HomeRoast Digest


Topic: rest question (20 msgs / 733 lines)
1) From: Donald Varona
I know that resting of roasted beans is an important component of having
the best flavor in the cup.  However, I'm not sure what is important in
the rest:  is it merely time, or should it include access to air?  Does
the presence of oxygen allow the beans to "cure" somewhat for best
flavor, or is it merely time that improves the flavor?
I usually keep my beans in an airtight container even after roasting,
but this seems to slow the "curing" that should occur.  Recently I've
been keeping them open overnight, and this seems to speed up the cure.
Any thoughts on this?  Thanks.
--dv

2) From: Aaron
Air is generally a bad thing, you don't want them to sit in air because
they stale quicker that way or go rancid or whatever will happen to them.
For the first night after roasting, you will want them in a closed (but
not sealed) container, that will let the co2 gas that is made while they
begin resting, vent off, but keeps the air out.  After the first day or
so, then you can seal them up.  Some folks vac seal them, or mason jar
them or just plain sealable container them.
I did a little test about a year ago trying various methods of keeping
beans and overall, vac kept them the longest, followed by a sealed
container of some sorts, lastly a zip lock baggie was worse as far as aging.
Aaron

3) From: GHolli7210
I've had much success using Sweet Maria's gold foil valve bags. They seal out 
the air and discharge the carbon dioxide keeping the roasted beans fresh for 
quite awhile, in some cases for well over 1 week. Just allow the roast to cool 
by whatever method you choose, I like to give a lite spray of purified water 
and toss in 2 colanders until cool then rest for about 1 hour then seal in the 
foil bags.
Hope this helps,
Jerry
************************************** See what's free athttp://www.aol.com.

4) From:
dv:
gotta be darth vador right?
you actually answered your own question.
get the co2 out, now, out bad air but
then it is a matter of taste.
rest actually means, by some, letting dem beans de-gass, out old co2, rsst to others is lay on the cabana in a nice chair and wait until the beans smell ok.
ginny
lots of luck darth,
some never rest the beans, they simply dump them into their hopper and try them day after day until they are gone.
---- Donald Varona  wrote: 
<Snip>

5) From:
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please see AL GORE,
ginny
---- Aaron  wrote: 
<Snip>

6) From: Justin Marquez
"Hot Air" is a bad thing...??
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX)
On 5/28/07, pchforever  wrote:
<Snip>

7) From: Ross
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Looks like it's time to give this thread a rest before someone takes the =
bait Ginny put out, come on Ginny, it may be a total joke but think =
about it, you know better, please, we are all better off if nobody does =
this kind of thing. There are a lot of hot heads out there from all =
sides of every political issue, I don't want to hear from them, while =
I'm trying to learn about coffee.
Thanks,
Ross

8) From: Tom Ulmer
This is a multipart message in MIME format.
Then I suggest you don't give that dog anything to hunt, especially since I
know Gin's a semi-blue dog democrat ( except for that NORML thing). Of
course, I don't believe there's been a finer embodiment of the Democratic
doctrine since Anne Richards kicked some good old boy ass while wearing high
heels.  
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Ross
Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 6:45 PM
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +rest question
Looks like it's time to give this thread a rest before someone takes the
bait Ginny put out, come on Ginny, it may be a total joke but think about
it, you know better, please, we are all better off if nobody does this kind
of thing. There are a lot of hot heads out there from all sides of every
political issue, I don't want to hear from them, while I'm trying to learn
about coffee.
Thanks,
Ross

9) From: Ross
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Hi Tom,
I was asking in general for people not to let the dogs out.   I just =
want to learn how not to burn my coffee roasts
Ross

10) From: Brian Kamnetz
Donald,
This question has been discussed extensively, without a great deal of
consensus regarding length of rest that is helpful or necessary. The
greatest consensus does seem to tend, if I understood correctly, toward
using coffee within 10 or so days of being roasted. Some maintain that
within that timespan there is little need to protect roasted coffee from
air. Also, some believe that sealing beans too soon after a roast can blunt
flavors. A while back Ray O mentioned, if I understood correctly, storing
beans in glass containers and "dipping" them out, so that the CO2 does not
escape. I have been doing that with half of each roast, and storing the
other half in glass jars that are loosely covered for about a day, then
sealed (but not vac) glass jars, and I can't tell the difference with most
varieties, and have not noticed any trends.
On rest in general, bottom line as I understand it is that most (not all)
people agree that some rest is beneficial to many, even most, varieties, and
that it is best to use up roasted coffee within 10 days, give or take 2-3
days.
Brian
On 5/28/07, Donald Varona  wrote:
<Snip>

11) From: Lynne Biziewski
Thank you Ross - what coffee did you drink today?
I had a wonderful Misty Valley - I'm almost at the end of mine,
and I am so grateful that someone (sorry, I forgot who!) posted
their profile - even though I roast stove top, the explanation was
good enough for me to follow.
It has been SO good - and I only left it for last because
it wasn't all that great whenI roasted it before. Now I KNOW
it was me!
Lynne
On 5/28/07, Ross  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
"In a world of conflict, the truth must survive."
Kevin Sites, 9/16/2005 blog

12) From: Ross
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Brian,
I have been putting my fresh roast in Jars and periodically giving the =
lid a loose twist to allow air to escape.  I don't have any evidence to =
suggest that this is a good practice.  I'm just lazy and waiting for =
evidence.  Thank you for yours.  
Ross

13) From: Brett Mason
Ross you're begging for the dogs to come out...  So maybe I'll try both
sides...
The Conservative lets the beans do their own resting.  It's up to the beans
to rest appropriately - the marketplace will decide which amount of rest is
best, and will vote with their money.  And of course some people will want
the latest newest beans, paying a premium and getting beans before their
time.  Others will wait for the beans to get old, and will buy them at a
discount.  They will boast of the money they are saving and the fact that
they outdid the professional es in both price and quality.  Then of course
there are some who know the leaders, and they go to the same country clubs.
These will get the beans just right, and get a good insiders deal on them.
Others will  feel this is totally inappropriate, and will protest...
The more Liberal will recognize that everyone can do a little better.  Thos=
e
who wait too long, and don't really get their value will benefit by a few
more controls, ensuring the beans get out there fresher.  These folks will
protest of too much oversight and governance, but they will actually have a
much better cup than that old swill they used to get.  The ones who bought
too early will benefit from a little quality enforcement, and will be
surprised to see the controls work in their favor.  The insiders will find
they have to buy at the same rate as everyone else.  The roasters will find
they make a little less because someone has to pay for the care and
oversight.  They of course will raise prices to cover their costs, and
everyone will dig a little deeper.
The laissez faire people like me just roast a couple pounds, kind of how we
like it.  We will cool it, and then throw it into a big Mason Jar.  The
first day we'll make two pots...  The second day, we'll make two pots.  The
third day, we'll make two pots, and comment about what a nice coffee this
is.  The fourth day we'll make two pots.  Remarkable, rested four days, and
yummy.  The fifth day, we'll make two pots.  Yes, a nice cup.  The sixth da=
y
we'll make a pot and a half.  And doggone it, time to quickly roast again -
I'm OUT....
OK, well Ross, hope that dispels all the political worries, and helps you
with a bit of roasting and resting...  and Ginny didn't even launch on that
one!
Brett
On 5/28/07, Ross  wrote:
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e
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igh
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nd
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n
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-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

14) From: Ross
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Hi Lynne,
I too have some aged Misty Valley that is still very good, had it this =
morning, made a few pots with that white ceramic pourover pot of SM's, =
exquisite.  drinking wine now.   Yes, we can be happy when we with our =
good roasting records and excellent turns of the burners hit the sweet =
spot but we only have ourselves to blame when it is not good.  I have =
had a bad week as far as coffee roasting goes because I tried some new =
things with my RK drum and basiclly burned or baked a lot of coffee.  =
Lots of relatives were here for graduation week and I had to roast fresh =
and serve it with no rest because it was better than my stock of =
baked/burned beans from a week ago.  At least I was not in such despair =
that I ran to the super market!  I fell back on the Baize which tastes =
great right out of the roaster.  I survived, they liked it and drank it =
in quanity.   Only to have to explain to my wife what to do with all =
that other coffee I wasn't using.  I told her it was an age test, very =
important part of the art.
Ross

15) From: Ross
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

16) From: Lynne Biziewski
Ha! And it is an art, isn't it?
Company - I have a hard time with my dogs demanding my attention (although
removing the fire alarm has
helped keep my littlest dog from demanding my attention while roasting!) And
there is the dilemma - I would want to share my coffee with relatives - but
the disruption would certainly ruin my roasts, too.
Glad you didn't have to resort to grocery stuff. Almost all my worst has
been better than all the coffee I've had out. (Except for one that I ruined
beyond recognition when my Emma was rushed to the emergency animal hospital
& we almost lost her). That just showed how much of an art roasting really
is...
Lynne
On 5/28/07, Ross  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
"In a world of conflict, the truth must survive."
Kevin Sites, 9/16/2005 blog

17) From:
Ross:
It was a total joke, I am watching Book TV and he is speaking, had too.
air and all.
no bait.
ginny
---- Ross  wrote: 
<Snip>

18) From: Donald Varona
I understand that O2 is "generally" a bad thing.  I've read everyone's 
responses and my question still remains.  Maybe I should be more precise 
in my question.
I want to know if anyone has compared "resting" (meaning one or two days 
after roast), in-air versus in sealed containers, and seen how the 
different types of resting affect the flavor.  If I rest them in-air, 
the "ripening" seems to happen faster, meaning that perhaps the oxygen 
is causing the flavor changes that we associate with a rest.
I'm asking if anyone has actually tested this themselves.  It's easy to 
assume that since O2 is bad in some ways that it must always be bad-- 
but who has experimented here?  Science often comes from breaking away 
from assumptions.
In no way is my coffee in danger of going stale.  My batches are small, 
and I use it far too quickly for even a two-day exposure to air to 
really affect anything.
--dv
Aaron wrote:
<Snip>

19) From: MichaelB
I don't have any experimental data, just some anecdotal findings from my own
use. I always kept my roast jars open for the first 12 hours or so before
sealing. Based on reading, listening to others, and intuition, I now leave
them partially open for 3 or 4 days. If I see oil on the beans I will start
sealing from that point onward, otherwise continuing to leave them open.
It's rare that I have beans longer than 7 days so I can't speak for long
term effects. Could I taste the difference between sealing and not in a
blind tasting? I think so but just haven't bothered to try it. I'm happy
with the idea that this way is better.
On 5/29/07, Donald Varona  wrote:
<Snip>
--
MichaelB

20) From: Ed Needham
Actually, sitting in the open air the oils don't get that rancid smell or 
taste, but open air lets all the volatile aromas and flavors escape over 
time.


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