HomeRoast Digest


Topic: Hardwater/caustic chemicals down Bric'! > RE: +Crystal Geyser and not enough antidepressants (7 msgs / 456 lines)
1) From: miKe mcKoffee
Worked fine earlier today, but my Bricoletta is currently down and unusable.
Maybe my choice to use moderately hard 7g water rather than bottled or RO or
distilled for the past 15 months attributed, maybe weekly Cafiza
backflushing, maybe water only backflushing every single shot session.
Regardless, no shots for now!
Or maybe she's merely down for normal semi-annual preventative maintenance
with her HX line, group and boiler (over filled) soaking in 2Tbs/qt citric
acid solution. Yes that caustic stuff much akin to lemon juice which is in
fact foodgrade from a Brewers' supply house (for use in must). There's a
huge difference in the caustic chemicals used to break down and commercially
descale a badly scaled and clogged machine versus preventative descaling
with citric acid. BTW preventative citric acid descaling procedure discussed
in depth with tech at Chris' Coffee before descaling for the first time last
August, who concurred should work just fine. (Procedure discussed in depth
on HB forum.) The hardest part of the procedure is just letting her sit for
4 or 5 hours! The biggest fear most espresso machine techs seem to have is
people don't know what they're doing and will damage a machine. Think about
it, the same sites that recommend descaling single boiler machines (because
it's a no brainer through the tank process) recommending not to descale HX
machines (because it does take a bit of knowledge of your machine). Once
convinced you do in fact have some technical accumen they'll usually sing a
different story. 
Kona Kurmudgeon miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmUltimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/
<Snip>
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2) From: Brett Mason
Sorry to hear your Bric is being uncooperataive...  Report back when you get
the doctor's diagnosis....
Brett
On 4/4/07, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

3) From: miKe mcKoffee
Prognosis is she'll continue taking a nap while tripping on acid for another
3 hours or so, then she'll be just fine;-)
miKe
	From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Brett Mason
	Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 11:24 AM
	
	Sorry to hear your Bric is being uncooperataive...  Report back when
you get the doctor's diagnosis....
	 
	Brett
	
	On 4/4/07, miKe mcKoffee  wrote: 
		Worked fine earlier today, but my Bricoletta is currently
down and unusable.
		Maybe my choice to use moderately hard 7g water rather than
bottled or RO or 
		distilled for the past 15 months attributed, maybe weekly
Cafiza
		backflushing, maybe water only backflushing every single
shot session.
		Regardless, no shots for now!
		
		Or maybe she's merely down for normal semi-annual
preventative maintenance 
		with her HX line, group and boiler (over filled) soaking in
2Tbs/qt citric
		acid solution. Yes that caustic stuff much akin to lemon
juice which is in
		fact foodgrade from a Brewers' supply house (for use in
must). There's a 
		huge difference in the caustic chemicals used to break down
and commercially
		descale a badly scaled and clogged machine versus
preventative descaling
		with citric acid. BTW preventative citric acid descaling
procedure discussed 
		in depth with tech at Chris' Coffee before descaling for the
first time last
		August, who concurred should work just fine. (Procedure
discussed in depth
		on HB forum.) The hardest part of the procedure is just
letting her sit for 
		4 or 5 hours! The biggest fear most espresso machine techs
seem to have is
		people don't know what they're doing and will damage a
machine. Think about
		it, the same sites that recommend descaling single boiler
machines (because 
		it's a no brainer through the tank process) recommending not
to descale HX
		machines (because it does take a bit of knowledge of your
machine). Once
		convinced you do in fact have some technical accumen they'll
usually sing a 
		different story.

4) From: Sandy Andina
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Yeah, Baratza/Cafe West told me not to descale my Livia (an HX) but  
to descale Silvia; and recommends against backflushing Silvia with  
anything other than plain water, and rarely at that. Perhaps it's  
okay to descale an e61-group machine (which my Livia is not).  I  
doubt using 7g water would have been the culprit if you were  
descaling carefully as per tech support's guidance. (BTW, citric acid  
is available fairly cheaply as "sour salt" crystals--more cheaply in  
the Kosher food section than in the spice aisle. Gotta dissolve them  
thoroughly, though; and they are also very good for soaking off  
burned-on foods from stainless).
On Apr 4, 2007, at 1:15 PM, miKe mcKoffee wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy Andina
www.sandyandina.com
www.myspace.com/sandyandina
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	charsetO-8859-1
Yeah, Baratza/Cafe West told me =
not to descale my Livia (an HX) but to descale Silvia; and recommends =
against backflushing Silvia with anything other than plain water, and =
rarely at that. Perhaps it's okay to descale an e61-group machine (which =
my Livia is not).  I doubt using 7g water would have been the culprit =
if you were descaling carefully as per tech support's guidance. (BTW, =
citric acid is available fairly cheaply as "sour salt" crystals--more =
cheaply in the Kosher food section than in the spice aisle. Gotta =
dissolve them thoroughly, though; and they are also very good for =
soaking off burned-on foods from stainless).
On Apr 4, =
2007, at 1:15 PM, miKe mcKoffee wrote:
Worked fine earlier today, but my Bricoletta is = currently down and unusable.Maybe my = choice to use moderately hard 7g water rather than bottled or RO = ordistilled for the past 15 months attributed, = maybe weekly Cafizabackflushing, maybe water = only backflushing every single shot session.Regardless, no shots for now! Or maybe = she's merely down for normal semi-annual preventative = maintenancewith her HX line, group and = boiler (over filled) soaking in 2Tbs/qt citricacid solution. Yes that caustic stuff much akin to = lemon juice which is infact = foodgrade from a Brewers' supply house (for use in must). There's = ahuge difference in the caustic chemicals used = to break down and commerciallydescale a = badly scaled and clogged machine versus preventative descalingwith citric acid. BTW preventative citric acid = descaling procedure discussedin depth with = tech at Chris' Coffee before descaling for the first time lastAugust, who concurred should work just fine. = (Procedure discussed in depthon HB forum.) = The hardest part of the procedure is just letting her sit for4 or 5 hours! The biggest fear most espresso machine = techs seem to have ispeople don't know what = they're doing and will damage a machine. Think aboutit, the same sites that recommend descaling single = boiler machines (becauseit's a no = brainer through the tank process) recommending not to descale = HXmachines (because it does take a bit of = knowledge of your machine). Onceconvinced you = do in fact have some technical accumen they'll usually sing adifferent story.  Kona = Kurmudgeon miKe mcKoffeeURL to Rosto = mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://mdmint=.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmfirst not know. And in knowing = know I know not. Each Personal enlightenmentfound exploring the many divergent foot steps of = Those who have gone before. Sweet Maria's List - Searchable = Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/ 

5) From: miKe mcKoffee
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
There seems to be some confusion, let me clarify!!! There's nothing wrong
with my Bricoletta other than she's tripping on acid. (citric acid that is)
Once she "comes down" and her systems are fully flushed with water she'll be
just fine.
 
The second paragraph of my OP beginning with "Or maybe" the "or maybe"
is/was tongue in cheek. She "is" merely down for "normal preventative
descaling". A procedure I've down twice before on the Bric' with zero
problems. (And many others have done on their HX machines of various makes
and models.)
 
miKe  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Sandy Andina
Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 11:43 AM
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: Hardwater/caustic chemicals down Bric'! > RE: +Crystal Geyser
and not enough antidepressants
Yeah, Baratza/Cafe West told me not to descale my Livia (an HX) but to
descale Silvia; and recommends against backflushing Silvia with anything
other than plain water, and rarely at that. Perhaps it's okay to descale an
e61-group machine (which my Livia is not). I doubt using 7g water would have
been the culprit if you were descaling carefully as per tech support's
guidance. (BTW, citric acid is available fairly cheaply as "sour salt"
crystals--more cheaply in the Kosher food section than in the spice aisle.
Gotta dissolve them thoroughly, though; and they are also very good for
soaking off burned-on foods from stainless).
On Apr 4, 2007, at 1:15 PM, miKe mcKoffee wrote:
Worked fine earlier today, but my Bricoletta is currently down and unusable.
Maybe my choice to use moderately hard 7g water rather than bottled or RO or
distilled for the past 15 months attributed, maybe weekly Cafiza
backflushing, maybe water only backflushing every single shot session.
Regardless, no shots for now!
Or maybe she's merely down for normal semi-annual preventative maintenance
with her HX line, group and boiler (over filled) soaking in 2Tbs/qt citric
acid solution. Yes that caustic stuff much akin to lemon juice which is in
fact foodgrade from a Brewers' supply house (for use in must). There's a
huge difference in the caustic chemicals used to break down and commercially
descale a badly scaled and clogged machine versus preventative descaling
with citric acid. BTW preventative citric acid descaling procedure discussed
in depth with tech at Chris' Coffee before descaling for the first time last
August, who concurred should work just fine. (Procedure discussed in depth
on HB forum.) The hardest part of the procedure is just letting her sit for
4 or 5 hours! The biggest fear most espresso machine techs seem to have is
people don't know what they're doing and will damage a machine. Think about
it, the same sites that recommend descaling single boiler machines (because
it's a no brainer through the tank process) recommending not to descale HX
machines (because it does take a bit of knowledge of your machine). Once
convinced you do in fact have some technical accumen they'll usually sing a
different story. 

6) From: Eddie Dove
So ... do you mix up a gallon or so and do this in a plastic bucket or
what?  Perhaps you could do a new post with somewhat of a treatise on
your process? ... with the caveat that this is how you do it and
everyone else is responsible for themselves ...
I did get the trippin' reference.
Eddie
-- 
Docendo Discimus
Home Coffee Roasting Blog and Profiles for the Gene Cafehttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 4/4/07, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:">http://southcoastcoffeeroaster.blogspot.com/Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/On 4/4/07, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>

7) From: miKe mcKoffee
Yes, I mix 8Tbs citric acid with a gallon (filtered) hot water)in an empty
and cleaned 1gal apple cider jug. Then simply feed Bric's inlet water line
into jug, rotary pump sucks it right in no problem. 
The HX descaling "treatise" written by others (with contributions by me) can
be found on Home-Barista forum here:http://tinyurl.com/yqwauhIncludes
specifics on how to over fill boiler etc.
Most any questions pertaining to espresso techniques or various espresso
machine usage and maintenance can be found answered on HB forum. And if not
answered previously probably the highest concentration available to come up
with a solution of those who've succumbed to the Dark Side.
Kona Kurmudgeon miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://mdmint.home.comcast.net/coffee/Rosto_mod.htmUltimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/
<Snip>


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