HomeRoast Digest

Topic: Now, THAT's Sumatra! (16 msgs / 402 lines)
1) From: Rick Carragher
I've really been struggling with Sumatra.  I know the bean's good, I
know that I like it, but my popper roasts have really been not good -
lots of grassy flavors, even with 3 or 4 days of rest.  After reading
this list and other sources, I decided that profiling is the solution.
I'm only 25% of the way towards my PC-controlled popcorn popper, but
last night I was able to do my first roast with separate heat and fan
control.  The fan is on a dimmer (thanks to some OT help from Mike
McK), and the heater is controlled by the fancy use of my thumb.  I
attempted a very unaccurate profile that I had seen on this list
room-260 ASAP
260-290 3min
290-380 3min
380-410 2min
I took the Sumatra into the first few snaps of 2nd, turned the heater
off, cranked the fan all the way up for cooling.
This morning, I tried some non-profiled Sumatra against this
new-fangled fancy roasted Sumatra, via 2 batches of press.  Very
notable differences!  The grassy, uncooked sharpness was much more
muted (alas, it was not gone yet, think some rest will help that).
I'm sure that once I get even better control of the profiles, the
quality will improve further still.  Man, this is so much fun.
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2) From: Dan Bollinger
Most people, myself included, like the Sumatras best when they are taken to
Full City at a rolling 2nd crack.  You will leave the City Roast grassy
flavors behind. Dan
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3) From: MMore
Isn't 410 a little low for the high end of been temp?  I think you might end 
up "baking" it a bit at that temp, leading some to that grassy taste?
Michael A. Roaster of Vienna, Va.

4) From: miKe mcKoffee
Guess I'm not "most people".  I prefer Sumatra to just the barest touch of 
2nd if 2nd at all. (And I know neither is AlChemist into darker into 2nd 
Sumatra roasts.) Sure one way to ensure not having a grassy roast is simply 
roast dark well into 2nd. That is not the ONLY way or the way if you prefer 
more pronounced varietal characteristics versus roast taste. The biggest 
keys to not having a grassy lighter roast IMO are long enough equilization 
drying ramp (pre 300f) and long enough developement stage (through 1st to 
end of roast). Don't need no deep into 2nd crack to get rid-o-da grass!
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer etc.http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmFrom: "Dan Bollinger" 
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 8:56 AM

5) From: miKe mcKoffee
Excellent point, duh! If that 410f was anything close to the real bean temp 
it is highly likely indeed very light, likely Cinnamon East Coast American, 
and would take a good 3&1/2 to 4min from start of 1st to 410f to ensure 
fully roasted throughout the bean.
BTW Rick, about what temp did 1st start? About how long from start of 1st to 
end of roast?
Will ship tomorrow, + feedback left. Thanks!
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer etc.http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmFrom: 
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 9:07 AM

6) From: Dan Bollinger
Mike, we've known that for a long time.  ;)
Tom suggests Full City+ for all the Sumatras, with some anywhere between
City and Full City+.

7) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
I also find Sumatra coffee amoung my favorites, but I'm now confused 
over your end-roast point, Dan.
Rick says he takes it to the first few snaps of second, which in Tom's 
pictorial is called Full City +.
Rolling 2nd crack would be called Vienna, one step darker, not Full 
City, which is one step lighter.
I usually end mine at Vienna.
Dave S.
Dan Bollinger wrote:

8) From: Tom Ulmer
I think it would depend on what Sumatran you're roasting. If it's along =
line of a Gayo Mountain or "Sumatra Lite" or you prefer you are =
on... but if we're talking about an ugly, musty, big, heavy bean...
obviously naturally processed with plenty of remnant fruit... now that =
good drying and development AND a rolling second... still lots of =

9) From: Rick Carragher
That profile I used, I assumed that there was no ramping necessary
after 410F, so I stopped modulating the heat and just let the roast go.
 I stopped the roast in the first few snaps of 2nd, and the
thermocouple (attached to a digital multi-meter) read 450F.
According to my TC, 1st crack was about 395F.  From start of 1st to end
was about 2 minutes (roughly, can't remember exactly).
--- miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
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10) From: Ken Mary
This is unusual for me, having to agree 100% with someone. :-)
In my old popper roasts and present drum roasts, even a few snaps of second
means that I have gone past the sweet spot. Especially for Sumatra
Mandheling which has little enough brightness as it is, the lighter roasts
are more "balanced".
My drum roasts average 9 to 12 minutes to first, stabilizing for a few
minutes at just below first crack temp (about 180C). This ramp drastically
reduces the number of pops and I often hear no first crack. I usually finis=
at city to city+ level 3 to 5 minutes after the initial pop of first or
after crossing 190C. I am not saying this is the best profile, still
learning the limitations of the equipment.
No comment on grass since I apparently lack those receptors.

11) From: Wandering Curmudgeon
I'm sitting in the lounge with about 50 people reading over my shoulder.
I'm sucking on a Cafe Crema made from Sumatra that is about perfect.
One of the stunning things about this cruise is the exceptional coffee
quality at all the espresso stations.  These beans were very dark but
without a hint of oil.   They keep their beans in the freezer in vacuum
packs and they seem to stay very fresh.   Carolyn says I can bring Jana
 home with me if she can bring our Russian waiter - so I
John - wandering up to the Lido deck to eat AGAIN!  This has been a 10
pound run for sure!
On Tue, 2005-05-03 at 11:26 -0500, Maryann & Dave Schellenberg wrote:

12) From: Philip Keleshian
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

13) From: Wandering Curmudgeon
  This was the Carnival Fun Ship "Elation" and I was totally blown away
by the superior quality of the espresso!  It is without doubt the best
commercial shot I've had.  And the incredible blond that pulled them
really knew her trade.  She knew a great deal about coffee and coffee
art.  I was all for bringing her home and opening a shop but my wife
didn't seem to accept the thought. The brewed coffee that was served at
our meals was passable but not memorable.  Each night I had a couple of
double espressos when the rest of the table was having desert - and
these were of good quality and very pleasant.   
John - waiting for the floor to quit moving
On Tue, 2005-05-03 at 11:37 -0700, Philip Keleshian wrote:

14) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
Now I *really* regret not trying the espresso on the Elation.
That was probably the one time I would have been able to try an espresso 
that some of you guys on the list  have tried and consider good! I don't 
make espresso at home, and am extremely unlikely to ever spend CD$1,000 
to set up a home espresso bar, but I do try out espresso drinks on 
occasion after a concert or theatre evening. I still have no basis for 
Actually, while on the Elation in February, I was too busy testing their 
Margaritas to think about testing the espresso!
I can tell you they were good.
Now I'm trying to duplicate them at home, with 100% blue agave tequila I 
bought in Mexico, and Grand Marnier and the bitter limes we get here in 
I watched a TV show called Spirit Basics, which said to never, never use 
a mix for Margaritas, but I suspect they did use a mix on the Elation.
I somehow have to get rid of that bitterness from these limes.
Dave S.
Wandering Curmudgeon wrote:

15) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
I cannot believe the coincidence! When I read '199' I had to dig out my 
guest card to see what cabin we were in - U199!
I wonder if you noticed the smell that would sometimes come out of the 
vent - smelled like curry to me.
My brother was next door, and never had the smell problem.
 From memory, I think the Drama bar was just aft of the casino - if so, 
that is where we listened to a jazz group.
I could have been having an espresso with my jazz!
We had some pretty moving floors the last few days of our cruise - the 
wind was up to where they were putting warning signs on the doors to the 
upper deck about the strong winds. I loved going outside at night to see 
the stars, way more southern sky than I've had the priviledge to see 
before, but the wind was real strong at the bow on almost every night.
Dave S.
Wandering Curmudgeon wrote:

16) From: John Abbott
Wow!  Small world - all the cabins and we shared one.  No smells though.
Our Steward, Mohamed, really stayed on top of things.  I couldn't
believe how quickly they smoothed out our room every time we were gone
for more than 5 minutes.   We were assigned table 291 in the Inspiration
dinning room and had an all Slavic wait team - so I got to try to
remember my Russian and Romanian. We did more laughing  than
We had absolutely perfect weather and calm to moderate seas the whole
trip until the last night and we really vibrated our way back into
Galveston - we were in the shipping lane and crossing lots of wakes.
Yep that's where the white piano was and there were three Polish girls
who played classics every night; two on violin and one of course on the
piano.  The gal in the bar had the brightest and warmest smile on the
ship.  I'd just hold up my fingers to tell her how many ounces I wanted
and it was right there.  Looking at my Sign & Sail receipt I drank a LOT
of coffee.
John - loving life in the slow lane
On Fri, 2005-05-06 at 23:30 -0500, Maryann & Dave Schellenberg wrote:

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