HomeRoast Digest


Topic: OT was coffee crisis at work - G-d (21 msgs / 673 lines)
1) From: Tom Ulmer
At the risk of sounding like a complete goof why is the reference G-d? Is
this the spelling of he whose name cannot be spoken or a way of referring to
the plausible grand designer in a humble manner?
My studies in theology covered many cultures, religions, and belief systems
so I truly do not mean to offend.

2) From: Barry Luterman
It's Jewish. It is honoring the mitzvah not to take the Lord G-d's name in 
vain. The Name should only be used in prayer.

3) From: Sandy Andina
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On Jan 13, 2007, at 1:32 PM, Barry Luterman wrote:
<Snip>
And some interpret that mitzvah to preclude using the Name even in  
prayer, substituting "AdoShem" for the Name ("Ado***," which I will  
not type out lest I offend anyone on this list more observant than I  
am).
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
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On Jan 13, 2007, =
at 1:32 PM, Barry Luterman wrote:

It's Jewish. It is honoring = the mitzvah not to take the Lord G-d's name in vain. The Name should = only be used in prayer.

And some = interpret that mitzvah to preclude using the Name even in prayer, = substituting "AdoShem" for the Name ("Ado***," which I will not type out = lest I offend anyone on this list more observant than I = am).  Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-163--716193030--

4) From: Larry English
  Or maybe the "o" key is too close to the "-" key.  It could have come out
as "Gpd" or "Gid" or "G[d" or even "G0d" (that's a zero).
  And, it seems to me, "God" is not the name of the/a/any deity, it is just
a generic title, even when capitalized, and it is used in order to avoid
printing the "actual name" - kind of like Prince.  I'm pretty sure it is not
the Jewish name for the deity.
  My undergrad years were spent at a college in which a course in Bible
studies was required every semester, so I really know whereof I speak.
Uh-huh, sure ... carry on ...
L-rry
On 1/13/07, Barry Luterman  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
"You can't know the unknowable, but you can do the doable." - Jon Carroll

5) From: Vicki Smith
Larry, I am sure you know what you know (uh huh), but I was raised in 
the same tradition and it was only years after I stopped being very 
observant that I felt OK about doing it some other way. I'm guessing it 
was not a Jewish school you attended. They might not be entirely up on 
this sort of thing with in the context of our culture.
vicki
Larry English wrote:
<Snip>

6) From: Sandy Andina
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With all due respect, Larry, if you are not Jewish you *don't* have  
authority on the practice in question--Barry, who is observant,  
does.  Your suggestion that it was a typo, was, I hope, in jest and  
not serious.  As to what the actual Jewish name of the Deity is, be  
advised that there is a halachic practice called "building a fence  
around the Torah:" an extra layer of what appears at first blush to  
be an illogical and unnecessary observance as a precaution against  
indavertently violating the Torah.  (Which is why poultry is  
considered "meat" and fish is not when it comes to Kashrut--though  
neither birds nor fish lactate and thus consumption of them cannot  
literally violate the injunction against "seething a calf in its  
mother's milk,"  cooked poultry can sometimes be mistaken for, say,  
veal and vice versa; whereas fish resembles no other food--"Chicken  
of the Sea" notwithstanding).
On Jan 13, 2007, at 1:52 PM, Larry English wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
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With all due respect, Larry, if =
you are not Jewish you *don't* have authority on the practice in =
question--Barry, who is observant, does.  Your suggestion that it was =
a typo, was, I hope, in jest and not serious.  As to what the actual =
Jewish name of the Deity is, be advised that there is a halachic =
practice called "building a fence around the Torah:" an extra layer of =
what appears at first blush to be an illogical and unnecessary =
observance as a precaution against indavertently violating the Torah.  =
(Which is why poultry is considered "meat" and fish is not when it comes =
to Kashrut--though neither birds nor fish lactate and thus consumption =
of them cannot literally violate the injunction against "seething a calf =
in its mother's milk,"  cooked poultry can sometimes be mistaken for, =
say, veal and vice versa; whereas fish resembles no other food--"Chicken =
of the Sea" notwithstanding).
On Jan 13, 2007, at 1:52 PM, =
Larry English wrote:
  Or = maybe the "o" key is too close to the "-" key.  It could have come out = as "Gpd" or "Gid" or "G[d" or even "G0d" (that's a zero).    = And, it seems to me, "God" is not the name of the/a/any deity, it is = just a generic title, even when capitalized, and it is used in order to = avoid printing the "actual name" - kind of like Prince.  I'm pretty = sure it is not the Jewish name for the deity.   My undergrad years = were spent at a college in which a course in Bible studies was required = every semester, so I really know whereof I speak.  Uh-huh, sure ... = carry on ... L-rry On = 1/13/07, Barry Luterman <lutermanb001&= gt; wrote: It's Jewish. It is honoring the mitzvah not to take the Lord = G-d's name in vain. The Name should only be used in prayer.
Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-166--712833654--

7) From: Myron J
I have seen His/Her name typed G!d...like ta huge exclamation of Awe. Or a 
sign that we can not totally grasp, let alone communicate about things 
divine.
While there might be a connection between writing G-d's  in an incomplete 
fashion and the tradition not to speak his name..the problem is in the 
potential ERASURE of His/Her name. Writing G-d's name is fine..it is erasing 
it that is a problem. The legalities get complicated when you ponder what 
really serves as a name of G-d...or, for that matter, what is writing..
Are pixels on your screen really writing?
Better stop here before going entirely off the wall
Marcel Duchamp once said: "So, metaphysics: tautology; religion: tautology: 
everything is tautology, except black coffee because the senses are in 
control! The eyes see the black coffee, the senses are in control, it's a 
truth; but the rest is always tautology."
Myron Joshua
Kibbutz Kfar Etzion
90912
Israel
+972-(0)2-9935 178

8) From: Aaron
Oh boy, a holy war about god..... gotta lovem.
I call him god.
you may call him jesus.
someone else may call him allah
yet others may call him buddah.
im sure I have missed many other renditions of the holiest of the holy 
one's name.
Which one is the best god??.... umm nice try there holy roller, because 
they ALL are different names for the SAME person.
It's not how you believe that counts the most, it's THAT you believe.
Different paths to the same destination.... hopefully our salvation, so 
we are lead to believe.
Aaron

9) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
When I was in the Canadian Air Force, we were taught that in social 
situations we should avoid conversations about women, religion, and 
politics.
I was never very good at following the rules. :-)
With all due respect, Sandy, I don't see where Larry claimed to be an 
authority on the practice in question. He includes the phrase, "it seems 
to me". Is this discussion open to everyone's participation, or only for 
those of a select group? Who can be an authority on a subject - only 
those who follow certain practices, or also those who have done some 
study on the subject?
I found the following web site to be informative on this subject: http://www.jewfaq.org/name.htmAmong other things, it says:
    "Judaism does not prohibit writing the Name of God per se; it
    prohibits only erasing or defacing a Name of God."
    "It is worth noting that this prohibition against erasing or
    defacing Names of God applies only to Names that are written in some
    kind of permanent form, and recent rabbinical 
    decisions have held that writing on a computer is not a permanent
    form, thus it is not a violation to type God's Name into a computer
    and then backspace over it or cut and paste it, or copy and delete
    files with God's Name in them."
Dave S.
----- not claiming to be an authority, just sharing information and 
opinions -------
Sandy Andina wrote:
<Snip>

10) From: Larry English
  Yeah, well, guess my brand of humor ain't fer everyone.  I did think the
jesting was obvious, but I s'pose not.  To take any of these messages
seriously is to be in the wrong forum, IMHO.  :-)
  However --- do we really need to note that "observant" is not universal,
not in any religion or tradition?  There are many forms of observance in any
given religion or culture, and many of them are in disagreement, even in
violent conflict, and it should not be necessary to point to a current
situation that reflects such a problem.  If we cannot poke a little fun at
each other's particular version of orthodoxy, we are in deep doo-doo. IMHO.
:-(
  Back to homeroast - I've had to move inside for my roasting - it's
freezing in my garage where the Gene Cafe is located, so the
recently-repaired iRoast2 is back in use.  I roasted two smallish batches
(114 grams each) of Costa Rica La Magnolia, one with a high-to-medium
temperature profile and the other with an upramp profile - and noticed that
the high-to-medium gave a much more even roast, though apparently to the
same roast level.  I had not noticed this much difference with larger
loads.  Interesting.  :-?
  Peace, y'all ...  :-}
Larry  :-!
On 1/13/07, Aaron  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
"You can't know the unknowable, but you can do the doable." - Jon Carroll

11) From: Vicki Smith
FWIW, unlike some religions, there is no uniform POV in Judaism on this 
sort of thing, nor is there a central authority to turn to for 
resolution of issues related to religious practise and observance. 
Instead, you have individuals and smaller or larger groups that organize 
their behaviours around a set of beliefs that may very well be different 
from that which are held by other people who consider themselves to be 
(and are) equally Jewish.
For example, my family is Sephardic, that is, we are from the 
Mediterranean, rather than Easter Europe. Our dietary practises are 
somewhat different than those most commonly seen in the US, where 
Sephardic Jews are not all that common. And to further complicate the 
issue, the practises of the community in which I was raised, were 
different from the practises of the Sephardic community geographically 
nearest to us.
vicki
Maryann & Dave Schellenberg wrote:
<Snip>

12) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
Thanks for adding that, Vicki.
Given the variations in practice, what protocol would those groups 
follow to avoid offending?
Dave S.
Vicki Smith wrote:
<Snip>

13) From: Vicki Smith
As I said, there are no experts, but in secular environments, I 
generally don't comment on the manifestations of other people's 
religious beliefs. That seems to work.
In less secular settings, it's a different story, of course, and far 
more complicated. Trying not to offend folks with different beliefs can 
be a challenge. So, for example, although it is perfectly fine to eat 
rice during Passover in the community in which I was raised, I would not 
serve it if I knew that people who followed different customs would be 
eating the meal. Yes, they could just choose not to eat it, but in 
truth, it opens up the whole issue of whether my house was indeed 
"kosher for Passover" at all, an issue that would be well enough 
understood that some folks would not eat at my house during Passover, no 
matter what appeared on the table for any particular meal.
About 6.5 years ago, I married a man who is not Jewish, and moved to a 
community where there is no organized Jewish presence. I am somewhat out 
of the loop, though when I go visit family, I get caught up quickly.
v
Maryann & Dave Schellenberg wrote:
<Snip>

14) From: Eddie Dove
Christians are actually given those very instructions in Romans 14.
Eddie
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/13/07, Vicki Smith  wrote:">http://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/13/07, Vicki Smith  wrote:
<Snip>

15) From: Lynne Biziewski
Tom, I'm not Jewish, but I'll jump in, just the same: it's a form of
respect. There is much written on this: you can go
hereor
here  and also here  to
read some explanations.
I actually find like the practice. To me, it shows honor and respect...
Lynne
On 1/13/07, Tom Ulmer  wrote:
<Snip>

16) From: Lynne
For some reason, my gmail didn't show all of the conversations under 
this subject, so I'm now reading all of them on my Mac Mail program. Go 
figure...
Anyway... you said:
<Snip>
Just want to say - I so love that, along with the intelligent depth & 
exchange of thought.
Lynne

17) From: Aaron
It was said:
FWIW, unlike some religions, there is no uniform POV in Judaism on this 
sort of thing, nor is there a central authority to turn to for 
resolution of issues related to religious practise and observance. 
Instead, you have individuals and smaller or larger groups that organize 
their behaviours around a set of beliefs that may very well be different 
from that which are held by other people who consider themselves to be 
(and are) equally Jewish.
========
Seems they pretty much got it figured out... once again.. it's not how 
you believe, but that you believe that counts...  Too bad some other 
religions can't be so civil about it.
Aaron

18) From: Eddie Dove
The real shame is that even though their religion teaches it, people
themselves can't be civil.
Eddie
-- 
My Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/13/07, Aaron  wrote:">http://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 1/13/07, Aaron  wrote:
<Snip>

19) From: Sandy Andina
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There is a hymn called "Till All Thy Names Are One." Not sure if it's  
Baha'i or Unitarian Universalist. Says it all, regardless of its origin.
On Jan 13, 2007, at 3:00 PM, Aaron wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
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There is a hymn called "Till All =
Thy Names Are One." Not sure if it's Baha'i or Unitarian Universalist. =
Says it all, regardless of its origin.
On Jan 13, 2007, at =
3:00 PM, Aaron wrote:

Which one is the best = god??.... umm nice try there holy roller, because they ALL are different = names for the SAME person.

Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-178--597341153--

20) From: Sandy Andina
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Same for me, but 35 years ago.  I think he married me for the gefilte  
fish and potato latkes. (Certainly not for my matzo balls, which  
could definitely be lighter!)
On Jan 13, 2007, at 4:03 PM, Vicki Smith wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
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Same for me, but 35 years ago.  =
I think he married me for the gefilte fish and potato latkes. (Certainly =
not for my matzo balls, which could definitely be =
lighter!)
On Jan 13, 2007, at 4:03 PM, Vicki Smith =
wrote:

About 6.5 = years ago, I married a man who is not Jewish,

= Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-179--597163442--

21) From: Maryann & Dave Schellenberg
Aaron wrote:
<Snip>
Um, not to quibble, but we're still under an OT title, so check John 3:16.
I don't think allah nor buddah did such a thing.
Dave S.


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