
reduce the amount of coffee you are roasting.  Again, the less coffee you 
have in there, the less heat is trapped and the longer the roast time.  I 
also recommend getting a thermometer in there is you don't have one 
yet.  It really helps to let you gauge where exactly you are in the 
roast.  You can a nice light city roast that is not green nor baked by 
having 1st crack at 8-9 minutes, and then roasting another 2-3 minutes, 
trying to make sure your temperature does not increase more than about 
30-40 F from 1st crack to the end of the roast (50 F would bring you to 
about 2nd crack and a nice "City+" or so).
Sometime around 04:41 4/8/2005, matt633 typed:
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--
John Nanci 
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.dreamsandbones.net/blog/http://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

3) From: miKe mcKoffee
Good answer Alchemist. This type of post was exactly my reason for 
re-posting "effects of roast profiles" with "especially for air roasting" 
subject preface. There had been two posts in a row from different people 
with the same question. In hindsight could have additionally gone into a 
bunch of low tech methods of slowing a roast. My intent was information on 
the why not the how. In the first preface paragraph I said "How you control 
your roaster/popper is up to you." Then followed with "The better the 
control, the better able to adjust for different beans, ambient temps, batch 
size, mains voltage
variation etc." Seemed the feedback focus was only on the last sentence 
scaring newbies "My opinion and that of a number of other experienced air 
roasters is separate variable heater & fan control the best most flexible 
option."
I sometimes forget that although I roast using dual boost variable voltage 
controlled split wired Caffe' Rosto I also routinely use a 1.5" tilt 
(chunk-o-2x4) and slight rocking early on (needed when doing 1/2# or larger 
batches). Also use variable exhaust heat re-circulation at times in cooler 
ambients, not a fixed inserted piece of foil like Tom shows as an example on 
Rosto tip page and sometimes heater toggle if roast starts to go too fast. 
Never toggling more than 5sec off at a time and used for quicker slow down 
method after slightly dropping voltage to heater which drops heating element 
output faster than waiting for a volt or two reduction to take effect. Don't 
won't an actual heat drop while roasting but heat slowed.
I believe based on what I've observed and learned that green tasting lighter 
City roasts (or especially Cinnamon) can result from going too fast in 
either early tanning stage (coming up to 300f when beans start changing 
from green to tan) and/or too fast from start of 1st to end of roast, 
minimum 2:30 to 3min needed depending on bean. If going Full City or darker 
it isn't as critical. (For instance take it fast to Vienna looking on the 
outside and likely more like Full City when ground because inner part of 
bean much lighter than outer.) Take a City roast too fast and it's City on 
the outside and still a bit green on the inside and hence a problem.
Good beginner method to ensure fully roasted is go to first snap of 2nd and 
kill the roast IMO. (Though most of my roasts are lighter than that now.) My 
first year roasting with stock Caffe' Rosto I struggled with lighter roasts, 
often getting the "green taste". While longer rest helped reduce the green 
taste, it wasn't the real solution. Wasn't until I could control the roast 
that lighter roasts where no longer a problem. I've done a couple of very 
light cinnamon roasts with zero green taste but have determined it's really 
lighter roast than I like.
Another very good method for a beginner is just get a HotTop. It's designed 
with decent profile(s) enabling lighter roasts without a steep learning 
curve. But for those who want to go as cheap as possible the trade off is a 
learning and tweaking curve.
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer etc.http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmFrom: "AlChemist John" 
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 6:10 AM
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4) From: Justin Marquez
On Apr 8, 2005 10:11 AM, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
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Mike - What exactly is a cinnamon roast?  Where does it fit in with
first crack occurence and with temperature?
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (Snyder, TX)http://www.justinandlinda.com Deja Moo: The feeling that you've heard this bull before.

5) From: miKe mcKoffee
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From: "Justin Marquez" 
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 8:16 AM
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Cinnamon (or American IRRC) roast is lighter than City, the lightest roast 
considered fullest roasted. Exactly what finish temp is hard to say, depends 
on temp measuring but I'd say 415 to 420f, about 20f after start of 1st. 
Gotta really take the ramp slow to not have a "green tasting" Cinnamon 
roast. (like 4min from 395 to 420f and tanning stage also critical)
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer etc.http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htm

6) From: AlChemist John
Sometime around 08:32 4/8/2005, miKe mcKoffee typed:
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 start 
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 critical)
And if you really want to know if you have  a Cinnamon roast down, do an 
aged bean or something like Monsooned Malabar - you will KNOW if you have 
it right.  I remember introducing Les to some Cinnamon roasted aged Sumatra=
 
- wow what an ugly but flavorful cup.
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http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>
--
John Nanci 
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.dreamsandbones.net/blog/http://www.chocolatealchemy.com/


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