HomeRoast Digest


Topic: My new SC/TO...modded and roasting! (35 msgs / 1036 lines)
1) From: Ron Feroni
Just want to say thanks to all those on the list that helped me with the 
links for the SC/TO mods.  Mods are completed and first roast(post mod) was 
just done with some papau new guinea.  Roasted 210 gms. to a nice city, 
city+ roast.  First crack was around 9min.  I then backed off the heat and 
let it go for another couple minutes.  Didn't want to get into second.  I 
have no temp. guage yet so going by sight, smell.
Back to the SC/TO.  I love it!  It waaaaaay beats the popper I was using!  I 
did all the popular mods with some tweaking of each, which I'll post later 
but explain now....
For the stirring rod I canned the original and bought a piece of 3/16" steel 
rod and bent it using a vice and ball pean hammer till I got it just right.  
Took about 2hrs. of bending/testing to get it to where the stirring arm will 
NOT get hung up.  It stirs continuously now with no probems(and thats with 
almost a pound of greens!)
I did the aluminum spacer mod with chaff removal opening.  I did it a little 
different than shown tho.  Instead of creating a gap with the overlap of the 
aluminum, I just cut a sort of 'tab' in the aluminum ring and bent the tab 
inside the SC.  This 'tab' makes a channel where the chaff comes out.  Only 
done the one roast but so far it works perfect.  If you go this route be 
VERY careful while cutting/bending as the aluminum is pretty thin after its 
been cut and will want to snap.  Once cut and the ring is made tho this is 
not an issue.  One thing I want to do is seal the TO to the aluminum spacer 
better tho.  I am going to get some of that fireplace insulating type 'rope' 
that is used for fireplace doors and set in over the aluminum spacer.  This 
should work perfect.
Steel shaft mod.  Here is what I did.  I took the 1/4" x 2" long hex bolt 
and JB welded it into the 1/4" drive 7/16" socket.  Once set-up, I then took 
a 1/4" drive 1/2" socket and placed it upside down on top of the socket that 
the bolt is welded too.  This second socket 'centers' the whole shaft.  It 
fits perfectly into the SC bean pan hole with the perfect amount of socket 
sticking out of the hole.  I then put on a 1/4" normal sized washer.  Put on 
my homemade stirring arm.  Put a slotted washer over the stirring arm to 
hold in place(per mod directions), then cranked on a nut.  This part is 
where only time will tell.  By cranking down the nut there is now pressure 
pulling 'up' on the JB weld.  JB weld is some strong stuff but with the high 
temps and what not we shall see what happens.  I then made the copper cap to 
protect everything a little better.
Now all I have to get is some sort of temp guage so I can better control the 
roasts and I will be set for a long time I hope!
Thanks again to all that helped and if anyone needs info on the modding part 
I can do my best to help.  As for roasting I'm a newbie, so will be some 
time before I can help anyone with the roasting aspects of the SC/TO.
Ron
PS.  ..I meant to say I did the steel shaft mod this way as now the whole 
thing can be just plucked right out of the SC.  No need to pull off the 
bottom SC pan.  When pouring the beans out of the SC the copper cap comes 
off, but the steel shaft will not come out unless you tip it much past 90*, 
so its not a problem if anyone was wondering....

2) From: Ron Feroni
One thing I forgot to ask....anyone come up with a use for the unused nice 
glass bowl for the TO or the plastic bowl for the SC?
Ron
<Snip>

3) From: Tom Bellhouse

4) From: Demian Ebert
Ron-
Thanks for the information. I was about to post a question about the
stirring rod modifications. I've been fiddling with my SC all afternoon and
couldn't seem to get the adjustments right to keep it from binding up. It
was having issues moving 1/2 lb around let alone a pound. I'd been using a
washer combo mod for the drive shaft that required I take the whole silly
thing apart each time to make any adjustments. I like your method, so I jus=
t
epoxied the socket to the bolt. Tomorrow, I'll put the whole thing back
together and see if I can get the stirring arms to work properly. What sort
of shape did you end up creating for the stirring rod you made? I'll try to
use the stock one if at all possible.
I can't seem to get a 1/4" drive, 1/2" socket to fit over the bolt, but a
12mm 3/8 drive seems to fit fine. THis is a great solution to keeping the
shaft centered.
Thanks again
Demian

5) From: Woody DeCasere
as i am waiting for my TO to come in can yopu sll post pics to a website or
something?
thanks
On 2/25/06, Demian Ebert  wrote:
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"Good night, and Good Coffee"

6) From: Scot Murphy
On |Feb 25, at 3:41 PM|Feb 25, Ron Feroni wrote:
<Snip>
You know, you CAN still use the TO to roast chicken. :)
Scot "but wait, there's more" Murphy
---------------
"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe  
they are free."
	-- JOHANN WOLFGANG VON GOETHE

7) From: Aaron
You know, you CAN still use the TO to roast chicken.  :)
=======
Oh great, so now Coffee is going to 'taste like chicken' too now?

8) From: Michael Stock
So, I'm putting together an SC/TO as well, actually it works great.  But, a=
s
expected, the plastic shaft connecting the motor to the agitation arm is no=
t
holding up to well to 500 F temps, and needs to be replaced.  Is there a wa=
y
to remove it withou destroying the shaft?
--mike
On 2/25/06, Aaron  wrote:
<Snip>

9) From: Tom Bellhouse
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Mike, here's a page:http://www.bish.ws/coffee/TurboCrazy.htmlI did like this guy did, and just replaced the plastic with a washer and =
nut.  I had the copper doodad on but it kept falling into the strainer =
when I dumped the roast, so I left it off and all's been OK.  Like this =
guy, I left the SC heater intact and control temps with the switch on =
the TO.  I did the collar modification shown here:http://turbocrazy.atspace.com/index_files/project.htmThat mod is really a must.  Otherwise you'd have a cyclone of burning =
chaff embers inside, and even more smoke!
Looking and listening around, I'm more and more convinced that the SC/TO =
was the best way for me to get into roasting,  I can roast up to a =
pound, although about a half pounds seems optimal.  I can see right into =
the roasting process and watch the beans evolve (or watch them be =
intelligently designed.)   I can do consecutive roasts with no problem, =
so if I'm getting together a sample pack gift for a friend I can do half =
a dozen roasts of different beans in a couple of hours and present them =
in the afternoon.  Pretty nifty!
Hope your experience is as positive as mine.  I'm now drinking the best =
coffee I ever ..., etc! 
Best regards,
Tom in GA

10) From: Michael Dhabolt
Tom,
<Snip>
(or watch them be intelligently designed.) <
LMAO.  Love seeing a sense of humor,  It's been getting too serious
around here recently.
Mike (just plain)

11) From: Michael Stock
It seems milage varies with the Stir Crazy.  I was having issues getting th=
e
old plastic shaft out.  Basically there's a 1" washer like thing built into
mine that makes it pretty much impossible to take off without removing the
bottom of the SC.  The bottom appears to just be held on by 2 bolts, which =
I
undid, but I still can't get it to come off, and don't want to force it too
much.  Finally I just took a drill to it and it broke in half so I could ge=
t
it out.  This does mean that if my metal shaft doesn't work, I can't put th=
e
old plastic one back, but I'm pretty sure it'll be fine.
Next I discovered that the 7/16 socket was too big to fit through the hole
that the motor plugs into.  The motor has a 1/4" square drive which fits
great into a normal 1/4 drive socket (just like reported).  But, this drive
goes through a hole in the plastic bottom into the upper part of the SC.
the lower hole was too small for the 7/16 socket to fit through it, and the
drive shaft on the motor didn't extend through the hole enough for the
socket to sit on top of the hole.  Since the bottom is just plastice, I
expanded the hole with a drill and some sand paper (a dremel would have bee=
n
easier/better, but it's currently 250 south of me, and I'm not gonna buy a
new one when I have a perfectly good dremel who's only fault is mislocation=
)
I'll post pics of everything when I get it all done, including the broken
plastic shaft.
--mike
I'm making the agitation arm with copper or brass piping (It looks like
brass).
On 3/1/06, Michael Dhabolt  wrote:
<Snip>

12) From: Tom Bellhouse
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Mike,
All I did was take of the plastic nut/cover that screwed onto the shaft =
and replace it with a 10c washer and nut from the hardware store.  The =
shaft on my unit is metal, and the (evidently plastic) bushing around =
the shaft that sticks up maybe 3/4" above floor level is holding up just =
fine too.  If that develops a problem over time, I'll just smear on a =
coating of a high-temp slilcone.  Anyway, I didn't have to take anything =
apart.
Maybe my model SC is diferent, and the metal shaft was just good luck?
Tom in GA

13) From: Alchemist John
I will start off with a "good job", then move quickly to something 
you may want to look into.  I am rather surprised no one has said anything yet.
It is my understanding you do not want copper in your roasting area - 
it is toxic.  Very toxic.  Just like you don't want to use any 
galvanized metals as zinc is just about as bad.
Otherwise, happy roasting.
At 13:18 2/25/2006, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

14) From: Ron Feroni
oooooh, thats not good.  not sure what the sockets are made of, or the bolt. 
  Standard steel bolts and washers.  I know they are not stainless steel 
tho...maybe I should hunt down all stainless steel stuff.....
Ron
<Snip>

15) From: sean
Just curious - don't know the answer...at what level is copper toxic?  Like
would you have to ingest the copper fitting, or is it micrograms...and would
it be accelerated by the heat?  
Most/All of our water runs through copper, not at the temps that coffee is
roasting, but in many houses, copper is the main transport medium...scary to
think you could be poisoning yourself 3/4lb at a time.
Sean M. Cary
Major USMC
Tempus Fugit - Memento Mori

16) From: sean
http://www.drlwilson.com/articles/copper_toxicity_syndrome.htmOuch - symptoms don't sound like fun, schizophrenia, hair loss, fatigue...
Sean M. Cary
Major USMC
Tempus Fugit - Memento Mori

17) From: sean
So I googled my own answer.
CAUSES
Copper is a heavy metal that is toxic in the unbound form. Almost all of the
copper in the body is bound to proteins, thereby reducing the concentration
of unbound copper ions to almost zero. Most diets contain enough copper (2-5
mg) to prevent a deficiency and not enough to cause toxicity. The World
Health Organization (WHO) suggests that 10-12 mg per day may be the upper
safe limit for consumption. If as little as 2 grams of copper salt are
ingested, usually with suicidal intent, the resulting copper-induced
hemolytic anemia and kidney damage are generally fatal.http://www.moondragon.org/health/disorders/coppertox.htmlReading this I remember when we had a septic tank in So Fla and would use a
Copper Salt to prevent root growth, and hearing stories of un kind neighbors
driving copper nails into trees to kill them...
Sean M. Cary
Major USMC
Tempus Fugit - Memento Mori

18) From: Aaron
If copper is so toxic then I present this arguement.
Why are the most sought after and expensive pans for cooking made of 
copper.  Many of the top notch chefs use it too.
Why do breweries use copper and distilleries use copper for the 
distillation if it is so toxic?
Aluminum would be a lot cheaper, but we won't go there, and then there's 
the suspected altzheimers (sp) link with that.
If you burn it the fumes might be bad for you but I think just like most 
everything else, in everyday use, it really poses no hazard.
Aaron

19) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
Reminds me of the days when I was about 10 years old, and received the 
requested chemistry kit for Christmas.
If I recall correctly, one of the experiments was about watching 
crystals grow.
There were chunks of copper sulfate in the kit, which I proceeded to 
grind to powder (mortar & pestle?).
This produced some dust, which was in the air I was breathing.
Strangely, I got a severe headache after doing this, and was reluctant 
to touch the copper sulfate again.
Dave S.
----- Do they still give chemistry kits to children? ----
sean wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.1.1/272 - Release Date: 3/1/2006

20) From: TERRY TITSWORTH
Regarding the use of copper in pots and pans, all the items I have seen
are 'tinned'. This is to reduce the chance of verdigris from the foods
acids reacting to the copper. Verdigris is the green stuff that you will
see 'growing' around copper rivets in leather items. 
As far as the use of copper around other items, I much rather have it
than the lead pipes we use to have delivering our water to our
residence.
Regarding the issue of copper toxin, hot vs cold, I don't know if it
makes much of a difference. 
Terry T

21) From: Greg C. Rose
I really doubt that if your roaster includes a little copper cap that you 
are in significant danger.  In order for the copper to actually reach you it 
would first need to be leached out (usually by an acidic solution).  Coffee 
might be acidic, but probably not enough to eat away at copper.  In terms of 
electronegativity, aluminum is by far more reactive than copper, and I don't 
hear any whirly-pop users proclaim that their coffee dissolves the roaster.
Furthermore, you are not going to generate much for fumes by heating copper 
in this device either.  Your not even halfway to its melting point while 
roasting coffee.
Copper is a biocide, especially in a salt like copper sulfate.  We are 
working with the elemental form which is much less readily absorbed by the 
body.
-Greg
In the process of constructing my own SC/TO soon
I 
really doubt that if your roaster includes a little copper cap that you 
are in significant danger.  In order for the copper to actually reach 
you it would first need to be leached out (usually by an acidic 
solution).  Coffee might be acidic, but probably not enough to eat away 
at copper.  In terms of electronegativity, aluminum is by far more 
reactive than copper, and I don't hear any whirly-pop users proclaim that 
their coffee dissolves the roaster.
 
Furthermore, you are not going to generate much for fumes by heating copper 
in this device either.  Your not even halfway to its melting point 
while roasting coffee.
 
<Strangely, I got a severe headache after doing this, and was reluctant 
to touch the copper sulfate again.>
 
Copper is a biocide, especially in a salt like copper sulfate.  We are 
working with the elemental form which is much less readily absorbed by the 
body.
 
 
-Greg
In the process of constructing my own SC/TO soon

22) From: Greg C. Rose
I really doubt that if your roaster includes a little copper cap that you 
are in significant danger.  In order for the copper to actually reach you it 
would first need to be leached out (usually by an acidic solution).  Coffee 
might be acidic, but probably not enough to eat away at copper.  In terms of 
electronegativity, aluminum is by far more reactive than copper, and I don't 
hear any whirly-pop users proclaim that their coffee dissolves the roaster.
Furthermore, you are not going to generate much for fumes by heating copper 
in this device either.  Your not even halfway to its melting point while 
roasting coffee.
Copper is a biocide, especially in a salt like copper sulfate.  We are 
working with the elemental form which is much less readily absorbed by the 
body.
-Greg
In the process of constructing my own SC/TO soon
I 
really doubt that if your roaster includes a little copper cap that you 
are in significant danger.  In order for the copper to actually reach 
you it would first need to be leached out (usually by an acidic 
solution).  Coffee might be acidic, but probably not enough to eat away 
at copper.  In terms of electronegativity, aluminum is by far more 
reactive than copper, and I don't hear any whirly-pop users proclaim that 
their coffee dissolves the roaster.
 
Furthermore, you are not going to generate much for fumes by heating copper 
in this device either.  Your not even halfway to its melting point 
while roasting coffee.
 
<Strangely, I got a severe headache after doing this, and was reluctant 
to touch the copper sulfate again.>
 
Copper is a biocide, especially in a salt like copper sulfate.  We are 
working with the elemental form which is much less readily absorbed by the 
body.
 
 
-Greg
In the process of constructing my own SC/TO soon

23) From: Michael Stock
the copper plumbing caps have other things more important to worry about
(while we're on the subject).  It appears some of them come pre-soder'd for
easy welding.  this means theres' a ring of stuff inside the lip of the
copper cap, and this metal combount melts at low temps (below 500F) and the=
n
will run all over the place.  Soder is Always quite toxic, usually includin=
g
happy things such as lead.  I discovered this the hard way, as it ruined my
first batch of coffee.
in other news, my new metal shaft is done, but there are some bugs to be
worked out.  There is currently nothing holding the shaft down, so if the
coffee gets under the agitation arm (either the brass or the steel one),
it'll eventually lift the new metal drive shaft off the motor, causing it t=
o
stop spinning.  I'll jus JB weld them together, and that'll solve that
problem, though it's a little more difficult to bend the agition are into
the correct shape if you can't have it connected to the shaft while you're
bending it.
--mike
On 3/2/06, Greg C. Rose  wrote:
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24) From: Randolph Wilson
<Snip>
Sean,
i think you will find this interesting: 
Turns out, your copper plumbing may be a useful source of dietary copper.

25) From: Alchemist John
Here's my take and knowledge on it (some from being a chemist who 
used to analyze and field lots of copper questions).
IIRC, the limit in drinking water is 3-5 mg/L.  It is used in 
plumbing, and is generally safe, but can and does dissolve over time 
to give elevated levels in your water supply.  Heat accelerates this.
Cooking ware with copper is never in contact with food and heated at 
the same time (again IIRC).  Especially acid food.
Breweries use it often as it is tradition, but it is "only" at 
boiling temperature, not roasting temps.
You don't have to be at the melting point of copper to give off 
copper fumes.  That is why galvanized is not used either. Can the 
little cap hurt?  I don't know, but I do know I don't want to find 
out and why test it with the warning and documentation out there 
about how toxic it is IF you do over ingest it?
Copper can cause acute poisoning.  Aluminum is up in the air whether 
it causes a form of chronic poisoning.  Different animals in my mind.
At 18:21 3/2/2006, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

26) From: Jared Andersson
I am currently building my own SC/TO style roaster.  I am looking for
something in place of the copper cap people tend to use.  Since we don't
want heat to get to the plastic shaft and copper transmits heat very well
wouldn't it make sense to use a different metal or material anyway?  Not
that I know what that would be.  Jared
On 3/3/06, Alchemist John  wrote:
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.
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27) From: Gene Smith
Jared writes:
"I am currently building my own SC/TO style roaster.  I am looking for
something in place of the copper cap people tend to use.  Since we don't
want heat to get to the plastic shaft and copper transmits heat very well
wouldn't it make sense to use a different metal or material anyway?  Not
that I know what that would be."
I have the copper cap on mine, stuffed with fiberglasss wool for 
insulation.  So far, the plastic shaft remains unaffected by roasting.  An 
alternative might be one of those porcelain caps used to cover up the bolts 
that hold a toilet to the bathroom floor, Jared.  They would undoubtedly 
function better as insulators.
The problem with them would be how to go about attaching them so that they 
don't come flying off every time you empty the roasted beans out of your 
SCTO.  With the copper, it's easy: you just drill two holes for the 
stirring wires and cut a slot from the edge of the cap to the hole with a 
hacksaw.  If it loosens in use, you can crimp the whole thing tighter with 
a pair of slip-jaw pliers.
Another drawback of porcelain is that once hot, it's going to *stay* hot 
for a lot longer than the copper.
Gene Smith
who's thinking he may disable his Stir Crazy heating element for more 
control over decaf roasts.

28) From: Jared Andersson
Good points Gene.  I hadn't thought of cool down time.  I was thinking of a
steel cap or even something like that new silicone Lecreuse sp? rubber
scrappers use that is good up to something like 800 degrees.  Then again th=
e
copper cap with insulation is easy to find make and use so why complicate
it?  Because we are home roasters that's why.  Jared (liking Gene's little
notes after his name)
On 3/3/06, Gene Smith  wrote:
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29) From: Tom Bellhouse
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
 Jared, the shaft on my SC is steel and not plastic.  There's a short =
plastic surround, but after a month's roasting that's undamaged by heat. =
 I simply took off the original plastic nut and cap, and replaced them =
with a washer and a nut from the hardware store.  No taking stuff apart, =
no sockets, no new shaft, no copper cap doohickey (which I did try to =
put on initially but which kept falling off.)  
I really can't figure out why it would be necessary to raplace the =
shaft.
Tom in GA

30) From: Demian Ebert
Well, the shaft on my SC was entirely plastic. The threaded portion lasted
one roast even with the copper cap heat sheild. The tabbed piece that kept
the stiring arm in place was also showing signs of heat stress.
Demian
On 3/3/06, Tom Bellhouse  wrote:
<Snip>

31) From: Jared Andersson
Thanks Tom.  What do you mean by "there's a short plastic surround" ?  My
shaft seems to be black plastic like the cap and I am afraid of destroying
it like Demian did.  I just bought the SC new from Target and new usually
seems to mean more plastic.  I do however like your pragmatic approach and
would like to follow it if I can make it work.  Jared
On 3/3/06, Tom Bellhouse  wrote:
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h a
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32) From: Peter Zulkowski
Just a thought here, but could you use a black iron 1/4 NPT end cap? 
Seems I have seen these in hardware stores plumbing section for a buck 
or less.
PeterZ
Still thinks stir crazy's are wimpy, here in LHC.
Jared Andersson wrote:
<Snip>

33) From: Tom Bellhouse
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Isn't that strange!  There must be diferent production runs of the SC, =
one with steel shaft and one with plastic.  The only plastic on mine was =
the nut.  That'd sure be a thing to check for when shopping for a SC.  =
I'm glad I got lucky and unwittingly picked up the steel shafted one.  
Tom in GA

34) From: Peter Schmidt
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
After about a year of use, the threads of the plastic shaft on my SC got =
brittle and snapped off.
The simplest solution for me was to grind down the remaining threads, =
drill straight down into the shaft, and install a "hanger bolt."  This =
brass item, available at HD's, has wood threads on one end (go into the =
hole drilled in the shaft) and machine screw threads on the other end =
(x20 for the washer and wing nut)
A little wadded up aluminum foil, copper cap, and voila!  It's roasted 5 =
hours non-stop, no problemo Uncle Red.
Peter, loving simplicity, in M'waukee

35) From: Woody DeCasere
i just got my TO, and talked to my bro inlaw, who happens to be a metal
fabricator/welder type he is going to fabricate some stainless stuff for my
machine, i will post pics when done
On 3/3/06, Peter Schmidt  wrote:
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"Good night, and Good Coffee"


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