HomeRoast Digest


Topic: Gene Cafe Profile and Preliminary Results (88 msgs / 1851 lines)
1) From: Eddie Dove
I spent a good portion of my day Saturday working on this and roasting
coffee.  I don't have definitive, time-tested results yet, but with only 24
hours rest, the results are very promising; I tried three of the coffees I
roasted (I roasted seven pounds).
In brief, this is what I did:
 1)   Preheat the Gene Cafe and let it do it's cool down.
 2)   Load ~230 grams of coffee
 3)   Set the Gene Cafe for 30 minutes (arbitrary, you will stop it when it
is done), use a stopwatch or timer to track time.
 4)   Set the Gene Cafe for 300 F, hit start and let it run at this
temperature for 5 minutes.
 5)   At  5 minutes, raise the temperature to 435 F
 6)   At 10 minutes and 30 seconds raise the temperature to 456 F for the
remainder of the roast
 7)   Stop the roast at the desired level
 8)   Cool immediately external to the Gene Cafe (I use a Wearever
Cushonaire Pizza pan on the back of a fan that pulls the air down through
the beans; room temperature in 30-60 seconds)
 9)   Return drum to Gene Cafe, hit start then stop and allow it to run
through a normal cooling cycle.
 10) Repeat for next batch
I roasted the following coffees, all from Sweet
Maria's
:
El Salvador - The Juan Francisco
Project
Guatemala Fraijanes - Finca Agua Tibia
 (for
blending with the Columbian 50/50 great with 12 hours rest
Honduras Pacamara - Santa Marta
Estate
Brazil Fazenda Brauna
Columbia Excelso
13556(for
blending with the Guatemalan 50/50 - great with 12 hours rest)
Ethiopia Organic Dry-Process
Sidamo
I also roasted a Nicaraguan coffee that someone just brought to me from
Nicaragua.
Preliminary Results:
Honduras
Pacamara - Santa Marta Estate (24 hours rest)
I got exactly what Tom describes in his cupping notes.  This coffee is
similar in flavors to an Indonesian, but much more refined and sweet.  It
does not slam itself down on the palate, but rather offers itself up in a
very inviting manner.   In the dry aroma, I got a very distinct mint aroma,
but in the cup it was ever so subtle, just a nuance that laced together the
more earthy flavors.  It does become more rustic as it cools, but right at
the very end, there is a very subtle, almost imperceptible taste of
chocolate as the coffee becomes more creamy and buttery.
At 48 hours rest, essentially the same, a little more mature and a little
more body.  Stick your entire face in the cup and let your olfactory senses
drink the aroma ... it is intoxicating!
El Salvador - The Juan Francisco Project (24 hours rest)
The aromatics are nutty (toasted almond?) with grape skins and sage.  The
taste is very much as Tom describes, with a cornucopia of fruited flavors,
some pulpiness and some fruit skins right at the end for just a hint of
tart.  Tom, please do keep working on this project!
At 48 hours rest, it is essentially the same, but I am detecting a bit of
green apple.
Brazil Fazenda Brauna Peaberry (24 hours rest)
A hint of the orange brightness, but very pronounced nuttiness with good,
but not overpowering chocolate.  I have never had the nutty aroma or taste
before with this bean.
Basis for Profile:
Recently, Les wrote the following, "In my Popper roasting if I wanted to
slow a roast down, I would do it when the beans turned the straw color and
you got the grassy smell.  I don't know if you can see the beans in the
Gene, but if you can that might be the place in your profile to slow it down
a bit.  This is where the bean really expands and getting heat in at that
point in the roast is critical for a nice even roast.  By slowing the roast
down at that place in the profile, it allows the heat to get into the
beanbefore the carmalization begins to insulate the interior of the
bean."
Recently, miKe wrote the following, "I've found the early pre-tanning stage
just as important as the start of 1st to end of
roast stage. Too short time before tanning can lead to grassy/green
aftertaste while too long inhibits good caramelization latter on I believe.
I use about 4min drying stage (to my 300f). Then there's the main setup ramp
tanning through browning. It's amazing how varying the ramp rate will alter
the cup, same total roast time. Have done many comparison roasts in the
past. Most Kona I've settled in on about 25f/min ramp tanning to start of
1st. Now I slow it down to 15f/min for a couple min then 10f/min final
~minute and a half my ~445f end of roast usually about 11:30. (which is
about 5f before anticipated 2nd). Unless it's Kona Peaberry then a different
overall faster profile usually about 10 to 10:30min. Cooling target 2min to
125f or less."
I was trying to get the heat into the bean by adapting miKe's profile to the
mannerism of the Gene Cafe.  By this, I mean that I don't have to constantly
change the temperature on the Gene Cafe because of the way it operates.
When I bumped the temperature from 300F to 435F it took 3.5 minutes for the
roaster to get to that temperature and the beans will languish behind
somewhat.  This may need some perfecting, and tweaking for different beans,
but the results thus far are very promising.
Hope this helps and certainly feel free to comment, suggest and / or
critique.  I will post more results as they are available.
Respectfully,
Eddie

2) From: Kevin
Can't wait to try this profile!  This weekend maybe...I'll post my results
to the blog in my signature.  Thanks Eddie!
On 12/4/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

3) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Thanks Eddie for this information! I'll definitely be trying this out next
time I roast. Look forward to hearing more about this!

4) From: Eddie Dove
I also posted this on
Homeroasters.org...
Eddie
On 12/4/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

5) From: Frank Parth
Eddie,
This is great stuff. Thank you. I haven't had the time to do this kind of detailed work so you've given me a great place to start.
Frank Parth
<Snip>

6) From: Ken Mary
<Snip>
Since the Gene Cafe is a "hybrid" roaster heated with forced air, it seems
logical to start with low heat and proceed to high to finish, as you have
done. This is what I do on a popper when trying to duplicate my drum
profile. My drum, as are most, is radiant heated and requires high heat to
start and reduced heat to finish, the opposite of a forced air popper.
A few suggestions:
Do a duplicate roast where you cool quickly as you describe, and for
comparison, cool in the roaster for 2 minutes then finish cool externally.
Reduce your first stage temperature to 250F and add a few minutes. 300F may
be too close to the reaction zone where it is risky to spend too much time.
I reduced my drum profile drying to 250F max bean temperature a few months
ago, and my results seem to be better than previous drying levels of 300 to
325F.
--

7) From: Kevin
Ken,
What are your thoughts on changing 1st stage to 250F (Down from 300F) and a
duration of 7 (or 8 minutes) (up from 5 min)?
On 12/4/06, Ken Mary  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

8) From: Eddie Dove
Ken,
Great, useful feedback and I welcome it!  Thank you!
One question, when you wrote, "Do a duplicate roast where you cool quickly
as you describe, and for comparison, cool in the roaster for 2 minutes then
finish cool externally."
Is there something I am looking for here.  Can you share the logic for my
understanding?
Eddie
On 12/4/06, Ken Mary  wrote:
<Snip>

9) From: Eddie Dove
Frank,
Thank you and that is what it is ... a place to start ... Ken gave some good
comments that I will take to heart.  If this gets tossed for something that
makes an effective profile baseline for the Gene Cafe roasters, then I am
happy and it was worth my Saturday.  Who knows, Derek may be able to find
the caramel in his Liquid Amber again using the Gene Cafe.
Eddie
On 12/4/06, Frank Parth  wrote:
<Snip>

10) From: Larry English
Eddie,
  Nice post - I just tried your profile on the Puerto Rico Yauca, since I
had roasted that one before on the Gene Cafe.  My old "profile" has been
just to set it at 465F and target C+ to FC; and I let Gene cool to 100C (two
pushes of the red button) and then use a small down-draft fan and screen to
complete the cooling (so I have to stop the roast a little earlier than
you).  At the same roast time I got a little lighter roast - a very nice C+
after cooling.
  I like the drying phase - it's much like the iRoast2 which limits the
internal temp to 350F for the first 3 minutes.  And the preheating phase is
excellent, for consistent roasts, especially in my environment, an unheated
garage.
  I did notice that temp didn't get up to the 435F mark during that 2nd
phase so I would probably have gotten the same result just going from 300F
to 456F directly at the 5 min mark.  And anyway I'm not crazy about using
time as the decider in switching temps (except of course for the drying
phase).  I'll try it both ways with one of the Brazils to see if there's a
difference.
  Thanks again for the info!
Larry

11) From: Derek Bradford
On 12/5/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
Wouldn't that be nice.  I've had to settle for blueberry.
--Derek
-- http://www.novernae.comHome of the Wandering Sloth

12) From: Kevin
Eddie,
What is the measured voltage at your outlet when you roast?  I'm curious b/c
with the roast curve below I wonder if I'll hit first crack or come up
short.  Usually I set the GC on 470 and let it run until 1st (usually around
12-13 min in).  If I drop the temp to 460-465 for the duration of the roast,
there are only a few pops of 1st and the coffee tastes under-roasted
(sour).  My outlet voltage is close to 122V.  Ambient temp isn't an issue
b/c I roast in a heated area inddors,
Essentially what I am asking is do you have any trouble hitting 1st crack
with the roast profile below? (though, based off the reviews you posted I
would assume not).
On 12/4/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

13) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin,
I've never had a problem hitting 1st or 2nd crack with this profile and I
normally do not set the temp above 456F.  The voltage at my outlet measured
121.9V the last time I checked (during the summer) and I don't think it's
ever read below ~120V or above ~122V, but my service panel is only about 25
feet from the transformer.  I also do all of my roasting indoors where the
ambient temperature is between 70 - 75F.
Try test on your Gene Cafe to see where your heating elements stand.  From
stone cold, and completely empty, set it to 482 and turn it on.  Record
temperatures at 1 min intervals and see how long it takes for yours to get
up to 482.  There was a post on CG about this.
Eddie
On 12/5/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

14) From: Ken Mary
<Snip>
finish cool externally."
<Snip>
understanding?
Many years ago I challenged the assumption that roasts need to be cooled
immediately, the faster the better. Not many agreed with me, and that could
be explained by taste preference.
In looking for an explanation for much better tasting roasts from a Poppery
I vs other Poppery II clones, I found the only significant difference to be
the slower cooling rate. I modded a P II clone to cool at a similar rate and
got the same taste results as the P I. Additional work on the cooling
profile gave me the best results when the BEAN temperature falls to about
300F at the two minute mark past the end of the roast. This could be
considered a part of the "roast" since temperatures are above 300F. After
this two minute period the beans are dumped into an external fast cooler or
allowed to remain in the popper for fast cooling with no heat applied.
One problem with measuring bean temperature in a popper or forced air
roaster is the huge difference between a thermocouple reading and the actual
temperature. I used an IR meter to measure the bean temperature during
cooling.
I am betting that the naturally slower cooling rate of the Gene Cafe will
give results similar to my slow cooling profile. Try to measure the
temperature of the beans with a fast acting thermometer when the drum is
removed after 2 minutes. I do not own a Gene Cafe, so I am not certain that
this will work.
--

15) From: Ken Mary
<Snip>
Funny, that was exactly what I suggested.  :-)
But as to why 250, I am not sure. My drum roasts SEEM to be better than a
hold for drying at 300 or higher. But I have had many good roasts holding at
the higher temperatures. The logic is not interrupting caramelization once
it starts. That temperature has been mentioned by others as between 250 and
275F. But pure sugar caramelizes below 212F. The temperature needed to dry
efficiently has to be above 212 BEAN temperature and preferably at or above
225 to provide enough driving force for evaporation.
Choosing the extent of drying could be a matter of personal preference. Most
coffee has a water content of 11 to 12 percent. My preference is extended
drying on all wet process beans and little or none on dry process and aged
beans.
Roaster type may have an impact on drying. It is possible that forced air
roasters dry more efficiently, and less time needs to be spent in that
stage. I use a non ventilated drum so drying is an important part of my
profiles.
--

16) From: Eddie Dove
Results update ... Ethiopian Organic Dry-Process Sidamo
I have had this coffee before and really enjoyed it; however, never to this
extent.  I roasted this to a Full City+ (rested just shy of 3 full days)
using this profile and it really made this coffee come to life!  I had
poured a cup, got distracted, the cup cooled, then I took a big swig.
Picture your favorite coffee cup filled with a great mild blueberry
Ethiopian and a cinnamon stick in there as well!
This is good coffee ...
Eddie

17) From: Kevin
Eddie,
You're killing me!  I have to wait until Saturday to use your profile!
On 12/5/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

18) From: Fancye9876
Eddie,
 
That is where I got my first blueberry was the Sidamo.  I can't wait  to try 
roasting some with your profile to see if I get more.
 
Susan

19) From: Eddie Dove
Thanks Larry!
Be sure to let us know how it turns out and if you come up with any
modifications to the profile that produces better results.
Eddie
On 12/4/06, Larry English  wrote:
<Snip>

20) From: Eddie Dove
Thank you, Ken!  I really do appreciate you sharing your experience and
wisdom.
Eddie
On 12/5/06, Ken Mary  wrote:
<Snip>

21) From: Eddie Dove
Susan,
Please let me know how it works out!
Eddie
On 12/5/06, Fancye9876  wrote:
<Snip>

22) From: Kevin
Eddie,
I roasted my first batch using your exact profile today.  I cupped out the
coffee right after the beans cooled (i.e. no rest).  Amazing!  This is
without a doubt the best coffee I've had!  I roasted Costa Rica SM Select
Peaberry.  Unfortunatley, I triped carring the roasted beans up the basement
steps and lost 3/4 of my batch!  The spilt on my dirty basement floor and
wound up in my shop vac!  I only have 1/8 lb to enjoy!  However, your
profile is unbeliveable!  Next roast I'll try dropping stage one to 250F for
7 min and let you know how it turns out.  I'll post my results to the blog
in my signature.  Thanks again!
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

23) From: Kevin
Eddie,
I roasted my first batch using your exact profile today.  I cupped out the
coffee right after the beans cooled (i.e. no rest).  Amazing!  This is
without a doubt the best coffee I've had!  I roasted Costa Rica SM Select
Peaberry.  Unfortunatley, I triped carring the roasted beans up the basement
steps and lost 3/4 of my batch!  The spilt on my dirty basement floor and
wound up in my shop vac!  I only have 1/8 lb to enjoy!  However, your
profile is unbeliveable!  Next roast I'll try dropping stage one to 250F for
7 min and let you know how it turns out.  I'll post my results to the blog
in my signature.  Thanks again!
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

24) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin,
I am really glad to hear that it worked for you, and thanks for letting my
know!  I am really sorry you lost most of them thought!  I have some of
those greens here, they may get roasted today or tomorrow.
Eddie
On 12/9/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

25) From: Rich M
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Hi-
Just joined this group last week and have found it very interesting  
and enjoyable, although a couple of the threads go way beyond my  
limited knowledge of the subject.  Anyway, Kevin mentioned a great  
roasting profile given to him by Eddie, but I missed what that  
profile actually was.  Any hope of repeating it?  It intrigued me  
because Kevin mentioned a 250F stage one.  I've always gone much  
hotter in stage one.  I really like the way most of my coffee turns  
out, but am certainly willing to experiment to get a better cup of  
Joe.  Thanks.
Rich
On Dec 9, 2006, at 11:02 AM, Kevin wrote:
<Snip>
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Hi-Just joined this group =
last week and have found it very interesting and enjoyable, although a =
couple of the threads go way beyond my limited knowledge of the =
subject.  Anyway, Kevin mentioned a great roasting profile given to =
him by Eddie, but I missed what that profile actually was.  Any hope =
of repeating it?  It intrigued me because Kevin mentioned a 250F stage =
one.  I've always gone much hotter in stage one.  I really like the =
way most of my coffee turns out, but am certainly willing to experiment =
to get a better cup of Joe.  Thanks.
Rich = On Dec 9, 2006, at 11:02 AM, Kevin wrote:
Eddie, = I roasted my first batch using your exact profile today.  I = cupped out the coffee right after the beans cooled (i.e. no rest).  = Amazing!  This is without a doubt the best coffee I've had!  I = roasted Costa Rica SM Select Peaberry.  Unfortunatley, I triped = carring the roasted beans up the basement steps and lost 3/4 of my = batch!  The spilt on my dirty basement floor and wound up in my shop = vac!  I only have 1/8 lb to enjoy!  However, your profile is = unbeliveable!  Next roast I'll try dropping stage one to 250F for 7 = min and let you know how it turns out.  I'll post my results to the = blog in my signature.  Thanks again! Kevin http://homecoffeeroastbl=og.blogspot.com/ "I got a fever and the only prescription... = is more cowbell!" =http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

26) From: Kevin
Eddie,
The one thing I noticed was that 1st crack wasn't very pronounced.  Just a
few pops here and there, not a rapid 1st like I usually get.  Is this
typically what you experience?  Though, the roast was amazing so I can't
dipute the results.
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

27) From: Kevin
Rich,
Welcome to coffee nirvana!  Eddie's profile is below.
In brief, this is what I did:
 1)   Preheat the Gene Cafe and let it do it's cool down.
 2)   Load ~230 grams of coffee
 3)   Set the Gene Cafe for 30 minutes (arbitrary, you will stop it when it
is done), use a stopwatch or timer to track time.
 4)   Set the Gene Cafe for 300 F, hit start and let it run at this
temperature for 5 minutes.
 5)   At  5 minutes, raise the temperature to 435 F
 6)   At 10 minutes and 30 seconds raise the temperature to 456 F for the
remainder of the roast
 7)   Stop the roast at the desired level
 8)   Cool immediately external to the Gene Cafe (I use a Wearever
Cushonaire Pizza pan on the back of a fan that pulls the air down through
the beans; room temperature in 30-60 seconds)
 9)   Return drum to Gene Cafe, hit start then stop and allow it to run
through a normal cooling cycle.
 10) Repeat for next batch
On 12/9/06, Rich M  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

28) From: Eddie Dove
I have found that it varies from bean to bean ... last week, some I could
barely hear, others were violent and loud.
Eddie
On 12/9/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

29) From: Eddie Dove
Rich,
Welcome!  Kevin was quicker with the trigger ...
I too was very pleased with my roasts, but I just wanted to see if I could
work out a profile that would make things even better ... and thus far I am
very happy.  Please let us know how it works out for you.
Eddie
On 12/9/06, Rich M  wrote:
<Snip>

30) From: Rich M
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Kevin & Eddie-
Thanks for the info, however I'm going to have to modify the profile  
a bit.  You see, I only have the iroast2, not the equipment that so  
many others seem to have.  (I must admit there is a little bit of  
"roaster envy" on my part!)  I do most of my roasting at the  
firehouse and I'm off for a couple of days, but I'll definitely let  
you know what the results are.  Thanks again for the info.
Rich
On Dec 9, 2006, at 11:57 AM, Eddie Dove wrote:
<Snip>
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Kevin & Eddie-Thanks =
for the info, however I'm going to have to modify the profile a bit.  =
You see, I only have the iroast2, not the equipment that so many others =
seem to have.  (I must admit there is a little bit of "roaster envy" =
on my part!)  I do most of my roasting at the firehouse and I'm off =
for a couple of days, but I'll definitely let you know what the results =
are.  Thanks again for the info.
Rich  On Dec 9, 2006, at 11:57 AM, Eddie Dove wrote:
Rich, Welcome!  Kevin was quicker with the = trigger ... I too was very pleased with my roasts, but I just = wanted to see if I could work out a profile that would make things even = better ... and thus far I am very happy.  Please let us know how it = works out for you. Eddie On 12/9/06, Rich = M <rmatiszik> = wrote: Hi-Just joined this group last week and have = found it very interesting and enjoyable, although a couple of the = threads go way beyond my limited knowledge of the subject.  Anyway, = Kevin mentioned a great roasting profile given to him by Eddie, but I = missed what that profile actually was.  Any hope of repeating it?  = It intrigued me because Kevin mentioned a 250F stage one.  I've always = gone much hotter in stage one.  I really like the way most of my = coffee turns out, but am certainly willing to experiment to get a better = cup of Joe.  Thanks. Rich On Dec 9, 2006, at 11:02 = AM, Kevin wrote: Eddie, I = roasted my first batch using your exact profile today.  I cupped out = the coffee right after the beans cooled ( i.e. no rest).  Amazing!  = This is without a doubt the best coffee I've had!  I roasted Costa = Rica SM Select Peaberry.  Unfortunatley, I triped carring the roasted = beans up the basement steps and lost 3/4 of my batch!  The spilt on my = dirty basement floor and wound up in my shop vac!  I only have 1/8 lb = to enjoy!  However, your profile is unbeliveable!  Next roast I'll = try dropping stage one to 250F for 7 min and let you know how it turns = out.  I'll post my results to the blog in my signature.  Thanks = again! Kevin http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot=.com/ "I got a fever and the only prescription... is more = cowbell!" =http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html= --Apple-Mail-6-550510143--

31) From: Eddie Dove
Rich,
I am sure if you start another thread, others with the IRoast with share
their profiles.  miKe mcKoffee uses a modified Cafe Rosto so his might be
easier to adapt to your IRoast; it is below:
Constant ramp rate from tanning to start of 1st yes (ie ramp rate of bean
temp rise not applied heat temp). Usually between 20 to 30f/min depending on
the bean.
My current "main" profile (using past couple years).
Note: first batch of session I pre-heat the Rosto to ~250f then cool to
~100f, same approx cooling temp as cooled batch. "Over sized" 1/2# batches.
(Compared to stock Rosto 1/4# desinged batches)
Target temps:
200f @ 1min (heater voltage usually 120 to 125v start, dropping to 102 to
108v ~150f ~25sec point depending on ambient)
250f @ 2min (usually maintaining same 102 to 108v or slightly adjusting)
275f 3min  (usually couple volt bump to heater)
300f 4min (usually another couple volt bump, tanning stage begins)
325f 5min (4 to 6v bump, now up to 110 to 118v to heater depending)
350f 6min (often up to 120v to heater by now, browning stage begins)
375f 7min (sometimes need more heater power, sometimes not depending on
ambient)
400f 8min (usually need 2 to 4v more to heater, 1st crack usually about now,
often drop heater voltage 1 or 2v)
415f 9min (usually a couple v heater voltage bump back up)
430f 10min (usually backing heater v off a few)
440f 11min City+ (often continuing dropping voltage a couple v, depending)
445f 11:30min LFC (very common finish point for Kona, Centrals, Island etc)
450f 12min FC (early 2nds)
455f 12:30 FC+ (common Sumatra finish, used to go lighter but found like
Indo's a bit darker, a few seconds of 2nd)
460f seldom go this high bean temp.
For my espresso blends I usually go to 450f but a slower mid and finish but
same start ramp, ~15min total roast. Use 20f/min tanning to start of 1st
ramp, straight 10f/min 400f to 440f, then 5f/min 440 to 450f end of roast.
This very slow finish ramp 2nd kicks in a bit earlier.
I used to routinely use a finish "hold at final temp" for 30sec or so but
don't now, though still do at times, depends on what the beans tell me they
want from smell, sound, look etc.
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmUltimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Hope this helps ...
Eddie
On 12/9/06, Rich M  wrote:
<Snip>

32) From: Kevin
Eddie,
I apologize for stealing your thunder but I had to get your profile out
there.  It makes a world of difference.  I'm going to experiment with it a
little but you've really given us GC'ers a great baseline!  Thank you for
your efforts and for sharing!
On 12/9/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

33) From: Eddie Dove
DO NOT APOLOGIZE!  No thunder stolen!  Share it freely!
Eddie
On 12/9/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

34) From: mikeraz
Eddie Dove wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
For translating this to other roasting systems, am I to treat these
temperatures as bean temperatures?
-- 
      Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon  
    Be appropriate && Follow your curiosityhttp://fut.patch.com/">http://www.patch.com/words/orhttp://fut.patch.com/
  The fortune cookie says:
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro..."
-- Hunter S. Thompson

35) From: Eddie Dove
Michael,
I sincerely wish I could give you a simple Yes or No, but I am not sure.  I
interpolated this from miKe's suggestions based on a fluid bed roaster, a
comment that Les made, the Sweet Maria's Updated Visual Roasting Guide and
the behavior of the Gene Cafe.  I can tell you that when I factored in the
behavior of the Gene Cafe, I did so knowing that the bean temperatures would
languish behind the temperature set / read on the roaster.  The more
definitive estimations (?) of the bean temperature for me are 1st and 2nd
crack.
I am not sure that it is, but I hope this is somewhat helpful ...
Eddie
On 12/10/06, Michael Rasmussen  wrote:
<Snip>

36) From: Frank Parth
Eddie,
This looks like a great profile. I've been setting the initial temp to 482 to ramp up quickly and then bringing it downto 456 after 10 minutes, going into cool-down as soon as I started seeing smoke. I'll have to try your profile and seeif there's a big difference.
This morning I aimed an IR heat sensor at the GeneCafe and found that the bean temperature was about 50 degrees F cooler than what the GC air temperature said. During the cool-down phase the temperatures matched very closely.
Frank Parth
<Snip>

37) From: Eddie Dove
Frank,
Let me know what you think and if you come up with something better.
Eddie
On 12/10/06, Frank Parth  wrote:
<Snip>

38) From: Kevin
Frank,
I roast with a GC but I'm not an advacate of setting the machine to the max
to ramp up quickly.  The way I look at it is that the machine most likely
uses a simple thermostate to control temperature.  That is, the heating
element has only two states, on or off; it doesn't throttle.  ...Essentially
how a home thermostat works.  Say for example the first temperature set
point desired was 300F, I'd wager that a GC set at 300F would reach 300F, +
or - 5F, in the same time as a GC set at 482F.  This is the beauty of
Eddie's profile, he did a lot of homework for us GC'ers (thanks again
Eddie!) and developed a base bean temperature ramping profile emphasizing
the drying stage of the bean.
Also, if you shoot the roasting chamber with an IR temp probe, wouldn't the
probe be reading the glass temperature and not the bean mass temp?
On 12/10/06, Frank Parth  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

39) From: Kevin
Eddie,
How  long does an average city to city+ roast take for you with this profile
and what is your ambient temperature range?  My 17 min roasts have been
going to FC to FC+ and I was thinking 15.5 minutes for City.  My ambient is
70F in the basement but I roast under an open window using a desk fan to
push the exhaust out the window.  The outside air temp is 20's or lower when
I roast.
On 12/10/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

40) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin,
My ambient temperature is around 70F and I direct the exhaust toward the
range hood.  I have only done one City (Idido Misty Valley) and one City+
(Juan Francisco Project) roast thus far, but the total elapsed times were
18:45 and 17:30 respectively.  The Idido Misty Valley appears to take longer
in general (recent posts from IRoast users).  Those were the first two that
I did, but all of the others have been Full City or Full City plus which
have taken 17:15 (Yemen Sana'ani) to 20:00 (Djampit).  The beans talk to me
and tell me when they are done ...
I'm not sure I answered your question directly, but I hope this is helpful.
Eddie
On 12/10/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

41) From: Kevin
Eddie,
The two city roasts took 17:30 to 18:45 with a finishing temp of 456F...that
explains a lot...I'm rushing my roasts to finish at 15:30, afraid to take
them too long.  I'll try the 456F and expect the roast to take 17 to 18 for
City.
Was your finish temp higher for the FC roasts?  If not how did you get to FC
in the same time frame for the City roasts?
On 12/10/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

42) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin,
I like a gap between 1st and 2nd crack so that I can pick between City,
City+ and Full City which is why I decided on 456F.  I have not used another
temperature other than 456F.  Different beans give me different times;
density, moisture level, etc is my guess for the variance.  I may try some
other temperatures based on the ultimate test ... TASTE!
This past June I was trying to get the same taste at home as I did at
Starbucks and now I am discussing details of roast profiles and the nuances
of results.  I LOVE THIS!
Eddie
On 12/10/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

43) From: Frank Parth
<Snip>
I've been wondering the same thing - if the machine ramps up the temperature at the same rate no matter what the upper setting is. In other words, is the ramp-up profile the same whether the end result is set to 482 or to 456? I don't have a definite answer on that.
Yes, the IR thermometer would be reading the glass temperature and not the bean temperature, so I would expect it to be  somewhat lower than the temperature of the beans themselves. But the reading on the GC is the temperature of the hot air coming out and not the temperature of the bean mass either. Without actually putting a probe into the  mass of  beans, all I can say is that the beans are somewhere between those two temps .
As soon as I get back from a trip I'm going to try Eddie's profile.
Frank Parth

44) From: Kevin
Frank,
Sounds good, I'd love to hear your results.  I all my roast logs to a blog
in my signature at the end of this message.  Check it out periodically for
GC results.
-- 
Kevinhttp://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html">http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/"I got a fever and the only prescription... is more cowbell!"http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages/snl-more-cowbell.html

45) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin (et al),
What size batches are you roasting with the profile?  My experience this
past weekend dictates that the larger batches (300g) are going to require
some profile tweaking.
Eddie
On 12/10/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

46) From: Kevin
Eddie,
I roast in 8oz batches ~226.8g (pre-roast weight).
On 12/18/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin

47) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Eddie,
     Any solutions yet on the 300 g profile? I'll be roasting today, and
would like to try out this profile. Cheers!
---Kevin (et al),
What size batches are you roasting with the profile?  My experience this
past weekend dictates that the larger batches (300g) are going to require
some profile tweaking.
Eddie

48) From: Eddie Dove
Jeremy,
I won't be able to get to it until this weekend, but my first inclination is
to add a couple of minutes to the warming / drying phase ... getting all of
the beans to the same level and more receptive to the increased heat.
Eddie
On 12/21/06, Jeremy DeFranco  wrote:
<Snip>

49) From: Kevin
Eddie,
Have you modified the original profile at all or are you still unsing the
posted profile as written?
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin
On 12/21/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>

50) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin,
Thus far, I am still using the profile as written.  Have you come up with
something different?
Eddie
On 12/21/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

51) From: Eddie Dove
I did some 307g batches of the Africa Highlands WP Decaf using the profile
as published and the cup is excellent!  I have had this many times before,
but the brighter notes are much better.
Brewed in the Technivorm Moccamaster CD with a Swissgold filter after being
ground in the Mazzer Mini.
Eddie
On 12/21/06, Jeremy DeFranco  wrote:
<Snip>

52) From: Lisa J. Carton, LICSW
HI eddie------if you woldn't mind posting the site where the profile for th=
is is posted again---i'd really appreciate it!!!!  I lost  it somehow even =
tho i know i bookmarked it............
I have been drinking some of th=
e african highland decaf lately too---received via the holiday cheer swap o=
n homeroasters.org---and loving it!!!!   SO now i'd like to try your profil=
e adapted to HG/DB........thanks!!!!!
~Lisa
----- Original Mes=
sage ----
From: Eddie Dove 
To: home=
roast
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 8:39:44 AM=
Subject: Re: +Gene Cafe Profile and Preliminary Results
I did some =
307g batches of the Africa Highlands WP Decaf using the profile as publishe=
d and the cup is excellent!  I have had this many times before, but the bri=
ghter notes are much better.
Brewed in the Technivorm Moccamaster CD w=
ith a Swissgold filter after being ground in the Mazzer Mini. 
Eddie=
On 12/21/06, Jeremy DeFranco  wrote:
=
Eddie,
     Any solutions yet on the 300 g profile? I'll be roasting toda=
y, and would like to try out this profile. Cheers!
---Kevin (et al),=
What size batches are you roasting with the profile?  My experience t=
his 
past weekend dictates that the larger batches (300g) are going to re=
quire
some profile tweaking.
Eddie=
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has t=
he best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

53) From: Kevin
Lisa,
I may have posted Eddie's profile to my blog.http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin

54) From: Eddie Dove
Thanks, Kevin!  I really don't have a blog yet ...
Eddie
On 12/21/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

55) From: Lisa J. Carton, LICSW
THANKS Kevin!!!  That's IT all right.........whew.........now for that coff=
ee........  ;D
----- Original Message ----
From: Kevin 
To: homeroast
Sent: Thursday, Decemb=
er 21, 2006 11:43:51 AM
Subject: Re: +Gene Cafe Profile and Preliminary R=
esults
Lisa,
 
I may have posted Eddie's profile to my blog. ht=
tp://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/
-- 
My home coffee roasting b=
log:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin=
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  =
Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

56) From: Eddie Dove
Here is another location: http://www.southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/I've been hacking at it and trying to get the hang of it.
Eddie
On 12/21/06, Lisa J. Carton, LICSW  wrote:
<Snip>

57) From: Lisa J. Carton, LICSW
looks great eddie!!!!
.........love the valve surgery, too!!!  One of the=
se days i want to try it..........
----- Original Message ----=
From: Eddie Dove 
To: homeroast=
ts.sweetmarias.com
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 12:19:29 PM
Subjec=
t: Re: +Gene Cafe Profile and Preliminary Results
Here is another loca=
tion: http://www.southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/I've been hack=
ing at it and trying to get the hang of it.
Eddie
On 12/21/06,=
 Lisa J. Carton, LICSW  wrote:
THANKS Kevin!!!  Th=
at's IT all right.........whew.........now for that coffee........  ;D 
=
----- Original Message ----
From: Kevin < hokies1999>
T=
o: homeroast
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 11:4=
3:51 AM 
Subject: Re: +Gene Cafe Profile and Preliminary Results
=
Lisa,
 
I may have posted Eddie's profile to my blog.http://homecoffee=roastblog.blogspot.com/ 
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://=homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/ 
Kevin=
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! =
Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com=Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of =
spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo=.com 

58) From: Eddie Dove
Thanks, Lisa.  I appreciate it ...
Eddie
On 12/21/06, Lisa J. Carton, LICSW  wrote:
<Snip>

59) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Eddie,
     I just tried out your profile. I used 295 g of beans, and extended the
drying phase to 7 minutes. I kept all the other increments the same. I'm
looking forward to trying out the results over the next few days. Thanks,
Jeremy
---Jeremy,
I won't be able to get to it until this weekend, but my first inclination is
to add a couple of minutes to the warming / drying phase ... getting all of
the beans to the same level and more receptive to the increased heat.
Eddie

60) From: Eddie Dove
Jeremy,
Good,  bad or indifferent, please let me know.  I know the profile needs
work for the larger batches.  Did you get a definitive gap between 1st and
2nd crack?
I roasted some Decaf Costa Rican coffee with the profile and I am having the
first cup now.  This is the first Costa Rican coffee that I have actually
liked.
Thank you for letting me know.
Eddie
On 12/21/06, Jeremy DeFranco  wrote:
<Snip>

61) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Eddie,
     There was a nice gap between 1st and 2nd- a bit longer than my usual
roasts @ 465 the whole way. This was one thing I noticed while roasting that
was real promising. I'll let you know how it goes. Cheers!
---Jeremy,
Good,  bad or indifferent, please let me know.  I know the profile needs
work for the larger batches.  Did you get a definitive gap between 1st and
2nd crack?
I roasted some Decaf Costa Rican coffee with the profile and I am having the
first cup now.  This is the first Costa Rican coffee that I have actually
liked.
Thank you for letting me know.
Eddie

62) From: Kevin
Eddie,
I'm using your profile with 8oz batches ~226g and I'm loving it!  Much
better than my 465-470 straight runs.  Sometimes I do tweak the profile with
better/worse results.  Everything will be on the blog in time.  I thank you
for taking my coffee experience to the next level!
On 12/21/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin

63) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin,
And thank you for referencing your blog.  I looked at yours because I had
signed up for the same and I have now actually figured out how to use it.
WIN - WIN!
Eddie
On 12/22/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

64) From: Kevin
Eddie,
It's okay for now, but after a year or so of roasting I think a website with
a database of logs would be more convenient.  I just don't have the time to
develop a website right now.  The blog is nice and fast.
On 12/22/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin

65) From: Eddie Dove
Ditto ... I just do NOT have the time.
On 12/22/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

66) From: Eddie Dove
Or the technical expertise ...
On 12/22/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>

67) From: Kevin
Eddie,
I'm outsourcing it.  I have a friend who just might be able to help me.  If
it works out, I'd be willing to add your logs to the same site with a db
under your control. I'll keep you posted.
On 12/22/06, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin

68) From: Eddie Dove
Kevin,
Yes ... very generous and thank you.
Eddie
On 12/22/06, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>

69) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Eddie,
     I tried your profile for a 250 g batch of Rwanda Migongo Bourbon, and
it really brought out the chocolate. I liked the profile so much that I
started roasting many of my gift batches with the profile. At ~ 300g,
though, the profile broke down a bit. First crack wouldn't begin sometimes
until 19 or 20 minutes had passed. I've been working with numerous 300 g
batches all week in an attempt to cut down this time. I came up with the
following PRELIMINARY profiles, and I would also like some of your thoughts
on this: (All profiles are for batches 295g-305g)
For City- City+ Roast:
300 degrees for 5 minutes
435 degrees for 5:30
462 degress for remainder of roast
For FC Roast or greater:
300 degrees for 5 minutes
435 degrees for 5:30
462 degrees till end of first crack
431 degrees for remainder of roast
For Hairbender Style (5 minutes between 1st and 2nd, as Mike McKoffee
mentioned)
300 degrees for 5 minutes
435 for 5:30
462 till end of first crack
420 degrees for 4:15
431 degrees for remainder of roast
With these profiles, it still takes upto 16:30 for first crack to begin. I
am wandering if it would be beneficial to try to get to first crack sooner.
This would ultimately mean shortening either one of the warming or grassy
stages a bit (possibly 30 seconds total). I am wandering which one/ones I
might be able to shorten without adversely affecting the roast. I would tend
to think from Les's posts that it would be best to shorten the first warming
stage (300 degrees phase), and leave the second stage the same. Thoughts??
      Jeremy

70) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Eddie,
     I forgot to mention- I was wandering about possibly rasing stage 2 of
the profile by 5 degrees to 440 in attempt to decrease time to 1st crack as
well. What do you think about this?

71) From: miKe mcKoffee
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Funny, I was just thinking about your other post query to shorten time to
start of 1st. My thoughts were as you suggested; shorten drying stage
leading to tanning to 4 minutes and raise tanning/browning leading to 1st
stage temp 5f exactly as you now suggest with probable corresponding time
decrease of 30 seconds to a minute! However, I have no experience with the
Gene Cafe or how it responds or how it's temps relate to my measured in the
bean mass temps.
 
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee 
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc: http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htm
Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Jeremy DeFranco
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2006 9:13 AM
Eddie,
     I forgot to mention- I was wandering about possibly rasing stage 2 of
the profile by 5 degrees to 440 in attempt to decrease time to 1st crack as
well. What do you think about this?

72) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Thanks, Mike. I will definitely try this combo then next time I roast!
Cheers!
---Funny, I was just thinking about your other post query to shorten time to
start of 1st. My thoughts were as you suggested; shorten drying stage
leading to tanning to 4 minutes and raise tanning/browning leading to 1st
stage temp 5f exactly as you now suggest with probable corresponding time
decrease of 30 seconds to a minute! However, I have no experience with the
Gene Cafe or how it responds or how it's temps relate to my measured in the
bean mass temps.
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmUltimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.

73) From: Eddie Dove
Jeremy,
Let me know what your results are.  My experience with the GC is telling me
the opposite.  The profile was designed for ~226-230g, but translates fairly
well to 250g.  It does not work well for the 300g batches.  Although they
say that the roaster can do 300g batches and it can, I'm not sure that it
can do it well responding to a profile.
My logic that I have been using for this so far is as follows, which is why
I very much appreciate any and all feedback in case it is wrong.
The small changes that miKe can make to effect roasting in his Caffe Rosto
cannot be easily adapted to the GC due to the nature of the way the GC
roasts, especially at 300g.  miKe has the benefit of a much higher velocity
of heated, forced air, while the GC pumps the air in, but at nowhere near
the velocity.  Ramping up and down simply take longer in the Gene Cafe,
especially up, with respect to heat in the bean.  The warming stage of
miKe's roaster has the added benefit of the higher velocity air; running at
that velocity with no heat would still give a drying effect whereas the GC
would be significantly lower.  This is why I extended the time at 300F for
the GC.  I think the bean temperatures languish behind in the GC more so
than fluid bed roasters like miKe's.  Temperature drop times in the GC may
correlate with other roasters, but I think increases are a bit slower to get
into the bean and maybe too slow with 300g for effective profiling while at
the same time trying to limit duration.
My logic thus far tells me that perhaps increasing the time at 300F and then
incrementally bumping the ramps may produce the results you desire; perhaps
even to 482F for a minute or so before 1st crack because I don't think the
beans will actually get up to that temperature.  I have been meaning to test
my thoughts / theories, I just haven't had the time yet.
I hope this makes sense ... I was having a difficult time putting my
inklings into writing.
Let me know your results ...
Respectfully,
Eddie
On 12/30/06, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/

74) From: miKe mcKoffee
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
It's not just air velocity which makes profiling more responsive, but even
more responsible is direct control of actual amount of heat produced by
heater in finite continuous increments, which is the lacking GIANT weakness
of any and all the home roast off the shelf appliances as far as I know.
Simply put they can't do it.
 
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee 
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc: http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htm
Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Eddie Dove
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2006 10:01 AM
Jeremy,
Let me know what your results are.  My experience with the GC is telling me
the opposite.  The profile was designed for ~226-230g, but translates fairly
well to 250g.  It does not work well for the 300g batches.  Although they
say that the roaster can do 300g batches and it can, I'm not sure that it
can do it well responding to a profile.  
My logic that I have been using for this so far is as follows, which is why
I very much appreciate any and all feedback in case it is wrong.
The small changes that miKe can make to effect roasting in his Caffe Rosto
cannot be easily adapted to the GC due to the nature of the way the GC
roasts, especially at 300g.  miKe has the benefit of a much higher velocity
of heated, forced air, while the GC pumps the air in, but at nowhere near
the velocity.  Ramping up and down simply take longer in the Gene Cafe,
especially up, with respect to heat in the bean.  The warming stage of
miKe's roaster has the added benefit of the higher velocity air; running at
that velocity with no heat would still give a drying effect whereas the GC
would be significantly lower.  This is why I extended the time at 300F for
the GC.  I think the bean temperatures languish behind in the GC more so
than fluid bed roasters like miKe's.  Temperature drop times in the GC may
correlate with other roasters, but I think increases are a bit slower to get
into the bean and maybe too slow with 300g for effective profiling while at
the same time trying to limit duration. 
My logic thus far tells me that perhaps increasing the time at 300F and then
incrementally bumping the ramps may produce the results you desire; perhaps
even to 482F for a minute or so before 1st crack because I don't think the
beans will actually get up to that temperature.  I have been meaning to test
my thoughts / theories, I just haven't had the time yet. 
I hope this makes sense ... I was having a difficult time putting my
inklings into writing.
Let me know your results ...
Respectfully,
Eddie

75) From: Eddie Dove
Absolutely agree, miKe.
Also, a big difference between the GC and your setup is the toggling on /
off of the heat source in the Gene Cafe.  The fan will maintain "constant"
speed when the GC hits the temperature for which it has been set (or just
above by a degree or two),  at which point there is an audible "click" which
shuts off the heat.  So the fan is actually doing a wee bit of cooling as is
evident by watching the readings on the temperature display drop, which is
part of the beans languishing behind the temperature displayed.  When the
temperature has dropped about 5-8 degrees below the set temperature, there
is another audible "click" and the blast furnace is on again.  It's binary.
Eddie
On 12/30/06, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/

76) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Eddie,
     I will let you know how it goes. I will try experimenting with
incrimental bump-ups, but I will also try out the slightly shortened stage
1, and 5 degree higher stage 2, as well. I'll let you know how it goes,
regardless. My logic for the shortened stage 1, and 5 degree higher stage 2
is that because of the large lag behind of the GC, one might be able to get
away with a shorter stage 1, because eventhough you are turning the temp.
setting up, the actual bean temp will still lag behind for awhile. I am also
thinking that a 5 degree higher stage 2 will compensate for the larger bean
mass, and will bring the 300 gram batch to ~ same temp as a 5 degree less
setting would bring a 230 gram batch. I will probably go with a 465 stage 3
setting, too. My previous concern about this was that, as I mentioned in
other post, that I read somewhere in professional roasting literature that a
more muted 1st crack is better than a more rambunctious one. From the
replies to that post, though, this may not be true. So I will try the 465
stage 3. I need to check where I read that info, though. The main reason I
like the 300 gram batches is that I like to give people that I roast for a
good amount of beans. A 230 or 250 gram batch seems to barely fill the 8oz
gold foil bags over half full, and I feel like a cheap skate handing people
one of those puny little bags. This is one of the many reasons why I will be
happy to get rolling with the RK, not to mention the immense conservation of
time. Either way, I really appreciate you coming up with that profile. Works
deliciously with the 230-250 gram batches I roast for myself. I'll let you
know how it goes. I'll keep checking your blog as well to look for any
changes you make to your original profile. Cheers!
      Jeremy
-Jeremy,
Let me know what your results are.  My experience with the GC is telling me
the opposite.  The profile was designed for ~226-230g, but translates fairly
well to 250g.  It does not work well for the 300g batches.  Although they
say that the roaster can do 300g batches and it can, I'm not sure that it
can do it well responding to a profile.
My logic that I have been using for this so far is as follows, which is why
I very much appreciate any and all feedback in case it is wrong.
The small changes that miKe can make to effect roasting in his Caffe Rosto
cannot be easily adapted to the GC due to the nature of the way the GC
roasts, especially at 300g.  miKe has the benefit of a much higher velocity
of heated, forced air, while the GC pumps the air in, but at nowhere near
the velocity.  Ramping up and down simply take longer in the Gene Cafe,
especially up, with respect to heat in the bean.  The warming stage of
miKe's roaster has the added benefit of the higher velocity air; running at
that velocity with no heat would still give a drying effect whereas the GC
would be significantly lower.  This is why I extended the time at 300F for
the GC.  I think the bean temperatures languish behind in the GC more so
than fluid bed roasters like miKe's.  Temperature drop times in the GC may
correlate with other roasters, but I think increases are a bit slower to get
into the bean and maybe too slow with 300g for effective profiling while at
the same time trying to limit duration.
My logic thus far tells me that perhaps increasing the time at 300F and then
incrementally bumping the ramps may produce the results you desire; perhaps
even to 482F for a minute or so before 1st crack because I don't think the
beans will actually get up to that temperature.  I have been meaning to test
my thoughts / theories, I just haven't had the time yet.
I hope this makes sense ... I was having a difficult time putting my
inklings into writing.
Let me know your results ...
Respectfully,
Eddie

77) From: Eddie Dove
Thanks Jeremy ... I do appreciate it.
Let me know if you find that article ... I would like to read it.
I, for the same reasons as you, would like the 300g batches to work well.
However, when I give out the 1/4 pound bags, with a big smile, my own
personalized labels with descriptions, etc. the receivers act like I have
given them a gold bar!  And I know that I am giving them an opportunity to
enjoy an exquisite coffee that may never exist again!
I have the grill and everything pretty much together for the RK Drum, but I
need to get some rollers for the rotisserie to quiet it down.  Having done
some dry running of the thing I am getting too much noise.  I know adding
some weight (beans) will quiet it down some, but having a hearing deficit, I
really need to eliminate as much "interference" as possible.  I couldn't
find them at the hardware store today ... sigh ... I was hoping to have it
in production this weekend.
Happy New Year to you and everyone!
Eddie
On 12/31/06, Jeremy DeFranco  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/

78) From: Kevin
Mike/Eddie
I will be trying both your profiles in about 1/2 an hour with Mexico
FTO Chiapas-Special Lot.  I'll let you know how it cups out.  The two
profiles I'm using for two 8.00 oz batches in the GC are as follows:
Batch 1 (Eddie's Theory):
Preheat and cool to 140
Add beans and 300F for 5:00
@ 5:00 bump to 435F for 5:30
@ 10:30 bump to 482 for 3:00
@ 13:30 drop to 462F to finish roast at the door step of 2nd crack
Cool with the Shop Vac Dog Bowl bean cooler
Batch 2 (miKe mcKoffee's Theory):
Preheat and cool to 140
Add beans and 300F for 4:00
@ 4:00 bump to 440F for 5:00 (9:00 total elapsed time)
@ 9:00 bump to 462F to finish roast at the door step of 2nd crack
Cool with the Shop Vac Dog Bowl Bean Cooler
I will post the results to my blog
http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/). I only wish I had more
than 1 pound of the Chiapas Special Lot for the standard GC profile
(300F 5:00, 435F 5:30, 460 to end of roast).
Kevin
On 12/30/06, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin

79) From: Eddie Dove
Do tell ...
I think I have come to like 460 better than  456.
Eddie
On 1/1/07, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/

80) From: Eddie Dove
By the way ... as of last night, the Gene Cafe has roasted 190 batches (of
various size) and just over 101 lbs of coffee in the 4 months that I have
had it.  It will be roasting more today.
Eddie
On 1/1/07, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/

81) From: Kevin
Eddie,
Sounds like the GC is a real workhorse!  Okay off to roast my 2lb
experiment as previously posted...
On 1/1/07, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin

82) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Kevin,
     FWIW, Mike McKoffee's advice was meant to be applied to 300g batches,
although it will be interesting to see how the 4 minute phase 1 works with
250 grams. Come to think of it the shorter, and higher temp phase 1 may be
more appropriate for a smaller batch, not a larger batch, with the Gene
Cafe. I have tried 4:30 seconds and a 316 degree phase 1, and first crack
STILL takes 16:30 to get to with a 300g batch. Roast process looked much
nicer, though with the higher temp phase 1. Right now, for a 300 gram batch,
I am using a 320 degree, 5 minute stage 1, 440 degree 5:30 stage 2, and 469
to first crack. For FC or greater roasts, I will then finish with 431
degrees, or Hairbender style, as I posted before (drop to 420 degrees after
1st for 4:15, and then bump up to 431 degrees to finish) So far, I have come
to the same conclusion that Eddie stated, that the GC just doesn't have what
it takes to profile 300 gram batches, although I will still keep trying to
come up with a profile that is better than single temp all-the-way. I think
next 300g batch I will bump up to 482 for 3 minutes before 1st, as Eddie now
uses in his profile, and we may have a winner for a 300 g profile. Cheers!
---Mike/Eddie
I will be trying both your profiles in about 1/2 an hour with Mexico
FTO Chiapas-Special Lot.  I'll let you know how it cups out.  The two
profiles I'm using for two 8.00 oz batches in the GC are as follows:
Batch 1 (Eddie's Theory):
Preheat and cool to 140
Add beans and 300F for 5:00
@ 5:00 bump to 435F for 5:30
@ 10:30 bump to 482 for 3:00
@ 13:30 drop to 462F to finish roast at the door step of 2nd crack
Cool with the Shop Vac Dog Bowl bean cooler
Batch 2 (miKe mcKoffee's Theory):
Preheat and cool to 140
Add beans and 300F for 4:00
@ 4:00 bump to 440F for 5:00 (9:00 total elapsed time)
@ 9:00 bump to 462F to finish roast at the door step of 2nd crack
Cool with the Shop Vac Dog Bowl Bean Cooler
I will post the results to my blog
http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/). I only wish I had more
than 1 pound of the Chiapas Special Lot for the standard GC profile
(300F 5:00, 435F 5:30, 460 to end of roast).
Kevin

83) From: Eddie Dove
The Gene Cafe roasted just over 13 pounds of coffee this weekend and it
didn't miss a beat (just over 122 pounds in 4 1/2 months).  Changed up some
profiles and thus far everything seems to be tasting just like I wanted it.
The Yemen Mokha Sana'ani, after 1 day of rest, is already a chocolate BOMB,
which I what I was trying to achieve for espresso extraction later in the
week.  I really hope everything progresses they way I intended it.
Have a great week everyone.
Eddie
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/1/07, Eddie Dove  wrote:">http://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/1/07, Eddie Dove  wrote:
<Snip>

84) From: raymanowen
Am I missing something?
"For City- City+ Roast:
300 degrees for 5 minutes
435 degrees for 5:30
462 degress for remainder of roast
For FC Roast or greater:
300 degrees for 5 minutes
435 degrees for 5:30
462 degrees till end of first crack
431 degrees for remainder of roast"
It looks like there's a lot more heat being applied in the first profile- it
never gets throttled back. Full City is beyond the roast level of the C+ of
Profile #1...
Cheers -RayO, aka Opa!
"The indisputable truth is that no coffee is fresh if it isn't fresh
roasted." - - Martin Diedrich

85) From: Floyd Lozano
I'm new, let me try!
I thnk the key there is 'remainer of roast'.  With City/City+, you'd be
stopping the roast 'when it's ready'.  For the 2nd profile, you want to
prolong the time between 1st and 2nd crack so the roast doesn't get away
from you.  That's why you throttle back after 1st crack and add less heat
and coast toward 2nd crack more carefully.
How'd I do? ;)
-F
On 1/22/07, raymanowen  wrote:
<Snip>

86) From: Eddie Dove
Pretty good actually, Floyd.
Those were profiles listed by Jeremy, but I do throttle back the temperature
just at the precipice of 1st crack.
I don't have my notes in front of me (so this will be from short term memory
... uh oh), but this past weekend when I was roasting the Ethiopia FTO Dry
Process Sidamo, I used the following profile for Full City+ (a few snaps
into 2nd crack):
(Temperatures below are roaster settings not bean temperature)
300 F - 5 minutes (elapsed time = 5 minutes)
435 F - 4 minutes (elapsed time = 9 minutes, 435 achieved by the roaster
normally by 7:45)
460 F - 2 minutes (elapsed time = 11 minutes, 460 achieved by the roaster
normally by 10:00)
482 F - 2 minutes (elapsed time = 13 minutes, 482 achieved by the roaster
normally by 12:00)
1st crack begins at 13:00 and lasts about 120 seconds
460 F - 4 minutes (elapsed time = 17 minutes, a few snaps of 2nd before
terminating roast at 17:00)
Generalizing given the above profile, if I wanted a City Roast, it would
have been terminated at 15:00 minutes (end of 1st crack) and if I wanted a
City+ Roast it would have been terminated at 16:00 minutes.  I rely heavily
on the aroma for determining level of roast.
Hope this helps ...
Eddie
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/22/07, Floyd Lozano  wrote:">http://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/22/07, Floyd Lozano  wrote:
<Snip>

87) From: Jeremy DeFranco
Ray,
     It's been a while since I posted that profile. I have modified my
roasts since then, however, to "extend out" the lighter roasts a bit, which
is what I think you are asking about (actually, still haven't "settled" on
any profiles yet for 300g batches. Will actually begin moving away from 300g
batches for the time being, though, and will begin using 225-250g batches. I
think you have much more control over the roast that way). Cheers!
---Am I missing something?
"For City- City+ Roast:
300 degrees for 5 minutes
435 degrees for 5:30
462 degress for remainder of roast
For FC Roast or greater:
300 degrees for 5 minutes
435 degrees for 5:30
462 degrees till end of first crack
431 degrees for remainder of roast"
It looks like there's a lot more heat being applied in the first profile- it
never gets throttled back. Full City is beyond the roast level of the C+ of
Profile #1...
Cheers -RayO, aka Opa!
"The indisputable truth is that

88) From: raymanowen
Thanks, Floyd-
This is exactly how I was thinking iRoast II owners should handle their
machines.
When the roast is Done, STOP it! The machine doesn't end the roast...
Don't wait until the timer runs out- [My Fresh Roast wouldn't be done by
then, but of course, I don't do the Ron Popeil "Set it and Forget It." I
play with that thing a lot during a roast!]
Cheers -RayO, aka Opa!
"The indisputable truth is that no coffee is fresh if it isn't fresh
roasted." - - Martin Diedrich


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