HomeRoast Digest


Topic: Krups Moka Brew Discontinued (41 msgs / 881 lines)
1) From: Rudy Ramsey
Well, it looks as if I waited too long to buy a Krups Moka Brew. It sounded
great, and given that I like Aeropress coffee, I was hoping this would
provide a drip-like coffeemaker appropriate for serving guests.
Does anyone know either: (1) what, if anything, is available that will
produce a similar brew (ideally, a replacement for this coffeemaker, but I
don't see a replacement at the Krups site, or (2) where I could still get
one?
Thanks.
Rudy

2) From: Brian Kamnetz
I don't know where you can get a Moka Brew, but the other day I
actually saw a replacement carafe. I have a Select Comfort bed and the
pump doesn't work (#%$&$#@). I called several appliance shops, all of
which quickly declined to even look at the pump. I stopped in to a
tiny appliance repair shop (also stocks barber and pet supplies), and
they had a KMB replacement carafe or two on a shelf! $40, if I recall
correctly. But no KMB around (yes, I asked).
Brian
On 8/31/06, Rudy Ramsey  wrote:
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3) From: europachris
A stovetop moka pot will give you a very close, if not better brew.
 
I *HAD* a Moka Brew.  I never liked the coffee it produced.  I always found it bitter and kinda nasty, no matter what grind, roast level, beans,  brew amount, etc. I tried.  I FAR prefer the coffee from my Cona D or even my ancient 4 cup Mr. Coffee.  I have a little 4-cup stainless moka pot that makes far superior coffee.
 
Then, one day, the Moka Brew started acting up where it would take 12 minutes or more to brew a half pot, and the pressurestat kept shutting off the heat too soon before it built up a head of steam to brew.  I tried adjusting it every which way but loose, took it apart, cleaned it, etc. to no avail.
 
I hadn't put more than 30 or 40 pots through it, max.
 
Into the sh!t-can it went, with not a second look.
 
IMHO, don't waste your time looking for one.
 
Chris

4) From: europachris
A stovetop moka pot will give you a very close, if not better brew.
 
I *HAD* a Moka Brew.  I never liked the coffee it produced.  I always found it bitter and kinda nasty, no matter what grind, roast level, beans,  brew amount, etc. I tried.  I FAR prefer the coffee from my Cona D or even my ancient 4 cup Mr. Coffee.  I have a little 4-cup stainless moka pot that makes far superior coffee.
 
Then, one day, the Moka Brew started acting up where it would take 12 minutes or more to brew a half pot, and the pressurestat kept shutting off the heat too soon before it built up a head of steam to brew.  I tried adjusting it every which way but loose, took it apart, cleaned it, etc. to no avail.
 
I hadn't put more than 30 or 40 pots through it, max.
 
Into the sh!t-can it went, with not a second look.
 
IMHO, don't waste your time looking for one.
 
Chris

5) From: Vicki Smith
Chris, I wonder if you had a defective pot to begin with, given your 
experience with it and its rapid failure.
I've been using a KMB pot for about 18 months. I like it so much, that 
when I heard it was being discontinued, I bought a back-up pot, 
anticipating the eventual demise of this one. I also purchased an extra 
carafe. It's the glass thing, yanno. FWIW, you can find a replacement 
carafe for $24 US here:http://tinyurl.com/fmzs8.Scroll down to *Krups 
046 - Krups 046 Carafe*.
I also make moka the stove top way. It's not as much better, just 
different, in much the same way that moka from my brikka is different 
from moka in my moka express. If I had to characterize it, I guess I 
would say that it is more like stove top moka than it is like pour over, 
drip, or French Press, but still different. It is a wonderful way to 
make 40 ounces of coffee in the morning, or for guests after dinner.
I played with grind and weight of coffee for a bit, before I came up 
with the "sweet spot". I do make minor adjustments for bean, resting 
period, and method and degree of roast. I had to do an unexpected coffee 
gifting yesterday, so today I am drinking green stripe, to sorta FC+/ 
mebbe Vienna, with one day rest, and it is terrific. I roasted this bean 
in my bread machine, and it got away from me, and hit 2nd crack too 
soon, but wow, is it great coffee, even at this point.
The pots have shown up on Ebay a couple of times, selling for well over 
$125 US. I paid $77 CAD for one of mine, $100 CAD for the other. You can 
also buy the German version, which does *not* operate on No American 
current, but can be modified, or used with a converter.
If you luck into one, buy it, if not, move on and try another pot. I'd 
go with a 10 or 12 cup stove top espresso if you like that sort of 
coffee and are looking for volume brewing or a vacuum brewing system. I 
recently picked up a new Yama, and I'm waiting for it to clear Canadian 
customs.
Vicki (who has lots and lots of coffee toys, none of them espresso 
related [yet])
europachris wrote:
<Snip>

6) From: Bill Morgan
Thank you so much, Vicki!
I've been wanting to pick up a spare carafe, but Krups wants about $50 for them.
The URL you supplied didn't work for me, so I started fromhttp://www.smallappliance.com/and used their search for Krups model #
046.
Another happy KMB user,
Bill
On 9/1/06, Vicki Smith  wrote:
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7) From: Alison Pfeffer
Rudy--
   I found one at Goodwill recently in excellent shape (barely used)  
for $7.99.  I bet more will hit the shelves at the thrift stores-- 
there are plenty of people out there who bought one and think it's  
just too darned much trouble to use.  Good luck!
Alison

8) From: Wesley Simon
Just to provide an alternate view:
I love the coffee produced by the KMB.  There are some coffees that do
better than others using this brew method.  Using the KMB takes a little
more time to setup and a little more time to brew than drip, but it makes an
excellent cup.  If you have the opportunity to pick one up, I'd do it.  I
love my KMB.
Wes
On 9/1/06, europachris  wrote:
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9) From: Maureen Azcoitia
On 9/1/06, Wesley Simon  wrote:
<Snip>
I agree on the brewing time, but I thought it was the same to set up.
Maybe I am not doing something right, what steps do you do in your KMB
set up that is different from drip?

10) From: Marc
Vicki,
No fair teasing us like that - what are the details on your sweet spot for
the KMB?
Thanks,
Marc
On 9/1/06, Vicki Smith  wrote:
<Snip>

11) From: Vicki Smith
Well, Marc, it really is grinder dependent, which is why I didn't 
specify what it is. Mine is 4 clicks to the left of the portafilter 
icon, which seems odd, but I am using a Solis Maestro Classic, and 
that's the way mine is. I use 45-47 grams of coffee, for a full pot, 
which is a little light according to the formulae one sees around. 
However, I know Mark Prince recommended 43 grams.
v
Marc wrote:
<Snip>

12) From: Barbara C. Greenspon
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Sorry its taken me so long to get to this, but I disagree completely.  I 
LOVE my moka brew, even have another waiting just in case.  They do show 
up on ebay now and then.
It makes some of the best coffee we have.  I love my Andreja premium and 
my Technivorm, but each has their place.  We are coffee addicts and 
proud of it.  The Moka Brew is unique and amazingly tasty.  I guess its 
"to each his/her own."
Barbara
europachris wrote:
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13) From: Les
I have to agree with you Barbara.  The KBM makes a unique brew.  I
really like mine and wouldn't compare it to another method.  I really
like the Kenya coffees brewed in it.  I am sorry Chris that you had
such a bad experience
Les
On 9/3/06, Barbara C. Greenspon  wrote:
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great, and given that I like Aeropress coffee, I was hoping this
<Snip>
provide a drip-like coffeemaker appropriate for serving guests.
Does
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produce a
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don't see a
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one?
Thanks.
Rudy
homeroast
<Snip>http://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroastTo
<Snip>
go to
<Snip>

14) From: Peter Schmidt
As long as we're talking KMB stuff here, I ran my first pot with some
polyester felt from Scott Marquardt.  That IMHO was the only drawback of the
KMB, it's paper filter.  It will take a few more pots to tell, because I
brewed a new coffee I'm unfamiliar with, but preliminary findings look like
more of the coffee oils were present in the cup and zero fines.  Speed of
extraction/brew time were similar to the stock filters.
Thanks Scott!
peter
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wrote:
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up
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found
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brew
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off
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to
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industry-leading
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unsvbscribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

15) From: Thomas Pfau
Peter Schmidt wrote:
<Snip>
Great news, Peter.  I was planning on trying the polyester felt myself 
as soon as I found myself near a crafts store.
I have found other alternatives to the Krups paper filters for the KMB.  
Melitta makes a 3.5" disc filter.  It's intended for percolators but it 
fits the KMB perfectly.  I asked my wife to pick up more the last time 
she went shopping but she picked up the wrong thing.  Shop-Rite, a local 
supermarket chain, has a large square filter about 9" square.  She 
brought home a package of those.  I cut one of these into quarters and 
that worked well, too.
-- 
tom_p
pfau --http://nbpfaus.net/~pfau/

16) From: Steve Hay
I should try this.  I recently aquired a KMB and I think I like the results.
I have some concerns over what I notice during brewing.  My observations are
similar to what I observe when brewing with the TV, although not abruptly
staged:
Stage 1: "Mocha Stage"
This is the stage where a deep black brew is coming out of the machine with
no foamy head.  It looks likes an espresso without crema. (~0.5-1 cup)
Stage 2: "Blonding Stage"
During this stage, blonde foam is being spit out of the KMB. The pot gets
about 1/2" of foam on top o the dark coffee underneath.  (~2-2.5 cups)
Stage 3: "Bubbles and Spray Stage"
Finally, the remainder of the cycle sprays down this foam periodically (with
bubbles forming on the drip head in between) until there is no foam is left
and the pot is full.  The spray looks almost clear like water. (~5 cups)
Now, the coffee tastes good..  Different but good.  I'm wondering if some
overextraction is going on based on the long "Bubbles and Spray" stage
above.
When I brew drip with the TV (which also tastes good) I get similar
results.  Towards the end, the coffee coming out of the brew head is very
faint.  It makes me wonder if I've gone past the peak of extraction.  I've
heard some coffeemakers bypass water late in the brew process to limit
overextraction.  I wonder if this technique would be beneficial to the KMB
or even TV brew methods.
Steve
On 9/4/06, Peter Schmidt  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Steven Hay
hay.steve -AT- gmail.com
Barry Paradox: Consider k to be the greatest element of the set of natural
numbers whose description require maximum of 50 words: "(k+1) is a natural
number which requires more than 50 words to describe it."

17) From: Vicki Smith
It's the natural progression of the brew, and one of the reasons you 
have to be sure to stir the pot before drinking the coffee. It also may 
be one of the reasons that it is one of those machines that do better 
when you are brewing a full pot.
It's not espresso, and things like "blonding" really don't 
apply--especially, if you think about it, in the middle of the brew.
It's a (mostly closed) system, and as the water heats up and is moved 
through the channels as steam, things change--my guess would be that it 
is a result of changes in pressure as the water is used up in the reservoir.
vicki
Steve Hay wrote:
<Snip>

18) From: Steve Hay
On 9/5/06, Vicki Smith  wrote:
<Snip>
Vicki,
Thank you for verifying that your observations are similar.  I guess I am
still curious about what is going on with extraction.
It's not espresso, and things like "blonding" really don't
<Snip>
I'm not sure they are so fundamentally different.  Considering the relative
length, pressure, and temperature of an espresso shot versus the KMB
process, the blonding seen in an espresso shot sure looks a lot like the
foam coming out of the KMB after a long drip of dark coffee and occurs
similarly.  That's just my empirical observation.
I'm guessing that both crema and the "blond stuff" coming out of the KMB is
an emulsion oils, proteins and sugars.  I'm also guessing further that
espresso blonding is when there are less oils, leaving a less-stable
protein-only foam.  The consistency of this stuff seems similar to what
comes out of the KMB in the early-middle part of the brew.
through the channels as steam, things change--my guess would be that it
<Snip>
Perhaps it would be an interesting (though difficult to impossible?)
experiment to taste what is coming out of the KMB at the different stages.
The last four cups sure seem like hot water instead of coffee.  If so, I
wonder why there isn't unacceptable bitterness...
Regardless, the coffee tastes good (but different).  I guess I'm wondering
how it fits into the big picture of all the different brewing methods.
Higher extraction temperature, extraction time comparable to drip (although
unclear the water actually spends as much time in contact with the grounds
as drip (maybe this is key?)), more solids,...
-- 
Steven Hay
hay.steve -AT- gmail.com
Barry Paradox: Consider k to be the greatest element of the set of natural
numbers whose description require maximum of 50 words: "(k+1) is a natural
number which requires more than 50 words to describe it."

19) From: Vicki Smith
I would warn you, from painful experience, not to try to pull the lever 
up to reseat the pot (or for any other reason) before either the pot has 
completed brewing or you have turned it off and allowed the pressure to 
lower as it cools.
I ended up with a very nasty third degree steam burn at the base of my 
right thumb and wrist, when waaaay too early in the morning I realized I 
had not seated it properly and steam was escaping. I thought could redo 
it, on the fly, and forced the lever up with disastrous consequences. I 
was very fortunate that the hot coffee grounds that flew through the air 
onto my face had cooled sufficiently not to cause burns there too.
I have some (minor) nerve damage in my wrist and may need to have some 
(minor) surgery to release some burn related adhesions.
Vicki
Steve Hay wrote:
<Snip>

20) From: Ed Needham
That's terrible.  Steam packs quite a punch as both heat and pressure.  I 
hope your injury heals completely.
*********************
Ed Needham®
"to absurdity and beyond!"
ed at homeroaster dot com
(include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
*********************

21) From: Scot Murphy
On Sep 6, 2006, at 10:05 AM, Ed Needham wrote:
<Snip>
Holy OUCH!!! Man, do I ever hope you come through this all right.  
That's some nasty burn. You've got my sympathies, for sure.
Scot "been burned before, but not that bad" Murphy

22) From: Brett Mason
...offers a little more compassion for the little old lady holding her
McDonald's Brew while she drove...
Brett
On 9/6/06, Scot Murphy  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Cheers,
Brett

23) From: Vicki Smith
Thanks Scot (I am actually the burnee, not Ed [who I am sure is too 
careful a guy to have this happen]. According to my doctor, I will now 
have something to fill in on forms that ask for "distinguishing marks or 
scars".
It was pretty scary and painful. I was very glad it didn't get infected, 
which, as a diabetic, is always of extra concern. I'm going to wait a 
bit before deciding if I am going to have the cosmetic procedure to make 
it look better, at least until after we figure out if I have to have the 
adhesions dealt with. Steam sure can burn.
Vicki
Scot Murphy wrote:
<Snip>

24) From: Steve Hay
On 9/5/06, Vicki Smith  wrote:
<Snip>
Thanks, hope you heal completely...  My first time using the KMB I got a
smart from the device because I did not realize the top level went
completely up and was trying to force the carafe in and out.. when pulling
it out I got some darn hot coffee splatter that burned like it was in the
200's...  I wonder if that's why they discontinued it...
--
Steven Hay
hay.steve -AT- gmail.com
Barry Paradox: Consider k to be the greatest element of the set of natural
numbers whose description require maximum of 50 words: "(k+1) is a natural
number which requires more than 50 words to describe it."

25) From: an iconoclast
On 9/6/06, Steve Hay  wrote:
 My first time using the KMB I got a
<Snip>
I love manuals, so I read the manual before using my KMB. In BOLD:
page 1 "Read all instructions..."  Page 2 "Never open the appliance
while the coffee is running through as the appliance is then under
pressure".   Under steam pressure being the key word.  I knew it was a
different animal than a drip machine and that's precisely why I chose
it.
I think the reason it was discontinued in America is we are all in
such a hurry. Our culture has no patience.  If I want an immediate cup
of coffee, I use my Aeropress.
I've developed a routine.  I put my beans in the grinder the night
before and get everything ready, so in the morning I can just grind
while filling the water chamber.  I make sure the lid to the water
chamber is seated well. Then I go take my shower.  All is ready when
I'm ready.  I have experienced not seating the lid correctly, so now I
make sure.  If I am going to stop the brew, I turn the machine off and
let it cool down and depressurize before removing the pot.  I
sometimes get in a hurry when it's just about finished and lift the
latch very carefully with a towel.
I love the 3rd page of the manual - "Roasting is the secret to
bringing out the subtle flavors in the bean".  Amen.
Take care,
Ann

26) From: Steve Hay
On 9/7/06, an iconoclast  wrote:
<Snip>
Mine came with no manual; this actually occurred to me for this device
because its a bit more high-energy than your typical coffee pot.  (I usually
tinker before reading a manual--part of the fun of something new)
I personally love my aeropress because its probably one of the best
single-serving way to brew out there and like you said, its fast and has
simple cleanup.
I love the 3rd page of the manual - "Roasting is the secret to
<Snip>
Wait..  Cofee is roasted??  wow. :)
-- 
Steven Hay
hay.steve -AT- gmail.com
Barry Paradox: Consider k to be the greatest element of the set of natural
numbers whose description require maximum of 50 words: "(k+1) is a natural
number which requires more than 50 words to describe it."

27) From: Vicki Smith
The folks at Krups said that no one knew how to market or sell this 
machine in No America. Retailers didn't know what to do with it; it 
looks funny; it doesn't have the popular features drip coffee makers in 
that price range have; and, there is not exactly a strong moka pot 
contingent here to be intrigued by the name alone.
It continues to sell well in Europe.
vicki
an iconoclast wrote:
  I think the reason it was discontinued in America is we are all in
<Snip>

28) From: Brian Kamnetz
Ann,
Can you remind me what grinder you have? (just idly curious.... I am
still using my Zass grain mill, so when I'm grinding, that is all I'm
doing.)
Thanks,
Brian
On 9/7/06, an iconoclast  wrote:
<Snip>

29) From: an iconoclast
On 9/7/06, Brian Kamnetz  wrote:
<Snip>
Brian,
I have a Capresso Infinity.  I don't do espresso, so it works great
for my KMB at the lowest fine setting and at the lowest medium setting
for the Aeropress.  I used my Zass while on vacation and my tendonitis
flared up in my shoulder.  Had to get someone else to help.  But
Alchemist John had a Trosser at the PNW Jam.  Much better ergonomics,
but not as pretty.
By the way, Steve, the internet carries almost every manual for every
apparatus made. Just try a Google search.
Take care,
Ann

30) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
Interesting.
I also use a Capresso Infinity, but I use the middle of "Fine" for 
Aeropress, and the low end of "Course" for KMB.
I am becoming disenchanted with my KMB. I found several types of beans 
that come out tasting boiled or over-extracted.
e.g. Sulawesi Toarco. Didn't have time for more than one cup just after 
I brewed it. Next morning, heated in the microwave, I actually liked it 
better - quite a bit better.
Perhaps I just don't like really hot coffee.
The Aeropress has never disappointed me.
Dave S.
an iconoclast wrote:
<Snip>

31) From: an iconoclast
On 9/7/06, Maryann & Dave Schellenberg  wrote:
<Snip>
Very interesting, Dave.  Directly opposite.  It hurts my wrist and
shoulder to push the plunger if I grind any finer than medium for the
Aeropress.
Do you weigh your beans for the KMB?  We use 62g. Most seem to use
less, but we like it strong. The KMB limits bitterness, so we can
drink it stronger. We tried several grind settings before settling on
lowest fine setting.
I, too, like cooler coffee.  I don't even take the first sip of coffee
until it has been poured into my SS spill-proof travel cup and takes a
45 minute drive to work while I sleep.  I drink it for the next 2 hrs
until I make myself another cup, this time with the Aeropress.
Take care,
Ann

32) From: Vicki Smith
I think I grind a bit finer in my Solis Classic, though it is hard to 
compare grinders. And while I have not felt that some coffees are 
overextracted,  I have found that some coffees really need to rest 
longer than others when I brew in the KMB. For example, Greenstripe 
tasted really good to me at day one, and kept getting better, until day 
5 when it was gone (well until the next batch), whilst Harar #19 never 
tasted good to me until day 4. I use a stoneware mug or china, and much 
prefer the coffee after it has sat for 3-5 minutes or so.
At my grind, I use 45-50 grams of coffee for a full pot. I have made it 
with coarser grounds, and then I used more.
Vicki
Maryann & Dave Schellenberg wrote:
<Snip>

33) From: Vicki Smith
I recently bought a Yama pot, and then tried a cloth filter that came 
with it in the KMB. My word--it sure worked fine. I ordered a Cory glass 
rod for the Yama, but that is another story. You can get the cloth 
filters from our hosts. I am hoping they will stock the Yama itself 
soon, now that it is available again. I'd like a 5 cupper (I now have 
the 8).
Vicki

34) From: Eddie Dove
Vicki,
Where did you get the Cory rod?
Eddie
On 9/8/06, Vicki Smith  wrote:
<Snip>

35) From: Michael Guterman
Eddie Dove wrote:
<Snip>
Eddie,
I got mine on eBay.  Six or seven dollars.  I use it in a Bodum, and it 
is a major improvement.
Michael
<Snip>

36) From: Eddie Dove
Thanks Michael.
Eddie
On 11/5/06, Michael Guterman  wrote:
<Snip>

37) From: Vicki Smith
I mis-spoke. I have the Cona drainer from SM: http://www.sweetmarias.com/prod.brewers.vacuum.shtmlI noticed that I have to grind a bit coarser to keep it from plugging up 
the Yama, and I am actually just as happy with the cloth filter apparatus.
v
Eddie Dove wrote:
<Snip>

38) From: Eddie Dove
Vicki,
Thank you.
Aren't you headed out on a trip sometime soon?
Eddie
On 11/6/06, Vicki Smith  wrote:
<Snip>

39) From: Vicki Smith
Yes, I am leaving for Toronto on Friday. I'll be in that general 
vicinity until November 21, and then driving down to Detroit to make US 
TDay for my son and 9 of his friends. I return to Red Deer on the 25th.
I'm bringing with me: 7 pounds of roasted coffee, roasted on Thursday 
and packed in 1/2 pound one way valve bags for distribution among 
friends on Saturday; five pounds of greens, for roasting during the 
trip; my heat gun (other folks are providing the bread machine and other 
roasting aids) and, if there is room, my IR2.
I'm also bringing a biggish French Press (for the home where no suitable 
coffee maker is available) and a reasonably good blade grinder (the one 
Tom likes), which does just fine for the French Press. Oh, and the 
Aeropress.
By the way, four of the people I will be seeing bought KMB pots, on my 
recommendation, before they were discontinued, and they all have decent 
grinders. I should be fine for coffee for all but the Detroit end of the 
trip. My son does not drink coffee, though his (new) roommate does, and 
I will probably leave the grinder and FP there for them to use.
vicki
Eddie Dove wrote:
<Snip>

40) From: Michael Guterman
I went to Toronto a few years ago to visit a fellow list member.  She 
had never seen a Hottop, and wanted to try one.  I was driving my little 
two seat MR2.  The looks I got at Canadian customs were quite peculiar.  
I guess it did look like half the car was filled with some sort of 
unidentifiable infernal machine.  I really liked Toronto.  Have fun.
Michael
Vicki Smith wrote:
<Snip>

41) From: Brian Kamnetz
On 11/6/06, Michael Guterman  wrote:
<Snip>
Michael,
Was the listmember you visited the woman who was planning to open a coffee
shop, Java Mama or something like that? Susan, perhaps was her name?
Brian


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