HomeRoast Digest


Topic: Foodsaver Vacuuming canning jars for greens! and roasted? (10 msgs / 429 lines)
1) From: Edward Bourgeois
Have been using a Foodsaver with wide mouth canning jar attachment to pack
my green beans with great success. Last week I roasted a couple extra test
roasts and ended up with more beans than I could quickly use so I put the
extra to fill a qt jar after 24hr degassing. Vacuumed the jar and tightly
screwed down the band. After about 48 hrs the lid that was sunken due to the
vacuuming was now arched from the buildup of remaining co2. When I unscrewed
the tightened band there was a little pop from the release of the co2. My
thought is that after vacuuming out the oxygen and the beans natural
replacement of co2(a preservative)in the jar and not near enough pressure to
blow the jar the beans should have an extended freshness.
Edhttp://coffee-roasting.blogspot.com/

2) From: Floyd Lozano
my only concern is that any pressure above atmospheric would be enough to
prevent off gassing and force the CO2 to remain in the bean.  I wonder how
that would affect the taste.  I also find myself wondering about the source
of the CO2.  It is a natural waste product of respiration (for us, plants
expire O2 normally!)  but presumably there is nothing living in that bean
any more.  Is it just CO2 stuck in the cellular matrix that's being squeezed
out as the bean contracts as it dries / cools / whatever.  Or it's a
byproduct of some other chemical process that the bean is undergoing as it
sits there.  Any chemists in the house?
-F
On 2/5/07, Edward Bourgeois  wrote:
<Snip>

3) From: Justin Marquez
On 2/5/07, Floyd Lozano  wrote:
<Snip>
According to our host's website, the CO2 is a result of carmelization
of the natural sugars in the coffee bean during the roasting.
Apparently it takes a while to free itself from the beans.  I think
that info is buried on the "Levels of Roast Pictorials" page.
There is a surprising amount of CO2 in fresh roasted beans.  I made a
1 qt of pour-over coffee recently to go into a thermos and grounds hit
the hot water, they literally "fizzed" a little and foamed up actively
(even with noticeable sound).
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX)

4) From: Ed Needham
Per The Diffusion Kinetics of Carbon Dioxide in Fresh Roasted and Ground 
Coffee
Brent A. Anderson, Eyal Shimoni, Rémy Liardon, and Theodore P.Labuza,
Department of Biosystems and Agricultural Engineering, University of 
Minnesota:
"The carbon dioxide is formed as a result of the many reactions that occur 
including Strecker degradation, pyrolysis of sugars, and the Maillard 
reaction. The carbon dioxide formed is trapped in the coffee and slowly 
diffuses out after roasting and grinding, thus a tempering period is 
required before packaging."
Google Strecker degredation, pyrolisis of sugars and Maillard Reaction and 
read all about them and you'll be a more informed roaster.
Cool stuff.
*********************
Ed Needham®
"to absurdity and beyond!"http://www.homeroaster.com(include [FRIEND] in subject line to get through my SPAM filters)
*********************

5) From: L. Michael Fraley, MD
What I have been using (though only for one batch at a time) is the 
beanvac.  It was given to me, by my business partner, for Christmas.  
It has a battery in it, and it vacuums the air out of the container.  
When the pressure rises in the container, the vac kicks on again, and 
sucks it out again.  Seems to work well, though I think it is 
expensive.  Here is their webpage: http://www.beanvac.com/Michael
On Feb 5, 2007, at 12:42 PM, Floyd Lozano wrote:
my only concern is that any pressure above atmospheric would be enough =
to prevent off gassing and force the CO2 to remain in the bean.  I 
wonder how that would affect the taste.  I also find myself wondering =
about the source of the CO2.  It is a natural waste product of 
respiration (for us, plants expire O2 normally!)  but presumably there =
is nothing living in that bean any more.  Is it just CO2 stuck in the =
cellular matrix that's being squeezed out as the bean contracts as it 
dries / cools / whatever.  Or it's a byproduct of some other chemical =
process that the bean is undergoing as it sits there.  Any chemists in =
the house?
-F
 
On 2/5/07, Edward Bourgeois  wrote: Have been 
using a Foodsaver with wide mouth canning jar attachment to pack my 
green beans with great success. Last week I roasted a couple extra test =
roasts and ended up with more beans than I could quickly use so I put 
the extra to fill a qt jar after 24hr degassing. Vacuumed the jar and 
tightly screwed down the band. After about 48 hrs the lid that was 
sunken due to the vacuuming was now arched from the buildup of 
remaining co2. When I unscrewed the tightened band there was a little 
pop from the release of the co2. My thought is that after vacuuming out =
the oxygen and the beans natural replacement of co2(a preservative)in 
the jar and not near enough pressure to blow the jar the beans should 
have an extended freshness.
<Snip>
L. Michael Fraley, MD

6) From: Leo Zick
That’s hot!

7) From: L. Michael Fraley, MD
Yeah, I really like it.  I do not know how much it cost, but I think it =
might have been kind of pricey.  I think they may have them at The 
Sharper Image.  I am going to go see how much they cost.  I would like =
to have more of them.  I wish they would make a smaller one, as this 
one holds 2 pounds, which is more than I need per container.
I attach a paper label to the top to ID what beans I have in it at any =
given time.  The liner comes out for easy washing.
Michael
On Feb 5, 2007, at 9:22 PM, Leo Zick wrote:
That’s hot!

8) From: Jason Sheldon
Amazon lists them for $40.
On 2/5/07, L. Michael Fraley, MD  wrote:
<Snip>

9) From: L. Michael Fraley, MD
Actually, it says it holds "more than a pound", but when I put a pound =
of fresh roast into it, it seems to be only about half full.  Maybe 2 
pounds would not fit, but it is substantially more than a pound.  It is =
$39.95.  So yeah... pricey.  Glad it was a gift!  ; )
Michael
On Feb 5, 2007, at 9:35 PM, L. Michael Fraley, MD wrote:
Yeah, I really like it.  I do not know how much it cost, but I think it =
might have been kind of pricey.  I think they may have them at The 
Sharper Image.  I am going to go see how much they cost.  I would like =
to have more of them.  I wish they would make a smaller one, as this 
one holds 2 pounds, which is more than I need per container.
I attach a paper label to the top to ID what beans I have in it at any =
given time.  The liner comes out for easy washing.
Michael
On Feb 5, 2007, at 9:22 PM, Leo Zick wrote:
That’s hot!

10) From: raymanowen
The beans are not in a static state when they are roasted. I don't know
where the CO2 comes from, but it displaces the less dense O2 molecules. I
dip the beans out of the jar so I don't pour off any of the CO2. I treat
them like I'm dipping them out of a jar of water- leave the water behind.
The replacement for the poured-off CO2 would be an environmental gaseous
mixture containing free O2 molecules. I dislike coffee that has had any such
unsupervised cohabitation.
It seems likely that with increased external pressure, fewer CO2 gas
molecules would evolve at any time from the roasted beans. The 500g of
Mexican Chiapas that I was careful to roast no further than  at the
threshold of Second, fit easily into a dark glass Knorr boullion jar. The
plastic screw-on lid was not a hermetic seal, and I kept smelling the
wonderful aroma until I delivered them.
Yesterday, I noticed the same jars are still dark brown but of lighter
plastic construction- Boo! The dark brown glass was appealing as a container
once I thought about it. Another day late idea... But the Mason fruit jars
have a polished sealing lip that really seals well with the lids and bands.
Even 14 days post roast, the Mason jars have "puffed" when I opened them. At
that point, I thought they would be pretty dead, but I found an early roast
of Horse that completely changed the opinions under which I was laboring.
Then I did my first-ever blend, 1:1 with some tailings of Sumatra
Mandailing- Just Fabulous. And it sure proved out the sealed jar technique
for me.
Cheers -RayO, aka Opa!
Roasting is the best way to roast coffee-


HomeRoast Digest