HomeRoast Digest


Topic: vacuum pot tips (29 msgs / 1095 lines)
1) From: Robert Pearce
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Hey all,
I just got my vacuum pot today and am looking for any tips.  I brewed my
first pot with nowhere near the amount of coffee grounds the mfg recommended
and it was still unbelievably strong; I knew it was going to be stronger
than my Bunn brewed but hadn't imagined that it would be this strong.
Anyway, it's all a pretty straight forward procedure with only a few
possible variables but here's what I did:
Ground 6 cups in my burr grinder (Cuisinart), I grind midway between Fine
and Medium
Added nearly boiling water to the 5 cup mark (it's a 5 cup brewer), inserted
the top and added coffee
Once all of the water had boiled up (still that little bit in the bottom) I
set my kitchen timer 2 minutes and waited
At the 2 min mark I removed the burner and waited.
Anyway, this coffee is SUPER strong and doesn't really taste like very much
like the last batch of Kona Purple Mountain (just last week) I brewed in my
Bunn.  I realize it's going to taste different but it tastes to me somehow
bitter and a bit burned (the beans were roasted to C++ or so).
Where did I go wrong?  Any suggestions from the expert VC brewers out there?
Robert

2) From: Brett Mason
Can you grind a little more coarse?  I usually grind very coarse, but
I am on the extreme there.  You will get less bitters and more sweet
in the cup...
I have a Cory electric grinder, and a Cory Grindmaster, and both grind
considerably mre coarse than my Rocky can do.  I go the coarse route
with my Cory Vacpot...
Brett
  RWA
On 3/12/07, Robert Pearce  wrote:
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<Snip>
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-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

3) From: Branden Byers
Hey Robert,
What model of vac pot are you using?
By the taste description you describe, it sounds to me as if you have
your temp set too high (assuming you are using a stovetop model)
and/or the grind is off. Try bringing the temp down because the water
will still go up even if the temperature isn't set to HIGH.
Another option to maintain more control over the brewing process is to
put the vac pot on the stove (filter and all) without grounds and then
wait for the water to travel up and THEN add the grounds, stir, and
start timer. This will eliminate the potential of variable in how long
it takes the water to travel up into the top portion. Before entering
the grounds into the water that is bubbling in the top portion, it is
also possible to set the temp of the brew water by inserting a
thermometer and adjusting the temp of the heat supply.
It's definitely not a set it and forget it kind of brewing process but
there are a number of variables that can be tweaked and experimented
with. I didn't like my first cup of vac pot brew but now I love it!
-Branden
On 3/12/07, Robert Pearce  wrote:
<Snip>
ded
<Snip>
ted
<Snip>
 I
<Snip>
ch
<Snip>
my
<Snip>
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<Snip>
re?
<Snip>

4) From: Gerald Newsom
One other suggestion, Robert, is that 2 minutes may be too long.  For my
Yama vacuum pot, I set the timer at either 60 seconds or 70 seconds.  On
rare occasions I might let it go as long as 80 seconds, but never longer
than that.  Try a shorter brew time and see what you get.
Gerald
On 3/12/07, Branden Byers  wrote:
<Snip>
y
<Snip>
r
<Snip>
n
<Snip>

5) From: Andy Thomas
----- Original Message ----
From: Robert Pearce robert.pearce=
[...] here’s what I did:
 
Ground 6 cups in my burr grinder (Cu=
isinart), I grind midway between Fine and Medium
Added nearly boiling wat=
er to the 5 cup mark (it’s a 5 cup brewer), inserted the top and added co=
ffee
Once all of the water had boiled up (still that little bit in the bo=
ttom) I set my kitchen timer 2 minutes and waited
At the 2 min mark I rem=
oved the burner and waited…
 
Anyway, this coffee is SUPER strong [..=
.]
Well, yeah. If "Ground 6 cups," to make five cups of coffee, =
is not a typo, there's your answer! :-)=
Don't get s=
oaked.  Take a quick peek at the forecast
with the Yahoo! Search weather =
shortcut.http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather

6) From: miKe mcKoffee
I'd have to agree with Andy there. 6 cups of coffee grounds for 5 cups of
water could tend to vac brew rather strong. Hmmm, maybe about a ristretto
pull strength with espresso extraction!
OTH on the rare occasion I vac brew any more I still use 10grams coffee per
5oz of water, medium grind, two minute infusion.
Bitterness can be caused by too hot brewing (not usually a problem with vac
pots) OR too fine a grind for given infusion time OR poor grind quality with
too many fines resulting in partial over extracting. I suspect part of the
problem could likely be the third option caused by cuisinart (wannabe burr)
grinder and with burrs of unknown wear.
Kona Kurmudgeon miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmUltimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/	From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Andy Thomas
	Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 9:16 PM
	To: homeroast
	Subject: Re: +vacuum pot tips
	
	----- Original Message ----
	From: Robert Pearce robert.pearce
	[...] here's what I did:
	Ground 6 cups in my burr grinder (Cuisinart), I grind midway between
Fine and Medium
	Added nearly boiling water to the 5 cup mark (it's a 5 cup brewer),
inserted the top and added coffee
	Once all of the water had boiled up (still that little bit in the
bottom) I set my kitchen timer 2 minutes and waited
	At the 2 min mark I removed the burner and waited.
	Anyway, this coffee is SUPER strong [...]
	Well, yeah. If "Ground 6 cups," to make five cups of coffee, is not
a typo, there's your answer! :-)

7) From: Robert Pearce
Thanks for the tip Brett, I'll try a coarser grind in the morning.  =)
Robert

8) From: Robert Pearce
Branden,
I managed to get a Hario TCA-5 and I'm using the little alcohol burner that
came with it.  I wouldn't have thought that the little flame from that
alcohol would have gotten too hot. Should I be heating it differently?
Robert

9) From: Robert Pearce
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
OK, so far it sounds like a coarser grind and less time are in order.
Thanks, keep them coming!  =)
Robert  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Gerald Newsom
Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 8:51 PM
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +vacuum pot tips
One other suggestion, Robert, is that 2 minutes may be too long.  For my
Yama vacuum pot, I set the timer at either 60 seconds or 70 seconds.  On
rare occasions I might let it go as long as 80 seconds, but never longer
than that.  Try a shorter brew time and see what you get. 
Gerald
On 3/12/07, Branden Byers  wrote: 
Hey Robert,
What model of vac pot are you using?
By the taste description you describe, it sounds to me as if you have 
your temp set too high (assuming you are using a stovetop model)
and/or the grind is off. Try bringing the temp down because the water
will still go up even if the temperature isn't set to HIGH.
Another option to maintain more control over the brewing process is to 
put the vac pot on the stove (filter and all) without grounds and then
wait for the water to travel up and THEN add the grounds, stir, and
start timer. This will eliminate the potential of variable in how long
it takes the water to travel up into the top portion. Before entering
the grounds into the water that is bubbling in the top portion, it is
also possible to set the temp of the brew water by inserting a
thermometer and adjusting the temp of the heat supply. 
It's definitely not a set it and forget it kind of brewing process but
there are a number of variables that can be tweaked and experimented
with. I didn't like my first cup of vac pot brew but now I love it! 
-Branden
On 3/12/07, Robert Pearce  wrote:
<Snip>
recommended
<Snip>
inserted
<Snip>
I 
<Snip>
much 
<Snip>
my
<Snip>
there?
<Snip>

10) From: Robert Pearce
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
6 cups is a timed event on my Cuisinart grinder and nowhere near as much as
suggested by the mfg (1 rounded scoop per cup).
Robert  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Andy Thomas
Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 9:16 PM
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +vacuum pot tips
----- Original Message ----
From: Robert Pearce robert.pearce
[...] here's what I did:
Ground 6 cups in my burr grinder (Cuisinart), I grind midway between Fine
and Medium
Added nearly boiling water to the 5 cup mark (it's a 5 cup brewer), inserted
the top and added coffee
Once all of the water had boiled up (still that little bit in the bottom) I
set my kitchen timer 2 minutes and waited
At the 2 min mark I removed the burner and waited.
Anyway, this coffee is SUPER strong [...]
Well, yeah. If "Ground 6 cups," to make five cups of coffee, is not a typo,
there's your answer! :-)  
TV dinner still cooling?
Check out 
"Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV.

11) From: Robert Pearce
Mike,
I suspect you're on to something there but it's what I've got to make due
with.  While my wife encourages me in my coffee adventures she isn't really
a coffee drinker herself and she has trouble reconciling my coffee related
expenditures ($16 for 1lb of the Gesha is seen as a waste of money).  =P
So, until I win the lottery or my company IPO's (about the same odds either
way) I'm going to have to make due with the grinder I have.  =\
Robert

12) From: raymanowen
Q-"Where did I go wrong?"
A-Ground 6 cups in my burr grinder (Cuisinart).
The Grinder Is The Prime Coffee Brewing Implement. Everything else is an
accessory.
You may have set the grinder midway between Fine and Medium, but that is
just a confusion factor for the grinder, as much as me. Look closely at the
grounds. How do they look to you?
Six cups of coffee grounds for one pot! Where do you live- Brobdingnag?
If I had your setup (It's been about 50 years since I brewed in a vac
pot...), I would fill the base with boiling water, assemble the pot with a
wetted gasket, set the grinder for Gravel and grind the recommended quantity
of beans. Put the grounds in the top and set it on the heat. The water will
come up quickly because it was just boiling.
Keep it on low heat long enough to keep the water up for at least two
minutes, then turn off the heat. Moving the pot at all while the water is up
would be Dummkopf for me. Besides, if you cut the heat at two minutes,
there's no hurry to get the coffee down right away. I never drank the coffee
I brewed. My folks loved it and they liked it hot.
I abhor hot liquids and dentists in my mouth- always have. I hate scalding
my tongue every time it happens. Oh, Hello! This FC+ Ethiopian Sidamo is
exquisite. I can't think fast enough to keep up with it. The roast was only
30hrs old when I brewed this [My Way] in the Technivorm.
Mmmm- this is good, good, good.
Cheers -RayO, aka Opa!
Say Goodnight, Gracie-

13) From: Brian Kamnetz
If you have an accurate scale, I would recommend weighing the beans and
grinding all of them. Suggestions tend to vary between 1 gram and 2 grams o=
f
coffee per ounce of water.
Brian
On 3/13/07, Robert Pearce  wrote:
<Snip>

14) From: David B. Westebbe
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
I dunno about the "too long" analysis.
 
I use an old Silex vac pot.  I fill the bottom to the correct level, and
then put it on the stove.  When I hear it boil, I return and shut it =
off.  I
then grind the coffee, put it in the top, and insert the top into the
bottom.  Shortly after I light the flame again, the water starts north.
When enough is up north to make it worth it, I give it a stir and set my
timer for 3 minutes.
 
After 3 minutes, I shut it off and move the pot to a cool burner.  The
coffee takes about a minute to go south, making a total of 4 minutes of
extraction time.

15) From: Jason Sheldon
As I turn off the heat, I like to stir it in a circle a few times.  I
don't know if it matters but I like the cool looking dome that it
forms.
Jason

16) From: David B. Westebbe
Is THAT how you get the dome?  I seem to get one on random occasions, and
never realized why.
I'm going to try it tomorrow AM!
<Snip>

17) From: Robert Pearce
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
LOL!
No, not 6 cups of grounds.  Enough grounds for 6 cups (you can select even
quantities from 4 to 20 or so cups, I'm sure it's timed).
I can't take it too hot either.
Robert  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of
raymanowen
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 3:23 AM
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +vacuum pot tips
Q-"Where did I go wrong? "
A-Ground 6 cups in my burr grinder (Cuisinart).
The Grinder Is The Prime Coffee Brewing Implement. Everything else is an
accessory.
You may have set the grinder midway between Fine and Medium, but that is
just a confusion factor for the grinder, as much as me. Look closely at the
grounds. How do they look to you?
Six cups of coffee grounds for one pot! Where do you live- Brobdingnag? 
If I had your setup (It's been about 50 years since I brewed in a vac
pot...), I would fill the base with boiling water, assemble the pot with a
wetted gasket, set the grinder for Gravel and grind the recommended quantity
of beans. Put the grounds in the top and set it on the heat. The water will
come up quickly because it was just boiling.
Keep it on low heat long enough to keep the water up for at least two
minutes, then turn off the heat. Moving the pot at all while the water is up
would be Dummkopf for me. Besides, if you cut the heat at two minutes,
there's no hurry to get the coffee down right away. I never drank the coffee
I brewed. My folks loved it and they liked it hot. 
I abhor hot liquids and dentists in my mouth- always have. I hate scalding
my tongue every time it happens. Oh, Hello! This FC+ Ethiopian Sidamo is
exquisite. I can't think fast enough to keep up with it. The roast was only
30hrs old when I brewed this [My Way] in the Technivorm. 
Mmmm- this is good, good, good.
Cheers -RayO, aka Opa!
Say Goodnight, Gracie-

18) From: Robert Pearce
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Thanks, I did buy a cheap jewelers scale but immediately proceeded to screw
it up by not reading all of the way through the instructions before
recalibrating them.  Now I just need to find a 200g weight somewhere to make
it all right.  =\
Robert  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Brian Kamnetz
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 12:20 PM
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +vacuum pot tips
If you have an accurate scale, I would recommend weighing the beans and
grinding all of them. Suggestions tend to vary between 1 gram and 2 grams of
coffee per ounce of water.
Brian
On 3/13/07, Robert Pearce  wrote:
6 cups is a timed event on my Cuisinart grinder and nowhere near as much as
suggested by the mfg (1 rounded scoop per cup).
Robert

19) From: Robert Pearce
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
I'm obviously going to have to experiment with the brew time.
That's OK by me, I get to drink more coffee!  =)
Robert  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of David B.
Westebbe
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 5:33 PM
To: homeroast
Subject: RE: +vacuum pot tips
I dunno about the "too long" analysis.
I use an old Silex vac pot.  I fill the bottom to the correct level, and
then put it on the stove.  When I hear it boil, I return and shut it off.  I
then grind the coffee, put it in the top, and insert the top into the
bottom.  Shortly after I light the flame again, the water starts north.
When enough is up north to make it worth it, I give it a stir and set my
timer for 3 minutes.
After 3 minutes, I shut it off and move the pot to a cool burner.  The
coffee takes about a minute to go south, making a total of 4 minutes of
extraction time.

20) From: Jason Sheldon
A nickel weighs 5 grams.  So 40 nickels will weigh about 200g
Jason
<Snip>
ew
<Snip>
ake
<Snip>

21) From: Robert Pearce
Eeexcellent!
Thanks!
Robert

22) From: Andy Thomas
----- Original Message ----
From: Robert Pearce robert.pearce=
Mike,
I suspect you're on to something there but it's what I've =
got to make due
with.  While my wife encourages me in my coffee adventure=
s she isn't really
a coffee drinker herself and she has trouble reconcili=
ng my coffee related
expenditures ($16 for 1lb of the Gesha is seen as a =
waste of money).  =P
You might mention to your wife that a 5 o=
z cup at $16 per lb. costs about 28 cents.
Andy -- just trying to be h=
elpful --=
Looking for earth-friendly autos? 
Brow=
se Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center.http://autos=.yahoo.com/green_center/

23) From: Brett Mason
I have never in my life drank a 5oz cup of coffee....
Brett
  RWA
On 3/13/07, Andy Thomas  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

24) From: Floyd Lozano
Ok, so the 20 oz supermug is only $1.12, still cheaper than the
gigantoguzzelattecino from Starbucks.
On 3/13/07, Brett Mason  wrote:
<Snip>

25) From: Robert Pearce
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
I keep telling her exactly that but for some reason she just doesn't make
the money connection (or didn't.).
Anyway, I think I'm on the way to getting it figured out thanks to all the
help from everyone.  Now my wife is enjoying the coffee I'm making in the
vac pot and tonight she even asked me to make more (that'd be 2 cups for her
this evening).  She's starting to complain about me getting her addicted on
coffee so I must be doing something right!
Now, to start working on her resistance to getting a better grinder.
Robert  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Floyd Lozano
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 9:09 PM
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +vacuum pot tips
Ok, so the 20 oz supermug is only $1.12, still cheaper than the
gigantoguzzelattecino from Starbucks.
On 3/13/07, Brett Mason  wrote: 
I have never in my life drank a 5oz cup of coffee....
Brett
RWA
On 3/13/07, Andy Thomas <   adt0611>
wrote:
<Snip>
really
<Snip>
28 cents.
<Snip> 
<Snip>
unsvbscribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings
<Snip>
--
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

26) From: Michael Snow
Don't use the measurements on the vac pot itself! Those are always  
way off. They seem to usually be "Japanese" cups, by which I mean 5oz  
per cup. I measure 6oz of water per cup in a standard US measuring  
cup, preboil it, dump it into my vac pot, put the top on, and put the  
pot on a low flame. For 1 cup I set the timer for 3 minutes, for 2  
cups 2 minutes, etc. The idea is to have the grounds in contact with  
the water for a total of about 4 minutes, so you have to observe how  
long the coffee takes to all go back into the bottom and deduct that  
from the total time you set your timer for. I use a medium-fine grind  
and find the flavor extraction superior to using a coarser grind.
<Snip>

27) From: Andy Thomas
Me neither, but I tend to brew in multiples of 5 oz. -- usually 20 oz for t=
he morning brew.  The point is that $16/lb is pretty cheap when you break i=
t down to cost-per-drink.
----- Original Message ----
From: Brett Ma=
son 
To: homeroast
Sent: Tue=
sday, March 13, 2007 8:35:42 PM
Subject: Re: +vacuum pot tips
I h=
ave never in my life drank a 5oz cup of coffee....
Brett
  RWA
On =
3/13/07, Andy Thomas  wrote:
> ----- Original Message =
----
> From: Robert Pearce robert.pearce
>
>
> Mike,
> =
I suspect you're on to something there but it's what I've got to make due=
> with.  While my wife encourages me in my coffee adventures she isn't r=
eally
> a coffee drinker herself and she has trouble reconciling my coffe=
e related
> expenditures ($16 for 1lb of the Gesha is seen as a waste of =
money).  =P
>
>
>
> You might mention to your wife that a 5 oz cu=
p at $16 per lb. costs about 28 cents.
>
> Andy -- just trying to be he=
lpful --
>
>
>
>=
> Looking for earth-friendly autos?
=
<Snip>
://autos.yahoo.com/green_center/
>=
> homeroast mailing list
>http://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailm=an/listinfo/homeroast
> To change your personal list settings (digest opt=
ions, vacations, unsvbscribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.ht=ml#personalsettings
>
-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast=.freeservers.com
homero=
ast mailing listhttp://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast=To change your personal list settings (digest options, vacations, unsvbs=
cribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings==
Bored stiff? Loosen up... 
Download and play hundre=
ds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.http://games.yahoo.com/games/front

28) From: Robert Pearce
Thanks Michael,
I was curious about that myself so I filled to the 5 cup mark then emptied
the pot into a measuring cup.  I got 22oz out of the pot and proceeded to
measure out my beans from there.  =)
Robert

29) From: Robert Pearce
It'd be worth it even it did cost more than *$s, it simply tastes so much
better!  =)
Robert


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