I agree fully Les - I am not anti-Behmor, in fact I would like to see more competition as you say. I wish Hottop could consider price drops too, that would be great and manye competition could inspire that. But I fear that the economics of producing and marketing a home roaster probably don't allow it. I know for a fact that several manufacturers (Genecafe, Hearthware to name 2) came into this market thinking about wild growth, a home roaster in every household. I have always maintained that this is a niche, for enthusiasts-hobbyists or maybe even for people who do it almost begrudgingly because they acknowledge the huge quality leap in freshness and like the control of roasting their own. That is NOT a lot of the coffee-drinking population. Honestly, I really don't understand how things add up for the manufacturers, but I am sure that they have to maintain high prices because of low production and low sales. I can't believe for a second that even if a Ronco is involved, it would change the fundimental nature of home roasting as a niche. So the drawback of homeroasting is that it's not going to attract a lot of companies to develop machines. But this niche nature is what I like about it so much. It makes us a community. Heck, we are all do-it-yourself types anyway. Thats why I love the fact that people build their own, modify machines, and hotrod a poppery 1 or poppery 2. In this respect, I would love to see someone develop a "Heathkit" approach to a homeroaster, a DIY kit largely based on cheap, existing components. Wouldn't that be cool? A PID controlled heat gun? Standard instructions and supplimental parts to turn a bread machine, popper, etc etc into a a really nice roaster. Anyway, I am daydreaming... tom <Snip> -- "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters" Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting - Tom & Maria http://www.sweetmarias.com Thompson Owen george_at_sweetmarias.com Sweet Maria's Coffee - 1115 21st Street, Oakland, CA 94607 - USA phone/fax: 888 876 5917 - tom_at_sweetmarias.com
Tom, Nice daydream and some of it might come true. The Heathkit approach was valid to a DIY group because we learned a lot from building the kits. I miss the old Heathkit catalogs. We still have a short wave radio and a few other kits assembled years ago. Now, a Ronco roaster would be interesting. Not sure my mind can handle the informercial that would come with it. Living way out in the Utah dessert is one reason we home roast. Supply trips to town are infrequent and home roasting is the only way we can have fresh-roast coffee. Also, it is fun. Thanks to you and the Sweet Maria team for making the home roasting hobby a rewarding one. -- Jim in Skull Valley
ah, but what a beautiful daydream it is, Tom. can't wait to get my Harvey order including 5lb. of Harrar to for my own DIY setup. i wonder how many "Heathkit" eWok/CO takers i could get (after all, it can roast up to 2lbs. in less than 20 min (about 2-3 of that being preheat, not actual roasting time, no claims of being smokeless) for about $100. no preset profiles, but judging by my results, who needs 'em? sweetmarias wrote: <Snip>
I tried making a PID controlled heat-gun/bread-machine. I consider it a failure, but I learned from it. I know others have reported good results from a stationary heatgun, but my results were substantially better when I waved the gun around in response to the smells and colors, without the PID controller. John
<Snip> good point ; human input into the roast process is a. cheap and b. superior. So maybe a pid controlled heat gun roaster isn't the best example, but what about someone who could produce a cast metal frame for a drum roaster along with some sheet metal shrouding for a DIY kit, and then give specs for the parts: a standard motor, a standard blower/fan, a bike chain drive (hey, that and a leather belt is what my probat uses), gears from a bike derailer, some standard bearings, RK could supply the drum. As far as cooling, I say leave that out - a fan and a colander work, or something of the sort. saves a lot of money to take care of cooling independently. okay, back to cupping: i am evaluating some small lot tanzania right now - one of them tastes like lawn trimmings with a bit of herbicide on top - hope that is not literally what this horrible flavor is. Just cup the first JBM sample - very average. I just can't in good conscience offer a $22/lb coffee that is so uninspiring. good body though. to be fair, it is too fresh and i should recup tomorrow. we'll see, but if JBM doesnt work out then I think this will be our 3rd straight year to reject it. not sure but maybe that should be a badge of honor rather than shame. -tom -- "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters" Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting - Tom & Maria http://www.sweetmarias.com Thompson Owen george_at_sweetmarias.com Sweet Maria's Coffee - 1115 21st Street, Oakland, CA 94607 - USA phone/fax: 888 876 5917 - tom_at_sweetmarias.com
A electric homeroaster for indoor use that would do more than 8ozs is no problem as long as the user only roasts to full city or lighter(short of second crack) is not too hard to do. It's the second crack and beyond that creates the problems. Too much smoke and too much temp. creates much risks. A afterburner to reduce smoke requires high temps that are also an added risk hazard. I've been working on a up to 2lb electric roaster for a co. overseas (not china). Such a roaster will need venting and "as you roast" chaff exiting which means all kinds of added complications. I've solved the chaff problem but the smoke and safe and easy venting is tough. And to have an electric roaster for only outdoor use adds it's own safety complications. I have not heard if Joe's roaster will do a roast to rolling second or beyond with the presets. I saw the control panel that asks you to choose batch size and preset profile. If one selects 1lb and the deepest roast profile, will it actually do a darker roast? My guess is one might be able to cheat by roasting 1/2lb but setting it to 1lb and being able to get a darker roast but again there are risks for all by doing so. For most of us lighter roasts are what we prefer but for someone who wants to go to the dark side the risks increase rapidly. I'm also looking into a Made in USA cottage industry production of a roaster for pro-sumer types with some sort of a use at your own risks type statement but again it's not easy to avoid liabilities. The law suits I've heard of involving home appliances makes one wonder how anyone can make anything safe enough for idiots. I guess that why the "for idiots" series of books is so popular.
you said: <Snip> roaster for only outdoor use adds it's own safety complications.<<< Ed, I am not sure that I understand this comment. thanks in advance, ginny ---- Edward Bourgeois wrote: <Snip>
pchforever wrote: <Snip> Water. JeffO
I'm sure Ed has even more concerns; here are two that come to mind. People will use an extension cord that looks like a beat up hunk of = twine, and plug it into an outlet with loose contacts from yanking the = vacuum cleaner cord out of it, and sip cocktails while the cord = insulation is on fire in the house. They will roast barefoot in a puddle of water after getting out of the = pool, using an ungrounded extension cord in a non-gfci outlet. Those are just the obvious ones. You might not believe what home = inspectors find plugged into the outlet.... John
"...to have an electric roaster for only outdoor use adds it's own safety complications." Streetlights and neon gas station signs, et cetera, are electrical devices for outdoor use. The H-V power distribution wiring has been buried to separate it from brain donors and beautify barracks style subdivisions. I say, as has been mentioned before, it is self-regulating when people play with Reddy Kilowatt. Outside, where it could get wet or be wet, it's not the same as running the Hoover on the carpet or vacuuming out the Ford in the garage. I think the safety aspect is obvious. Cheers -RayO, aka Opa! Roast coffee, not flesh- "...to have an electric roaster for only outdoor use adds it's own safety complications." On 5/23/07, pchforever wrote: <Snip> -- "When the theme hits the bass, I dance the Jig!" - -Virgil Fox at the Mighty Wichita (ex- NYC Paramount) WurliTzer- 1976
"...to have an electric roaster for only outdoor use adds it's own safety complications." not really - just wear rubber boots. tom (joke) -- "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters" Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting - Tom & Maria http://www.sweetmarias.com Thompson Owen george_at_sweetmarias.com Sweet Maria's Coffee - 1115 21st Street, Oakland, CA 94607 - USA phone/fax: 888 876 5917 - tom_at_sweetmarias.com
stereoplegic writes: <Snip> Are the plans on-line? Are you gonna share or is the design proprietary? Not that I'm going to build it now but I like to bookmark this sort of thing. rdc -- Robert D. Crawford robdcraw To lead people, you must follow behind. -- Lao Tsu
I think she was joking. Or did you want the design of her roaster (if that was not a joke also)? At 02:21 5/24/2007, you wrote: <Snip> John Nanci AlChemist at large Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/
actually, she is a he (i know my hair is long-not that any of you have ever seen it-but from what i've seen yours is a lot longer, Alchemist), and yes, he (i) was joking, though you can get an idea here: snipurl.com/eWOK_CO it's basically just an SC/CO minus the SC, with the shaft of a much stronger motor protruding through the electric wok instead, driving the top of a lampshade for stirring arms (bent to fit the contour of the wok), with the heating element of the electric wok running through a 600w dimmer (to keep from tripping my breaker and for better profile control). John wrote: <Snip>
The bread machine can be modified to give much better circulation of the beans in the heat from the HG, a la Drum. A perf metal cylinder, driven by the kneading drive spindle, with a spiral elevator welded to it, would circulate the beans and duct the heat nicely. The PSC motor is the same as used in ceiling fans, so even though it's AC only and has no brushes, the speed and power output can be varied. With some experimentation, the heat gun would be fixed and could be set on High and fed variable power. One shortcoming would be that, unlike a drum, it could not circulate a small bean load very well. With the right spiral/ agitator design, it could effectively "sweep" the beans on the bottom of the pan. Heat distribution in a small load would be outrageously inefficient- it couldn't even loft partial loads in a cylindrical pan. Maybe the Benton Harbor Gang would add a conic section to the bottom of the cylindrical pan. Or was it Saint Joseph? Maybe New Life for a DAK bread machine- the one with the glass dome top. A DA-Kit? Cheers -RayO, aka Opa! Got Grinder?
Alchemist John writes: <Snip> Actually, I was interested in the roaster design. More curiosity than anything else considering that, after buying my Rocky, I have blown my allowance until after my Christmas and B-day money comes in. rdc -- Robert D. Crawford robdcraw So this is it. We're going to die.