HomeRoast Digest


Topic: Behmor 1600 Espresso Report (32 msgs / 988 lines)
1) From: Les
I pulled shots today from coffee roasted 7 days ago in the Behmor 1600 at
the PNWG.  These beans were roasted at a profile 3 and I had a one pound
roast done under less than ideal conditions.  I had Joe (the inventor of the
Behmor) doing the roast.  He hit the cool button at a city roast.  This is
where I wanted the roast to be.  I was able to visually see the beans very
well, and smell the roast as well.  One of my concerns was with the cooling
of the beans.  The beans cool inside of the roaster, and it didn't seem like
a big blast of air was going through.  However it must have been good
enough!  Poor cooling becomes very evident after five days in my opinion and
experience.  A well cooled bean will not fade or become bitter until about
day 14.  However a poorly roasted and cooled bean won't make it past day 5.
The cappos and ristrettos this morning were simply outstanding.  I know that
one roast doesn't prove everything, but I do believe that the potential is
there for a very fine homeroaster.  You are not going to get a
$1,000.00Hottop performance out of a $300.00 Behmor, but I think there
is good value
in this roaster if it proves to be reliable.  I think it is much better than
the I-Roast or the Genie Cafe from what I have seen.  So disagree with me,
flame me if you want but that is my opinion of my first experience with the
Behmor 1600.  Hopefully Alchemist John will bring it over next week for me
to put a few more roasts through it.  I was a sceptic, but now  you can call
me hopeful.
Les

2) From: Justin Nevins
What about the smoke aspect of it? Is it anywhere close to smokeless?
Justin Nevins
On 6/23/07, Les  wrote:
<Snip>

3) From: Les
Yes it is almost smokeless.  Joe uses a coil to burn the smoke off, so you
don't have filters to change.  It is a good design.
Les
On 6/23/07, Justin Nevins  wrote:
<Snip>

4) From: Rich
Thanks for the update Les, this is what I am hoping to hear about the Behmor 1600.
--Original Message Text---
From: Les
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 19:10:11 -0700
I pulled shots today from coffee roasted 7 days ago in the Behmor 1600 at the PNWG.  These beans were 
roasted at a profile 3 and I had a one pound roast done under less than ideal conditions.  I had Joe (the 
inventor of the Behmor) doing the roast.  He hit the cool button at a city roast.  This is where I wanted 
the roast to be.  I was able to visually see the beans very well, and smell the roast as well.  One of my 
concerns was with the cooling of the beans.  The beans cool inside of the roaster, and it didn't seem like 
a big blast of air was going through.  However it must have been good enough!  Poor cooling becomes very 
evident after five days in my opinion and experience.  A well cooled bean will not fade or become bitter 
until about day 14.  However a poorly roasted and cooled bean won't make it past day 5.  The cappos and 
ristrettos this morning were simply outstanding.  I know that one roast doesn't prove everything, but I do 
believe that the potential is there for a very fine homeroaster.  You are not going to get a $1, 000.00 
Hottop performance out of a $300.00 Behmor, but I think there is good value in this roaster if it proves to 
be reliable.  I think it is much better than the I-Roast or the Genie Cafe from what I have seen.  So 
disagree with me, flame me if you want but that is my opinion of my first experience with the Behmor 
1600.  Hopefully Alchemist John will bring it over next week for me to put a few more roasts through it.  
I was a sceptic, but now  you can call me hopeful. 
Les

5) From: Rich
Whatever it does in the smoke department it will blow the doors off of any other 1 Lb roaster in its 
price range.
On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 21:23:46 -0500, Justin Nevins wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

6) From: Rich
So, contrary to the general wisdom expressed in several forum posts, it does work.  To be able to take 
1 Lb to FC+ and not have all of the smoke detectors in full bray will be nice... 
--Original Message Text---
From: Les
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 19:26:04 -0700
Yes it is almost smokeless.  Joe uses a coil to burn the smoke off, so you don't have filters to change.  
It is a good design.
Les
On 6/23/07, Justin Nevins  wrote: What about the smoke aspect of it? Is 
it anywhere close to smokeless?
Justin Nevins
On 6/23/07, Les < les.albjerg> wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>

7) From: Les
Rich,
From what I was able to observe, it works very well.  I watched 3 other
roasts.  I was sneaky and had Joes roast one of my favorite beans at one of
my favorite roast levels to give it a really hard test.   The Behmor models
from the forums were pre-production models.  This was the first production
model to be seen and used by all of us lucky folks at the PNWG V at Mike
McKoffee's house.  Let me tell you, compared to a one pound roast on my RK
drum, there was no smoke!  I am sure if you roasted inside there wouldn't be
a problem with smoke detectors.
Les
On 6/23/07, Rich  wrote:
<Snip>

8) From: Rich
Thanks Les,
My situation is that I consume about 1LB/week of coffee all by myself.  I live in far western Iowa and 
can not be outside in the depth of winter or summer.  So roasting is an indoor sport.  I do not want to 
do a pound by the ounce method either.  A sample roaster or the like requirers an outside vent or a 
right pricy afterburner and costs well into 4 figures as you know.  The Behmor is the last great hope 
at a decent indoor 1 lb roaster.  I can deal with quite a bit of smoke what I can not deal with is the 
setup and teardown time of a BBQ grill drum.  I do not have the available space available to keep it in 
a standby state even if I roast a pound a week.  I can make counter space for something the size of the 
Behmor and it is ready to go at the press of a button so to speak.  The propane grill and RK drum is a 
great deal if the climate is conducive and you have the space to allow it to remain setup between 
roasts.  Not to mention the price of the Behmor is half of the maybe equivalent machine off of ebay, 
which is a home converted oven.
The smoke detectors ae at the 8 foot level and the peak inside is at 14.5 feet above the floor, I can 
handle a lot of smoke.  If you need a search warrant to find the smoke from the Behmor then I am 
sold.
--Original Message Text---
From: Les
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 19:56:43 -0700
Rich,
From what I was able to observe, it works very well.  I watched 3 other roasts.  I was sneaky and had 
Joes roast one of my favorite beans at one of my favorite roast levels to give it a really hard test.   The 
Behmor models from the forums were pre-production models.  This was the first production model to 
be seen and used by all of us lucky folks at the PNWG V at Mike McKoffee's house.  Let me tell you, 
compared to a one pound roast on my RK drum, there was no smoke!  I am sure if you roasted inside 
there wouldn't be a problem with smoke detectors. 
Les
On 6/23/07, Rich  wrote: So, contrary to the general wisdom expressed in several 
forum posts, it does work. To be able to take 1 Lb to FC+ and not have all of the smoke detectors in full bray will be 
nice... 
--Original Message Text---
From: Les
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 19:26:04 -0700 
Yes it is almost smokeless. Joe uses a coil to burn the smoke off, so you don't have filters to change. It is a good 
design.
Les
On 6/23/07, Justin Nevins  wrote: What about the smoke aspect of it? Is it anywhere 
close to smokeless? 
Justin Nevins
On 6/23/07, Les < les.albjerg > wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>

9) From: Sheila Quinn
I'm very glad to hear it! Someday I may want a "real" roaster, and I'm 
happy to have more options.
Sheila
<Snip>

10) From: Alchemist John
Keep in mind, ALL the forum posts were speculation. This is an actual 
production model.  I know there were some wisps of smoke at the 
gathering test, but so far for me, it has been totally smokeless up 
into 2nd, though not rolling.
I have made this offer on a couple forums with virtually no 
response.  What do people want to know?  I am mostly testing for 
cocoa, but I am doing coffee.  So far, profile 1 and 2 are too fast 
with 8 oz (1st and 2nd merge).  I will try 3 next with 8 oz and then 
go from there.  Contrary to Les, I still have issues seeing the roast 
with the chaff tray in place.  But it is indeed a great value with 
what I see so far.
At 19:46 6/23/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

11) From: Alchemist John
I am going to take a 1 lb "test" roast to French tomorrow and see 
just what the smoke capability is.  At how most people on the roast 
list, so far there is no issue indoors at all.  It is definitely 
seeming better than just Tom's prototype "smoke-less" model.
At 20:19 6/23/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

12) From: Rich
Ok,
Glad you asked. what I am looking for is how does it perform on the darker roasts, FC+ and Vienna 
and even into French roast.  Does the afterburner keep up?  can you see the beans well enough to not 
over roast them?  How is the cooling performance?  I am looking at this as a roaster that will be doing 
roasts at 16 oz stating weight.  How does it perform when doing 3 or 4 roasts back to back?
--Original Message Text---
From: Alchemist John
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 21:35:54 -0700
Keep in mind, ALL the forum posts were speculation. This is an actual production model.  I know there 
were some wisps of smoke at the gathering test, but so far for me, it has been totally smokeless up 
into 2nd, though not rolling.
I have made this offer on a couple forums with virtually no response.  What do people want to know?  I 
am mostly testing for cocoa, but I am doing coffee.  So far, profile 1 and 2 are too fast with 8 oz (1st 
and 2nd merge).  I will try 3 next with 8 oz and then go from there.  Contrary to Les, I still have issues 
seeing the roast with the chaff tray in place.  But it is indeed a great value with what I see so far.
At 19:46 6/23/2007, you wrote:
So, contrary to the general wisdom expressed in several forum posts, it does work. To be able to take 1 Lb to FC+ and 
not have all of the smoke detectors in full bray will be nice... 
--Original Message Text---
From: Les
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 19:26:04 -0700
Yes it is almost smokeless. Joe uses a coil to burn the smoke off, so you don't have filters to change. It is a good 
design.
Les
On 6/23/07, Justin Nevins < piercednevins > wrote: What about the smoke aspect of it? Is it anywhere 
close to smokeless?
Justin Nevins
On 6/23/07, Les < les.albjerg > wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

13) From: Dennis & Marjorie True
I ended up with the first batch from the 1600 that was done at PNWG 
(profile 1 straight heat) and I am almost done with it now and I have to 
admit I am digging the roast (a little bit darker than I usually go but 
still very good!)  after all the proof is in the cup right no matter 
what you say god or bad if the end result in the cup is crap or gold 
that is what really matters and the 1600 IMO delivers.
Dennis
Les wrote:
<Snip>

14) From: mikeraz
Alchemist John wrote:
<Snip>
There are five stock profiles with the device.  How much trouble is it to
modify them?  What are your options for modifying them?  Do the mods work as
hoped?
-- 
      Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon  
    Be appropriate && Follow your curiosity
         http://www.patch.com/words/
  The fortune cookie says:
You're not an cafaholic unless you go to the meetings.

15) From: Les
Rich said, "I am looking at this as a roaster that will be doing
roasts at 16 oz stating weight. How does it perform when doing 3 or 4
roasts back to back?"   First off it will do the 16 oz as advertised.
Second I want to bust the myth of back to back with any of the plug
and play roasters.  You have to let them all cool down before doing
another batch if you want total consistency.  Even the 1000 dollar
Hottop.    I am sure you could do back to back with the Behmor, but
you are going to have to watch the roast and hit the cool button
early.  Sounds as if you want that capacity you need to move to a RK
drum.
Les

16) From: Les
This is a $300.00 machine.  There are no modifications of the actual
profiles.  However you can add or subtract time.  If you want a
tweaker machine, you can build an Uber Popper like Plain Mike, or get
an RK drum, or spend a grand on a Programmable Hottop.
Les
On 6/24/07, Michael Rasmussen  wrote:
<Snip>

17) From: Rich
Les,
How is the documentation of the 5 pe programmed profiles?  Is it complete?
Rich
On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 07:56:11 -0700, Les wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

18) From: Les
That I don't know.  I have not seen the manuel for the machine yet.
From meeting Joe, I think it will be a complete manuel.  This guy
gives attention to detail and this roaster is a passion and dream for
him.
Les
On 6/24/07, Rich  wrote:
<Snip>

19) From: Alchemist John
OK, some details.
There are as stated 5 profiles that all have different shapes of 
power input.  The programs are %time based, not temperature 
based.  What this means is you have SOME profile modification 
control, but not on the fly.  For instance, one (not P1) profile is 
1/3 time at 70% power, 1/3 at 80% power, 1/3 at full power.  If your 
initial roast time before you start the roast is 18 minutes, it will 
spend 6 minutes at each power setting.  If you set your initial time 
to 12 minutes, each time will be 4 minutes.  But, here is where you 
have some modification power (although I think a spreadsheet will do 
well to "see" it) if you take that 12 minute roast, start it, and 
then add 4 minutes, you suddenly have a profile that is 1/4 70%, 1/4 
80%, 1/2 100%.  The time only adds on to the last final setting.
At 08:11 6/24/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

20) From: Rich
I have spoken with Joe and I also got the impression that 'attention to detail" was a very important 
item.  I was just curious as to what the 5 profiles are.
You mentioned the RK for production.  Standing at a hot BBQ grill in the summer here is not 
pleasant, early morning you need gills to breathe and after sundown you are mosquito food.  The 
winter does not need explanation.  There is a high appeal in a device that will live in the 
environmentally controlled kitchen.
Rich
On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 08:11:07 -0700, Les wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings

21) From: Rich
Got it, A spreadsheet setup to do the calculations and draw the plots would be easy to write and allow 
the mathematically challenged a great deal of "tweaking" room
--Original Message Text---
From: Alchemist John
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 09:00:20 -0700
OK, some details.
There are as stated 5 profiles that all have different shapes of power input.  The programs are %time 
based, not temperature based.  What this means is you have SOME profile modification control, but 
not on the fly.  For instance, one (not P1) profile is 1/3 time at 70% power, 1/3 at 80% power, 1/3 at 
full power.  If your initial roast time before you start the roast is 18 minutes, it will spend 6 minutes 
at each power setting.  If you set your initial time to 12 minutes, each time will be 4 minutes.  But, 
here is where you have some modification power (although I think a spreadsheet will do well to "see" 
it) if you take that 12 minute roast, start it, and then add 4 minutes, you suddenly have a profile that 
is 1/4 70%, 1/4 80%, 1/2 100%.  The time only adds on to the last final setting.
At 08:11 6/24/2007, you wrote:
That I don't know.  I have not seen the manuel for the machine yet.
From meeting Joe, I think it will be a complete manuel.  This guy
gives attention to detail and this roaster is a passion and dream for
him.
Les
On 6/24/07, Rich  wrote:
Les,
How is the documentation of the 5 pe programmed profiles?  Is it complete?
Rich
On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 07:56:11 -0700, Les wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettingsJohnNanci">http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettingsJohnNanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

22) From: Alchemist John
I actually have half of this already and will complete it this 
week.  If acceptable to Joe Behm, I will put it out there for general viewing.
At 09:29 6/24/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

23) From: Rich
I should have guessed......
--Original Message Text---
From: Alchemist John
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 11:36:07 -0700
I actually have half of this already and will complete it this week.  If acceptable to Joe Behm, I will put 
it out there for general viewing.
At 09:29 6/24/2007, you wrote:
Got it, A spreadsheet setup to do the calculations and draw the plots would be easy to write and allow the 
mathematically challenged a great deal of "tweaking" room
--Original Message Text---
From: Alchemist John
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 09:00:20 -0700
OK, some details.
There are as stated 5 profiles that all have different shapes of power input. The programs are %time based, not 
temperature based. What this means is you have SOME profile modification control, but not on the fly. For instance, 
one (not P1) profile is 1/3 time at 70% power, 1/3 at 80% power, 1/3 at full power. If your initial roast time before you 
start the roast is 18 minutes, it will spend 6 minutes at each power setting. If you set your initial time to 12 
minutes, each time will be 4 minutes. But, here is where you have some modification power (although I think a 
spreadsheet will do well to "see" it) if you take that 12 minute roast, start it, and then add 4 minutes, you suddenly 
have a profile that is 1/4 70%, 1/4 80%, 1/2 100%. The time only adds on to the last final setting.
At 08:11 6/24/2007, you wrote:
That I don't know. I have not seen the manuel for the machine yet.
<Snip>
gives attention to detail and this roaster is a passion and dream for
him.
Les
On 6/24/07, Rich  wrote:
Les,
How is the documentation of the 5 pe programmed profiles? Is it complete?
Rich
On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 07:56:11 -0700, Les wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettingsJohnNanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

24) From: John Moody
Yes, and including bean mass as a variable should allow quite a range of
profiles.  Who will be first to hack the logic board and interface it to a
laptop? :-)
John

25) From: Randall Nortman
On Sun, Jun 24, 2007 at 02:52:01PM -0400, John Moody wrote:
<Snip>
I do that sort of thing professionally, but I have no plans to buy
this roaster anytime soon.  Maybe in a year or two, depending on how
the reviews come out.  If anybody wants to lend me a unit to void the
warranty on, though...
I think the limiting factor on computer-control mods will be finding a
way to get a temperature probe into the bean mass.  From what I've
heard, the drum isn't designed for that.  The best you'll be able to
do is control the environment temperature.

26) From: Les
Rich,
I know your weather problem.  I grew up just north of you in western
Minnesota.  Most people don't realize that summers are almost worse than
winters.  You know why my favorite saying is, "The midwest is a great place
to be from."  I can RK roast in the front of my garage year-round in
southern Oregon.
Les
On 6/24/07, Rich  wrote:
<Snip>

27) From: Rich
The weather does tend to dictate outdoor activities here in this part of the country.  Between the 
weather and no space available to setup a BBQ grill / RK system and leave it assembled and ready to 
go tends to severly limit roasting options. the 1 kg commercial roaster with afterburner is out of my 
price range, unfortunately.
Rich
--Original Message Text---
From: Les
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 12:32:59 -0700
Rich,
I know your weather problem.  I grew up just north of you in western Minnesota.  Most people don't 
realize that summers are almost worse than winters.  You know why my favorite saying is, "The 
midwest is a great place to be from."  I can RK roast in the front of my garage year-round in southern 
Oregon. 
Les
On 6/24/07, Rich  wrote: I should have guessed......
--Original Message Text--- 
From: Alchemist John
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 11:36:07 -0700 
I actually have half of this already and will complete it this week. If acceptable to Joe Behm, I will put it out there for 
general viewing.
At 09:29 6/24/2007, you wrote: 
Got it, A spreadsheet setup to do the calculations and draw the plots would be easy to write and allow the 
mathematically challenged a great deal of "tweaking" room
--Original Message Text--- 
From: Alchemist John
Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2007 09:00:20 -0700
OK, some details.
There are as stated 5 profiles that all have different shapes of power input. The programs are %time based, not 
temperature based. What this means is you have SOME profile modification control, but not on the fly. For instance, 
one (not P1) profile is 1/3 time at 70% power, 1/3 at 80% power, 1/3 at full power. If your initial roast time before you 
start the roast is 18 minutes, it will spend 6 minutes at each power setting. If you set your initial time to 12 
minutes, each time will be 4 minutes. But, here is where you have some modification power (although I think a 
spreadsheet will do well to "see" it) if you take that 12 minute roast, start it, and then add 4 minutes, you suddenly 
have a profile that is 1/4 70%, 1/4 80%, 1/2 100%. The time only adds on to the last final setting. 
At 08:11 6/24/2007, you wrote:
That I don't know. I have not seen the manuel for the machine yet.
<Snip>
gives attention to detail and this roaster is a passion and dream for 
him.
Les
On 6/24/07, Rich  wrote:
Les,
How is the documentation of the 5 pe programmed profiles? Is it complete? 
Rich
On Sun, 24 Jun 2007 07:56:11 -0700, Les wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings
<Snip>http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettingsJohnNanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

28) From: Alchemist John
First off, full credit to Joe for the profile adjustments.  I did 
handle the interrogation, but he gave me (and will anyone) some of 
the inside, under the hood programming.  It does give technically 
quite the number of profiles, although some will not be that different.
Tom, with further conversation with Joe, it looks like it IS probably 
temperature controlled.  I heard the thermostat switching at "70%", 
counted up off time and on time and initially it was right on 70/30 
(14 seconds on, 6 seconds off) and made the wrong assumption.  But as 
the roasted warmed up, it was changing it's cycle time.  Joe 
confirmed that 70% is "illustrative" not actual and that the Chinese 
programers probably used a simple variable thermostat for 
control.  He is verifying though.
As for cool area roasting, doesn't seem to be much of an issue.  I 
roast in my shop and it is cool.  So far, I have been taking to 
pre-heating.  1.25 minutes on puts the temperature right at 120 
C.  You can't go higher as there is an internal safety switch that 
prevents the roaster from starting if the internal temperature is over 130 C.
Finally, a dimmer, as most would surmise here won't work unless you 
use two.  Each element is about 5 amps - too much for most 
dimmers.  Variac?  Should not be a problem although I don't know if 
the whole thing can be run through a variac or if it has to be split 
wired.  Actually, the more I think about it, you don't want to dim 
the afterburner, so split wired would be the only real way.
At 12:39 6/25/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

29) From: Alchemist John
bare nichrome wire
At 07:18 6/26/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
John Nanci
AlChemist at large
Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalthttp://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

30) From: Dan Bollinger
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Curious, does this use a quartz element or bare nichrome wire as the =
'afterburner?'  
  First off, full credit to Joe for the profile adjustments.  I did =
handle the interrogation, but he gave me (and will anyone) some of the =
inside, under the hood programming.  It does give technically quite the =
number of profiles, although some will not be that different.  
  Tom, with further conversation with Joe, it looks like it IS probably =
temperature controlled.  I heard the thermostat switching at "70%", =
counted up off time and on time and initially it was right on 70/30 (14 =
seconds on, 6 seconds off) and made the wrong assumption.  But as the =
roasted warmed up, it was changing it's cycle time.  Joe confirmed that =
70% is "illustrative" not actual and that the Chinese programers =
probably used a simple variable thermostat for control.  He is verifying =
though.
  As for cool area roasting, doesn't seem to be much of an issue.  I =
roast in my shop and it is cool.  So far, I have been taking to =
pre-heating.  1.25 minutes on puts the temperature right at 120 C.  You =
can't go higher as there is an internal safety switch that prevents the =
roaster from starting if the internal temperature is over 130 C.
  Finally, a dimmer, as most would surmise here won't work unless you =
use two.  Each element is about 5 amps - too much for most dimmers.  =
Variac?  Should not be a problem although I don't know if the whole =
thing can be run through a variac or if it has to be split wired.  =
Actually, the more I think about it, you don't want to dim the =
afterburner, so split wired would be the only real way.
  At 12:39 6/25/2007, you wrote:
    snip.. Anyway, I feel that the interface, and the programs are =
acceptable, and Alchemist points out an interesting way to alter the =
results: adding time to a roast will add it to the final roast stage at =
full power. I did not realise that, and am going to play around with it =
later today. I mean, in the end the fact that this roaster does not rely =
on temperature sensing in terms of programming might end up being a =
strength. It makes it more of a basic machine and it has been said that =
adding a simple dimmer switch might (emphasis on MIGHT) allow for some =
more fluid, user-input in terms of heat control. I need to check this =
out for myself, but this might "fix" the way these preset programs =
finish (i.e. you can manually taper off the heat after 1st crack while =
the roaster "thinks" it is sending 100% power to the heating element. If =
not a dimmer, maybe a variac. Is PID control more of a possibility =
here??? Dunno...
    One issue I would like to resolve before offering the machine: how =
will it be influenced by low ambient temperatures. I feel this machine =
will NOT end up being a kitchen-countertop appliance in most households. =
If people have to set up in the garage to roast, how will the roast be =
influenced? For better or worse, California in summer is not a great =
place to test variable ambient temperatures!
    I am beginning to get more comfortable with the Ronco thing. The =
main aspect, maybe the only aspect, that I care about with them is =
support: will they back up defective machines, will they readily supply =
parts. We have suppliers that are so easy to work with (ie, if we dont =
have a unit or a part they TRUST us that we are not making up a story =
about a customer receiving a broken or defective machine, and they ship =
it direct, asap) and others who seem to suspect us and everyone else of =
deceiving them. Its really hard to deal with the later. And if customers =
call direct to Ronco with an issue, are they going to be solicited to =
buy spray on hair or a ronco rotisserie? I'm kidding. In fact, Joe is =
probably the smartest guy on the planet for handing off all the day to =
day headaches to Ronco. Other things about the machine that I was unsure =
about are starting to make sense to me: the drum construction and =
material, etc. In general, I have never had a bad comment about the =
solid chasis, motor, etc. No debate there.
    Tom
    -- 
    ==
                      "Great coffee comes from tiny roasters"
               Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting  -  Tom & Maria
                         http://www.sweetmarias.com                   Thompson Owen george_at_sweetmarias.com
    ==
        Sweet Maria's Coffee - 1115 21st Street, Oakland, CA 94607 - USA
                phone/fax: 888 876 5917 - tom_at_sweetmarias.comJohn Nanci
  AlChemist at large
  Zen Roasting , Blending & Espresso pulling by Gestalt
 http://www.chocolatealchemy.com/

31) From: Justin Marquez
What is the maximum current draw for the unit?
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX)
On 6/24/07, Alchemist John  wrote:
<Snip>

32) From: Dan Bollinger
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
That might make it a maintenance item to consider in reviews. Nichrome =
oxides, the hotter it gets the faster it oxides. I don't know how hot it =
needs to get to act as an afterburner, but it seems to me it would have =
to be pretty hot.
Dan


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