HomeRoast Digest


Topic: Panama coffees! (47 msgs / 1956 lines)
1) From: DeCambre.Peter
I will be out of the office starting  11/26/2002 and will not return
until 12/02/2002.
I will respond to your message when I return.
homeroast mailing listhttp://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast

2) From: javafool
I hadn't seen it mentioned yet, but these are the coffees I have been
waiting for and they have arrived:
1) Panama Auction Lot - Mama Cata Gesha
2) Panama Esmeralda Especial - Gesha Cultivar
3) A surprise arrival, Panama Bambito Estate
They are all at relatively reasonable prices compared to some of the past
Panama prizes. Actually, they are all reasonable prices, just a little
higher than some of the other offerings. 
Thanks SM, you just keep offering these irritable wonders.

3) From: Stephen Carey
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I just received a pound of Panama Boquete - Lerida Estate Peaberry, 
can you tell me if you have tried this and your impression of 
it?  Does it fall into what you call the "Panama prizes?"
Thank you for your time.  Still learning all about this.
At 08:14 PM 7/28/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
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I just received a pound of Panama Boquete - Lerida Estate
Peaberry, can you tell me if you have tried this and your impression of
it?  Does it fall into what you call the "Panama
prizes?"
Thank you for your time.  Still learning all about this.
At 08:14 PM 7/28/2007, you wrote:
I hadn't seen it mentioned yet,
but these are the coffees I have been
waiting for and they have arrived:
1) Panama Auction Lot - Mama Cata Gesha
2) Panama Esmeralda Especial - Gesha Cultivar
3) A surprise arrival, Panama Bambito Estate
They are all at relatively reasonable prices compared to some of the
past
Panama prizes. Actually, they are all reasonable prices, just a
little
higher than some of the other offerings. 
Thanks SM, you just keep offering these irritable wonders.
homeroast mailing list
http://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroastTo change your personal list settings (digest options, vacations,
unsvbscribes) go to
http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings--=====================_214442218==.ALT--

4) From: miKe mcKoffee
The Lerida is Caturra & Catuai cultivars and would be very different in the
cup from the Gesha offerings. Also different than the Panama Bambito Estate
Typica, Bourbon, Caturra, Catuai offering but not as extreme a difference.
The Bambito I'd expect to be better balanced and smoother than the all "Cat"
Lerida. But only one way to know for sure!
Pacific Northwest Gathering VIhttp://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/	From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Stephen Carey
	Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2007 5:41 PM
	
	I just received a pound of Panama Boquete - Lerida Estate Peaberry,
can you tell me if you have tried this and your impression of it?  Does it
fall into what you call the "Panama prizes?"
	
	Thank you for your time.  Still learning all about this.
	
	At 08:14 PM 7/28/2007, you wrote:
	
		I hadn't seen it mentioned yet, but these are the coffees I
have been
		waiting for and they have arrived:
		
		1) Panama Auction Lot - Mama Cata Gesha
		2) Panama Esmeralda Especial - Gesha Cultivar
		3) A surprise arrival, Panama Bambito Estate
		
		They are all at relatively reasonable prices compared to
some of the past
		Panama prizes. Actually, they are all reasonable prices,
just a little
		higher than some of the other offerings. 
		
		Thanks SM, you just keep offering these irritable wonders.

5) From: Les
I just ordered the max allowed on the Gesha coffees and some of the
Bambito estate.
The Lerida Estate Peaberry is excellent!  I love a good Panama.
Les
On 7/28/07, Stephen Carey  wrote:
<Snip>

6) From: miKe mcKoffee
Good to hear from you Javafool. Thanks for the irritating irrestible heads
up:-) Not one but two relatively affordable Gesha offerings! 
May (or may not) pass on the Bambito since have 7# left of the Panama
Boquete - Maunier Estate picked up earlier this year and stash getting
precariously too far above 100# again... Gotta get the Kafe opened so stash
size won't be an issue anymore!
Pacific Northwest Gathering VIhttp://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/
<Snip>
<Snip>

7) From: javafool
The timing on the Gesha was perfect for me. I am just finishing the last of
my treasured Gesha from the last batch SM sold. That is what I drank this
morning and I have enough for about two more small pots. My total stash is
getting on the high side so I think this will be my last purchase for a few
months. Every time I tell myself that it is like a New Year's resolution,
and I never have been much on keeping those.
Good luck on the Kafe miKe. Somehow I thought it was already open. I hope
the Kafe goes very well for you and you have a lot of fun to go with your
new business. I can remember reading from Tom's journal a few years back
when he said he really needed to bring in about $1000 more for the month to
keep his doors open. He has come a long way since I bought that Zas grinder
and a couple pounds of Costa Rican coffee he had just roasted. 
Terry
miKe said: Good to hear from you Javafool. Thanks for the irritating
irrestible heads
up:-) Not one but two relatively affordable Gesha offerings! 
May (or may not) pass on the Bambito since have 7# left of the Panama
Boquete - Maunier Estate picked up earlier this year and stash getting
precariously too far above 100# again... Gotta get the Kafe opened so stash
size won't be an issue anymore!
Pacific Northwest Gathering VIhttp://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee

8) From: Bob
Les wrote:
<Snip>
Same here. Man, this is going to be good!
Bob

9) From: miKe mcKoffee
Will either of the two new Panama Gesha offerings will sell out before Tom
updates the SM homepage saying they're available I wonder? Already done my
part to make it happen too:-)  Being automatically emailed when the SM
homepage changes does no good for new hidden gems if it isn't changed so
thanks again for the heads up Javafool. No way want to miss the Gesha. Tom's
getting sneaky so they'll last longer, breaking his modus operandi of
talking about new arrivals before putting them in the cart with write-ups!
Pacific Northwest Gathering VIhttp://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/

10) From: Vicki Smith
miKe, I saw it on my updates from Tom's blog. He seems to put the 
updates there pretty quickly.
v
miKe mcKoffee wrote:
<Snip>

11) From: Stephen Carey
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I may be new to this, but when I see all of you speaking so highly of 
this coffee I just couldn't keep out of the act.  I do hope it is 
still in stock, the order went through, but I don't know if the 
system will stop an order if it runs out at the check out point or 
later via email.
I need to drink more coffee if I am to roast all of this.  The cool 
thing is that I can take it to dinners instead of wine, one friend 
already asked me to roast enough for her birthday dinner and these 
are discerning people, and she is the one who is interested in 
learning to roast.  That would be great for me, my partner doesn't 
drink coffee, so it is just me and gifting it when the time is right.
I just tried a cup of my fifth roast, for only about 6 hours old it 
was truly very good.  I suspect that in a day it will be at its sweet 
spot - said with little experience but much reading!
At 10:01 PM 7/28/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
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I may be new to this, but when I see all of you speaking so
highly of this coffee I just couldn't keep out of the act.  I do
hope it is still in stock, the order went through, but I don't know if
the system will stop an order if it runs out at the check out point or
later via email.  
I need to drink more coffee if I am to roast all of this.  The cool
thing is that I can take it to dinners instead of wine, one friend
already asked me to roast enough for her birthday dinner and these are
discerning people, and she is the one who is interested in learning to
roast.  That would be great for me, my partner doesn't drink coffee,
so it is just me and gifting it when the time is right.
I just tried a cup of my fifth roast, for only about 6 hours old it was
truly very good.  I suspect that in a day it will be at its sweet
spot - said with little experience but much reading!
At 10:01 PM 7/28/2007, you wrote:
Will either of the two new
Panama Gesha offerings will sell out before Tom
updates the SM homepage saying they're available I wonder? Already done
my
part to make it happen too:-)  Being automatically emailed when the
SM
homepage changes does no good for new hidden gems if it isn't changed
so
thanks again for the heads up Javafool. No way want to miss the Gesha.
Tom's
getting sneaky so they'll last longer, breaking his modus operandi
of
talking about new arrivals before putting them in the cart with
write-ups!
Pacific Northwest Gathering VI
http://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:
http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I
must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal
enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone
before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archives
http://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/homeroast mailing list
http://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroastTo change your personal list settings (digest options, vacations,
unsvbscribes) go to
http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings--=====================_220690109==.ALT--

12) From: Les
Your in good shape Stephen.  Your order should go through.
Les
On 7/28/07, Stephen Carey  wrote:
<Snip>

13) From: DJ Garcia
Sigh ... OK, I'll sort of double post, since I mentioned it in the =
"yellow
bean road" thread, but I'm again over-stashed (OK, more over-stashed) =
with
those Panamas (or about to when the mail delivers) - I had to order the =
max
before they disappeared. Can't resist those Panamanian beans ...
DJ

14) From: Kevin
Darn!!  I'm way over my stash limit...must exercise self control.  The
Esmeralda Gesha from last year was amazing...should I, shouldn't I....Argh!!

15) From: miKe mcKoffee
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
When it comes to a coffee like Panama Gesha stash size whether pushing it,
edging over, way over or  hugely gigantically even monstrously over limit is
irrelevant. Same would go for an ISH offering.
 
Pacific Northwest Gathering VIhttp://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Kurmudgeon miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/ 
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Kevin
Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 12:59 PM
Darn!!  I'm way over my stash limit...must exercise self control.  The
Esmeralda Gesha from last year was amazing...should I, shouldn't I....Argh!!

16) From: Les
My stash is divided into an A Stash and a B Stash
A Stash has coffees like Panama Gesha
                                    All Kona coffees
                                    All CoE coffees
                                    ISH
                                    Special Prep coffees for SM
                                    Uganda Bugisu
B Stash all others.
A Stash is well under 30 pounds at the moment so no problem ordering eight
pounds of Panama, and the CoE from Columbia.
Les
On 7/30/07, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>

17) From: Bob
Les wrote:
<Snip>
Les,
Great idea. I might add a C stash, but that may be nitpicking too much. 
Most of my A stash would be from Africa. I would include the Kona and CoE.
Bob

18) From: Kevin
miKe,
What does ISH mean?
Kevin

19) From: Brett Mason
Isle St. Helena ... or something close....  It's an estate who makes great
coffee...  so they say...
Brett
On 7/30/07, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

20) From: Justin Marquez
Here ya go:http://www.sweetmarias.com/coffee.reviewarc.pre-2000.htmlScroll down to:
  *Isle of Saint Helena*
There were a couple of magical years for this coffee, but none has been
available or has not made the grade in quite a while. The last time it was
available and good, apparently it was the stuff of which legends are made.
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX)
On 7/30/07, Kevin  wrote:
<Snip>
--

21) From: Homeroaster
I had a pound a few years back and nothing has come close to comparing
since.  It was a magical brew.  I have some of the Geisha now, and will
roast it very soon.  Maybe...maybe it can come close.
*********************
Ed Needham
"to absurdity and beyond!"http://www.homeroaster.com*********************

22) From: Jason
I got one lb of the Gesha last year, I have been holding off roasting it,
and keep eyeing it up in it's cute lil vac seal bag.  I think it might be
time to pull it out and roast some since I just placed my order for the two
new offerings Tom has, it will be my first Gesha.
I almost ordered a techivorm today for it but just couldn't talk myself into
it.

23) From: Justin Marquez
On 7/31/07, Jason  wrote:
<Snip>
This is going to sound sacreligious to many. I bought much earlier
this year 1# each of some Kona, some Aussie Mountain Top and some of the
second picking Gesha. I spent about $60 on 3 pounds total, including UPS
shipping. They were all wonderful coffees. I gifted my sister with most of
the Kona and Aussie since she apparently has a "thing" for Kona. (She said
she thought maybe she did like the Aussie a little better.)
The regular stuff we drink at home costs anywhere between $2.50 and $7.00 a
pound delivered or picked up locally. Were those three special coffees
between 3 and 8 times more enjoyable than the regular stuff? Not to me (but
then, we've already established that I am NOT a supertaster). The Gesha was
truly a unique coffee experience, and I encourage folks to try it
occasionally, but the price of it is getting out of hand for regular
enjoyment for me. To be truthful, I think the Panama Carmen 1800+ coffee  is
just about my all-time fave "special coffee".
I find much more enjoyment out of finding a truly great coffee at a
reasonable price which I can freely enjoy every day and share quickly with
others than spending large bucks for what seems to me the snob appeal of it.
I guess I am just too much of a cheapskate redneck to drop $20 on a single
pound of coffee and not feel guilty about it.
Mind you I am not really complaining about the price - apparently there are
plenty of folks "out there" who *can* tell enough of a difference in the
taste to make it worth $20 a pound and more. I just don't buy it because I
can't tell the difference.
(Well, there goes the last of my meager stash of CSA points, down the tube!)
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music,
Justin Marquez (Cypress, TX)

24) From: Brett Mason
Justin - THANKS!
You nailed my spec for coffee - Must be fresh roasted, exceptionally good,
and priced such that a spilt pound in the BBQ won't ruin my day!  I have a
thing for Uganda Bugisu, and Costa Rica "Cafe Vida" ...  and I am in the
$2.50-$7.00 range myself as well...
Uncommonly Tasty Common Man Coffee 4 Me
Brett
On 7/31/07, Justin Marquez  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

25) From: Stephen Carey
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Justin,
I get just what you are saying.  I am so new to this that I can't 
tell for sure if I can taste all of the nuances of the various 
coffees.  I ordered some of the Gesha because of the stir it caused 
here by people whom I respect, solely based on their postings.  For 
me, it is worth a one time investment.  If I can tell the difference 
just from experience to date, I will use it only for the most special 
of events.  And, once I know that I am sure that I am roasting it 
correctly I would give it as a gift to either of two friends who can 
really taste the differences in coffees and teas.
For me, at this early stage, I am looking for the one coffee that I 
want to be my staple, my everyday very fine coffee, for me and for 
guests.  I have only roasted a few, but I have bought plenty of 
freshly roasted coffee in the past and have an idea.
The odd thing is that the coffees I am leaning toward would probably 
not be at the top of anyone's list, but I figure it is me who has to 
like it.  So, if others think it pedestrian, fine.  However, from 
what can tell of this list and its members, they would respect that I 
found something I liked through roasting it myself and making it kind 
of "my coffee."  I find a great deal of open minded members here.
And in the end, it still comes down to the fact that I like it and I 
don't get swayed easily should others differ with my selection, after 
all, I am buying it, roasting it and most importantly, drinking it.
Stephen
At 11:42 AM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
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Justin,
I get just what you are saying.  I am so new to this that I can't
tell for sure if I can taste all of the nuances of the various
coffees.  I ordered some of the Gesha because of the stir it caused
here by people whom I respect, solely based on their postings.  For
me, it is worth a one time investment.  If I can tell the difference
just from experience to date, I will use it only for the most special of
events.  And, once I know that I am sure that I am roasting it
correctly I would give it as a gift to either of two friends who can
really taste the differences in coffees and teas.  
For me, at this early stage, I am looking for the one coffee that I want
to be my staple, my everyday very fine coffee, for me and for
guests.  I have only roasted a few, but I have bought plenty of
freshly roasted coffee in the past and have an idea.  
The odd thing is that the coffees I am leaning toward would probably not
be at the top of anyone's list, but I figure it is me who has to like
it.  So, if others think it pedestrian, fine.  However, from
what can tell of this list and its members, they would respect that I
found something I liked through roasting it myself and making it kind of
"my coffee."  I find a great deal of open minded members
here.
And in the end, it still comes down to the fact that I like it and I
don't get swayed easily should others differ with my selection, after
all, I am buying it, roasting it and most importantly, drinking it. 
Stephen
At 11:42 AM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
On 7/31/07, Jason
<celticravenva
> wrote: 
I got one lb of the Gesha last year, I have been holding off roasting
it, and keep eyeing it up in it's cute lil vac seal bag.  I think it
might be time to pull it out and roast some since I just placed my order
for the two new offerings Tom has, it will be my first Gesha. 
I almost ordered a techivorm today for it but just couldn't talk
myself into it.
This is going to sound sacreligious to many. I bought much earlier this
year 1# each of some Kona, some Aussie Mountain Top and some of the
second picking Gesha. I spent about $60 on 3 pounds total, including UPS
shipping. They were all wonderful coffees. I gifted my sister with most
of the Kona and Aussie since she apparently has a "thing" for
Kona. (She said she thought maybe she did like the Aussie a little
better.) 
 
The regular stuff we drink at home costs anywhere between $2.50 and $7.00
a pound delivered or picked up locally. Were those three special coffees
between 3 and 8 times more enjoyable than the regular stuff? Not to me
(but then, we've already established that I am NOT a supertaster). The
Gesha was truly a unique coffee experience, and I encourage folks to try
it occasionally, but the price of it is getting out of hand for regular
enjoyment for me. To be truthful, I think the Panama Carmen 1800+
coffee  is just about my all-time fave "special coffee".
 
I find much more enjoyment out of finding a truly great coffee at a
reasonable price which I can freely enjoy every day and share quickly
with others than spending large bucks for what seems to me the snob
appeal of it. I guess I am just too much of a cheapskate redneck to drop
$20 on a single pound of coffee and not feel guilty about it. 
 
Mind you I am not really complaining about the price - apparently there
are plenty of folks "out there" who *can* tell enough of a
difference in the taste to make it worth $20 a pound and more. I just
don't buy it because I can't tell the difference. 
 
(Well, there goes the last of my meager stash of CSA points, down the
tube!)
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music,
Justin Marquez (Cypress, TX)
 
--=====================_11616625==.ALT--

26) From: Homeroaster
It's not liner, but logarithmic the way the price increases.  Two motors on 
a boat don't make it go twice as fast either.  Rarity and demand, as well as 
shrewd marketing drive the price.
Those coffees are always good, but in reality, we are spoiled by 
Sweetmaria's offerings and many pricy coffees are not 'that' much better, if 
at all.
I'll bite on a pricy coffee once in a while for the experience.  We drink 
coffee every day that would knock the socks off what most 'non-homeroasters' 
drink.
*********************
Ed Needham
"to absurdity and beyond!"http://www.homeroaster.com*********************

27) From: Floyd Lozano
Justin just talked me out of buying a 5# of the Gesha ;)  I did bite on the
Mama Cata though.  It's pretty good.  I rarely see any of that good 2.50 /
lb coffee though.  I'd be tickled if I did.
-F
On 7/31/07, Brett Mason  wrote:
<Snip>

28) From: Brett Mason
I agree with Ed, but am perhaps a bit more cheap... My favorite beans in the
last year were Colombia Excelso 13556, and Brazil Cachoeira Yellow Bourbon,
and I have only once bought a pound of coffee that was costing more than
$10/lb.
Regards,
Brett
On 7/31/07, Homeroaster  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Cheers,
Bretthttp://homeroast.freeservers.com

29) From: Kevin
Warning: ME TOO Post approaching...
I have been toying with the idea of picking up the two high priced Panamas
because of the cupping scores alone but couldn't assuage the guilt over
dropping ~ $15/lb on coffee, no matter how good, especially when I have
plenty of greens in my stash.
Les told me a while back that Tom's cupping scores tend to be conservative
and that he (Les) would buy any coffee that scored over a 90 on principle
alone.  From my experience buying from Sweet Maria's, I have to agree with
Les.  I purchased one coffee, El Salvador Los Planes 2006 CoE (#2?) which
was $20+ per pound and it was the most incredible coffee I've ever had with
a cedar snap that was exquisite. I also purchased the Esmeralda
Gesha (pricey and great).  That being said, I have also spent less than $7
per pound on coffees that were just marginally less tasty than the El
Salvador CoE Los Planes; Brazil Cachoera Yellow Bourbon, the legendary Misty
Valley (scored over 90 and was less than $10 per pound), Brazil Formosa that
was all about body, and (I have to say it) the Mysore Nuggets.
Basically, I'd agree with Brett and Ed.  The coffees that cup out around 88
or so are as tasty or marginally less tasty to me but cost significantly
less and I credit our hosts for this wonderful feat. When it comes to
purchasing from SM you can't go wrong; simply read the description and
purchase what you like.
Kevin

30) From: Jason
I must say I have fallen in love with the panama coffee's, all of
them.  From the Mauier Estate, sample bag that was with my roaster,

31) From: Kris McN
This is one of the great things about home roasting for me.  Since I usually
only spend +-$5/lb for my daily, superior coffee experience (much less than
the $8-11/lb I used to spend on pre-roasted beans (even fresh, well-roasted
beans from local roasters) that weren't as good as what I drink today, I
don't feel too guilty about splurging on the occasional pricey bean from
SM.  I may never order the Gesha again if it's always around this price, but
I'm happy to have the chance to try it for myself.  I also ordered 5 more
lbs. of the Guat Aqua Tibia with it at $4/lb. - it's been a recent favorite
around here.
Kris McN

32) From: Les
I buy the rare and expensive for two reasons.  First and foremost those high
prices are going to the farmers.  Getting rewarded for doing an exceptional
job is going to continue the improvement of coffee for all of us.  Money
does motivate.  The reality is the great coffees we are getting are
inexpensive at $20-30.00 a pound.  Look what people pay for a limited
 bottling of fermented grape juice!  My nephew married into a family that
owns a vineyard and the special stuff they were serving was over $70.00 a
bottle.  Sure Tom spoils us with great coffees for less than $10.00 a pound,
so I feel I should support the cause and go for some of the coffee that will
continue to motivate growers to strive for the best.  Second, I enjoy the
differences in the coffees.  I just roasted some more Misty Valley, and wow
what a wonderful coffee, cheap at twice the price.  I have yet to have a
rare and expensive coffee that wasn't a cut above the average.  I don't try
to quantify taste by price.  So, I would encourage everyone to buy at least
a pound of the rare coffees to enjoy the experience.   As far as I am
concerned the Aqua Tibia is the big sleeper on the list.  The great thing is
we have a dealer in Sweet Marias that has honesty and integrity.  I would be
willing to pay $14.00 a pound of the Aqua Tibia.  It really should be priced
up with the Kona coffees, it is that good IMNSHO.   I wonder how many of you
have breezed over that one because it is so affordable?  However, Tom
doesn't price based on cupping results, but on what he has to pay for the
coffee.
Les
On 7/31/07, Kris McN  wrote:
<Snip>

33) From: Stephen Carey
--=====================_25091593==.ALT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Well said, Les.  But there is also something else in there for me.  I 
know it sounds off, but when I read about the coffee I find a romance 
in some of them.  It is hard to explain, but something draws me to 
it.  One of my favorites is one of the least expensive, but the story 
behind bean is amazing and what is happening in the country even more 
so.  That would be the Rwanda Butare Bourbon.  I feel like I can 
taste more than the variety of flavors it offers, but its history - I 
know, that is weird, but it is just what I see when I read about the 
coffees.  And, if a bit of romance or whatever goes into my tasting 
of a coffee, that is cool with me.  It might not be the way to buy 
pounds and pounds, but for the home roaster who wants to try new 
things it may well work.
I ordered some of the most expensive coffees that were discussed the 
other evening, from Panama.  I can't wait, I like their stories also, 
but more, I like how excited so many people on this list got when 
they were announced.  Odd isn't it?  But that energy gets to me and 
somehow falls into the decisions I make about some things, this being 
one of them.  I hope this isn't so far out there that you all toss me 
off the list, but it is just me.
Stephen
At 03:26 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
--=====================_25091593==.ALT
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well said, Les.  But there is also something else in
there for me.  I know it sounds off, but when I read about the
coffee I find a romance in some of them.  It is hard to explain, but
something draws me to it.  One of my favorites is one of the least
expensive, but the story behind bean is amazing and what is happening in
the country even more so.  That would be the Rwanda Butare
Bourbon.  I feel like I can taste more than the variety of flavors
it offers, but its history - I know, that is weird, but it is just what I
see when I read about the coffees.  And, if a bit of romance or
whatever goes into my tasting of a coffee, that is cool with me.  It
might not be the way to buy pounds and pounds, but for the home roaster
who wants to try new things it may well work.  
I ordered some of the most expensive coffees that were discussed the
other evening, from Panama.  I can't wait, I like their stories
also, but more, I like how excited so many people on this list got when
they were announced.  Odd isn't it?  But that energy gets to me
and somehow falls into the decisions I make about some things, this being
one of them.  I hope this isn't so far out there that you all toss
me off the list, but it is just me.
Stephen
At 03:26 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
I buy the rare and expensive =
for
two reasons.  First and foremost those high prices are going to the
farmers.  Getting rewarded for doing an exceptional job is going to
continue the improvement of coffee for all of us.  Money does
motivate.  The reality is the great coffees we are getting are
inexpensive at $20- 30.00 a pound.  Look what people pay for a
limited  bottling of fermented grape juice!  My nephew married
into a family that owns a vineyard and the special stuff they were
serving was over $70.00 a bottle.  Sure Tom spoils us with great
coffees for less than $10.00 a pound, so I feel I should support the
cause and go for some of the coffee that will continue to motivate
growers to strive for the best.  Second, I enjoy the differences in
the coffees.  I just roasted some more Misty Valley, and wow what a
wonderful coffee, cheap at twice the price.  I have yet to have a
rare and expensive coffee that wasn't a cut above the average.  I
don't try to quantify taste by price.  So, I would encourage
everyone to buy at least a pound of the rare coffees to enjoy the
experience.   As far as I am concerned the Aqua Tibia is the
big sleeper on the list.  The great thing is we have a dealer in
Sweet Marias that has honesty and integrity.  I would be willing to
pay $14.00 a pound of the Aqua Tibia.  It really should be priced up
with the Kona coffees, it is that good IMNSHO.   I wonder how
many of you have breezed over that one because it is so affordable? 
However, Tom doesn't price based on cupping results, but on what he has
to pay for the coffee. 
 
Les
 
On 7/31/07, Kris McN
<krismcn>
wrote: 
This is one of the great things about home roasting for me. 
Since I usually only spend +-$5/lb for my daily, superior coffee
experience (much less than the $8-11/lb I used to spend on pre-roasted
beans (even fresh, well-roasted beans from local roasters) that weren't
as good as what I drink today, I don't feel too guilty about splurging on
the occasional pricey bean from SM.  I may never order the Gesha
again if it's always around this price, but I'm happy to have the chance
to try it for myself.  I also ordered 5 more lbs. of the Guat Aqua
Tibia with it at $4/lb. - it's been a recent favorite around here.
Kris McN
--=====================_25091593==.ALT--

34) From: Lynne Biziewski
I'm in the middle of studying for a test, & shouldn't be reading my email
(of course!) BUT
I had to say - I feel the same!
Well put!
Lynne
(now back to cramming...)
On 7/31/07, Stephen Carey  wrote:
<Snip>

35) From: Bob
Lynne Biziewski wrote:
<Snip>
Heh. I'm supposed to be doing lesson plans for math tutoring for 
tonight. Drinking coffee and reading the Homeroast list are the perfect 
break from academic drudgery. Well, sex would be good too, but ...
Bob

36) From: Justin Marquez
I don't buy coffee purely on cost/# nor purely on the score.  I did buy some
Agua Tibia because I have tried it in the past and it is a wonderful coffee
and at a bargain price.  If you divide the cupping score by the cost per
pound and it comes out to 16 or better, you've probably got a great value
coffee, assuming of course that the origin is one you usually like. (Agua
Tibia's ratio is 18.2 - at the top of the scale.) We almost always like a
nice Guat. and Agua Tibia is a really NICE Guat.
BTW - There is no way in the world I would spend $70 for a bottle of wine,
either, for exactly the same reasons I gave about coffee.  (My two vehicles
are a Ford 500 and a Chevy Silverado, not a Beamer nor an Excalibur - same
logic for me.) Others may find a value difference making the extra cost
worthwhile to them, but I just have not seen it.
And I do see your good point about supporting the farmers. Let me hasten to
say that it doesn't upset me when the truly rare and excellent coffees are
selling for $20+ per pound. The free market will judge the proper selling
price.  Due to curiosity I will occasionally buy a pound. (Truth is, I live
in fear that I'll find one I MUST HAVE!)
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX)
On 7/31/07, Les  wrote:
<Snip>
--

37) From: Les
Well said Stephen!  I think the romance is a part of it too!  I just read
about the genocide in Rwanda and am glad I could help support the recovery
by getting some of their wonderful coffee.
Les
On 7/31/07, Stephen Carey  wrote:
<Snip>

38) From: Stephen Carey
--=====================_29462984==.ALT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Justin, please help a newbie out here.  So, I take the cupping score 
(provided on the SM site) and divide it by the cost per pound.  Then, 
if the total is 16 or better (does that mean higher or lower) I have 
a great value.  How did 16 become the cut-off number?  I am sorry if 
this is a dumb question, but it is all so new to me.
  I am still using what came with my roaster order (all very good), 
plus some Costa Rican coffees that I love when down there, and I want 
to see how close I can come.  (I kind of figure I can't really hit it 
because the environment means a lot to me and I won't have that here; 
and drinking coffee is partly experiential for me, if that makes sense.)
Then, as I mentioned earlier, I bought the expensive Panama coffee 
just coming in due to the groups reaction.  I had to try it just to 
see what the positive commotion was about.
Anyway, I am not questioning your method, I just don't understand it.
Do you mind walking me through the process of 16 being good and 
whether higher or lower is better?
Much appreciated,
Stephen
At 04:58 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
--=====================_29462984==.ALT
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Justin, please help a newbie out here.  So, I take the
cupping score (provided on the SM site) and divide it by the cost per
pound.  Then, if the total is 16 or better (does that mean higher or
lower) I have a great value.  How did 16 become the cut-off
number?  I am sorry if this is a dumb question, but it is all so new
to me. 
 I am still using what came with my roaster order (all very good),
plus some Costa Rican coffees that I love when down there, and I want to
see how close I can come.  (I kind of figure I can't really hit it
because the environment means a lot to me and I won't have that here; and
drinking coffee is partly experiential for me, if that makes
sense.)
Then, as I mentioned earlier, I bought the expensive Panama coffee just
coming in due to the groups reaction.  I had to try it just to see
what the positive commotion was about.
Anyway, I am not questioning your method, I just don't understand
it.
Do you mind walking me through the process of 16 being good and whether
higher or lower is better?
Much appreciated,
Stephen
At 04:58 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
I don't buy coffee purely on
cost/# nor purely on the score.  I did buy some Agua Tibia because I
have tried it in the past and it is a wonderful coffee and at a bargain
price.  If you divide the cupping score by the cost per pound and it
comes out to 16 or better, you've probably got a great value coffee,
assuming of course that the origin is one you usually like. (Agua Tibia's
ratio is 18.2 - at the top of the scale.) We almost always like a nice
Guat. and Agua Tibia is a really NICE Guat.
 
BTW - There is no way in the world I would spend $70 for a bottle of
wine, either, for exactly the same reasons I gave about coffee.  (My
two vehicles are a Ford 500 and a Chevy Silverado, not a Beamer nor an
Excalibur - same logic for me.) Others may find a value difference making
the extra cost worthwhile to them, but I just have not seen it. 
 
And I do see your good point about supporting the farmers. Let me hasten
to say that it doesn't upset me when the truly rare and excellent coffees
are selling for $20+ per pound. The free market will judge the proper
selling price.  Due to curiosity I will occasionally buy a pound.
(Truth is, I live in fear that I'll find one I MUST HAVE!) 
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX) 
 
On 7/31/07, Les
<les.albjerg
> wrote: 
I buy the rare and expensive for two reasons.  First and
foremost those high prices are going to the farmers.  Getting
rewarded for doing an exceptional job is going to continue the
improvement of coffee for all of us.  Money does motivate.  The
reality is the great coffees we are getting are inexpensive at $20- 30.00
a pound.  Look what people pay for a limited  bottling of
fermented grape juice!  My nephew married into a family that owns a
vineyard and the special stuff they were serving was over $70.00 a
bottle.  Sure Tom spoils us with great coffees for less than $10.00
a pound, so I feel I should support the cause and go for some of the
coffee that will continue to motivate growers to strive for the
best.  Second, I enjoy the differences in the coffees.  I just
roasted some more Misty Valley, and wow what a wonderful coffee, cheap at
twice the price.  I have yet to have a rare and expensive coffee
that wasn't a cut above the average.  I don't try to quantify taste
by price.  So, I would encourage everyone to buy at least a pound of
the rare coffees to enjoy the experience.   As far as I am
concerned the Aqua Tibia is the big sleeper on the list.  The great
thing is we have a dealer in Sweet Marias that has honesty and
integrity.  I would be willing to pay $14.00 a pound of the Aqua
Tibia.  It really should be priced up with the Kona coffees, it is
that good IMNSHO.   I wonder how many of you have breezed over
that one because it is so affordable?  However, Tom doesn't price
based on cupping results, but on what he has to pay for the coffee. 
 
Les
 
On 7/31/07, Kris McN
<krismcn> wrote:
This is one of the great things about home roasting for me. 
Since I usually only spend +-$5/lb for my daily, superior coffee
experience (much less than the $8-11/lb I used to spend on pre-roasted
beans (even fresh, well-roasted beans from local roasters) that weren't
as good as what I drink today, I don't feel too guilty about splurging on
the occasional pricey bean from SM.  I may never order the Gesha
again if it's always around this price, but I'm happy to have the chance
to try it for myself.  I also ordered 5 more lbs. of the Guat Aqua
Tibia with it at $4/lb. - it's been a recent favorite around here.
Kris McN
-- 
--=====================_29462984==.ALT--

39) From: miKe mcKoffee
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Stephen,
 
I wouldn't worry too much about the "16" value point bit. It's one person's
way of determining what a coffee's value is to "them" and only them. Those
cupping scores are IMO relative and can't really apply one origin score to
another origin because of different origin characteristics. For instance
even the very top Sumatra's won't score relatively high compared to many or
most other coffees. Does that mean all Sumatra's since scoring lower and
having a lower "value point" than for instance most Centrals means all
Sumatra's are inferior or bad deal? Not in my book. It seems confusing at
first, and like many I too thought higher score always meant better
regardless the origin when first starting the journey.
 
Pacific Northwest Gathering VIhttp://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Kurmudgeon miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/ 
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Stephen Carey
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 2:11 PM
Justin, please help a newbie out here.  So, I take the cupping score
(provided on the SM site) and divide it by the cost per pound.  Then, if the
total is 16 or better (does that mean higher or lower) I have a great value.
How did 16 become the cut-off number?  I am sorry if this is a dumb
question, but it is all so new to me. 
 I am still using what came with my roaster order (all very good), plus some
Costa Rican coffees that I love when down there, and I want to see how close
I can come.  (I kind of figure I can't really hit it because the environment
means a lot to me and I won't have that here; and drinking coffee is partly
experiential for me, if that makes sense.)
Then, as I mentioned earlier, I bought the expensive Panama coffee just
coming in due to the groups reaction.  I had to try it just to see what the
positive commotion was about.
Anyway, I am not questioning your method, I just don't understand it.
Do you mind walking me through the process of 16 being good and whether
higher or lower is better?
Much appreciated,
Stephen
At 04:58 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
I don't buy coffee purely on cost/# nor purely on the score.  I did buy some
Agua Tibia because I have tried it in the past and it is a wonderful coffee
and at a bargain price.  If you divide the cupping score by the cost per
pound and it comes out to 16 or better, you've probably got a great value
coffee, assuming of course that the origin is one you usually like. (Agua
Tibia's ratio is 18.2 - at the top of the scale.) We almost always like a
nice Guat. and Agua Tibia is a really NICE Guat.
 
BTW - There is no way in the world I would spend $70 for a bottle of wine,
either, for exactly the same reasons I gave about coffee.  (My two vehicles
are a Ford 500 and a Chevy Silverado, not a Beamer nor an Excalibur - same
logic for me.) Others may find a value difference making the extra cost
worthwhile to them, but I just have not seen it. 
 
And I do see your good point about supporting the farmers. Let me hasten to
say that it doesn't upset me when the truly rare and excellent coffees are
selling for $20+ per pound. The free market will judge the proper selling
price.  Due to curiosity I will occasionally buy a pound. (Truth is, I live
in fear that I'll find one I MUST HAVE!) 
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX) 
 
On 7/31/07, Les  wrote: 
I buy the rare and expensive for two reasons.  First and foremost those high
prices are going to the farmers.  Getting rewarded for doing an exceptional
job is going to continue the improvement of coffee for all of us.  Money
does motivate.  The reality is the great coffees we are getting are
inexpensive at $20- 30.00 a pound.  Look what people pay for a limited
bottling of fermented grape juice!  My nephew married into a family that
owns a vineyard and the special stuff they were serving was over $70.00 a
bottle.  Sure Tom spoils us with great coffees for less than $10.00 a pound,
so I feel I should support the cause and go for some of the coffee that will
continue to motivate growers to strive for the best.  Second, I enjoy the
differences in the coffees.  I just roasted some more Misty Valley, and wow
what a wonderful coffee, cheap at twice the price.  I have yet to have a
rare and expensive coffee that wasn't a cut above the average.  I don't try
to quantify taste by price.  So, I would encourage everyone to buy at least
a pound of the rare coffees to enjoy the experience.   As far as I am
concerned the Aqua Tibia is the big sleeper on the list.  The great thing is
we have a dealer in Sweet Marias that has honesty and integrity.  I would be
willing to pay $14.00 a pound of the Aqua Tibia.  It really should be priced
up with the Kona coffees, it is that good IMNSHO.   I wonder how many of you
have breezed over that one because it is so affordable?  However, Tom
doesn't price based on cupping results, but on what he has to pay for the
coffee. 
Les
On 7/31/07, Kris McN  wrote: 
This is one of the great things about home roasting for me.  Since I usually
only spend +-$5/lb for my daily, superior coffee experience (much less than
the $8-11/lb I used to spend on pre-roasted beans (even fresh, well-roasted
beans from local roasters) that weren't as good as what I drink today, I
don't feel too guilty about splurging on the occasional pricey bean from SM.
I may never order the Gesha again if it's always around this price, but I'm
happy to have the chance to try it for myself.  I also ordered 5 more lbs.
of the Guat Aqua Tibia with it at $4/lb. - it's been a recent favorite
around here. 
Kris McN
-- 

40) From: Justin Marquez
Stephen - That is a personal benchmark I have set on my own as I have
navigated the coffees of Sweet Maria.  It is in no way necessarily anyone
else's benchmark. I have NEVER had a coffee from SM which Tom scored above
87 that was not a great coffee, flavor-wise.  If it scores  87 or more, it
gets my immediate attention and consideration.  If it score 90+, it must be
an amazing coffee. Now, ALL of Tom's coffees are just about the highest
quality you can find, regardless of the exact score.  I feel really good if
I can find one in the lower half of his price range which scores 87 or
better. The lower half of his typical pricing is about $5.50 or so. 87/5.5 =
15.8. That would be a coffee less than the median cost/pound (1# quantity
cost as the benchmark) and in the upper regions of the score. Agua Tibia is
87.5 / 4.80 = 18.2. If you like Guat coffees, this one has GOT to be tried.
My benchmark is probably weigted too heavily on cost/#, but it is my
benchmark and I am a cheepskate. So, there you have it.
I repeat - do NOT buy purely on $/#, or on score or on this or any other
ratio. Decide what origins you like and check review notes from Tom's
reviews , based on what you buy and checking what he said until you "know
what you usually like".  If an 85 score coffee is an origin that you love,
chances are you'll like that one, too, even though it didn't score thru the
roof. The fact is, there is really not a lot of difference between and 85
score and an 88 score.
 With the exception of the educational UGH! coffee, ALL the stuff SM sells
is good coffee. The hard part is just deciding which to order. Learn to
calibrate your tastes with what Tom's review notes say.
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX)
On 7/31/07, Stephen Carey  wrote:
<Snip>
--

41) From: True, Dennis W. FC1 (CVN69)
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
I never thought about it like that I will start look to see how my
purchaes matches up with your method
Thanks for sharing!
Dennis

42) From: Stephen Carey
--=====================_31314468==.ALT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Thank you, Mike.  I think a better way for me to go is by what I 
like, anyway, not a score.  I see the usefulness of it for some, but 
I am more of a try it, have fun with it, and almost no matter what I 
will have a good cup of coffee.  I might not be my best, but it will 
be fun roasting it and more fun tasting what I actually roasted myself.
I am confuse about one other thing, in the 7 roasts I have done, on 
one in particular, I swear I tasted a flavor that just isn't in the 
description or I am missing it.  I roasted Panama Boquete - Lerida 
Estate Peaberry.  Now, I know I am going through chemo and I take so 
many pills a day that you would never believe it, so maybe my taste 
buds could be off.  However, I think they are more sensitive than 
ever.  On this roast I swear I tasted peanuts at the end of the 
swallow.  It was light, but very real.  The entire sip was bright, 
had a bit of citrus and just what you would expect, then I tasted 
this peanut flavor.  I know some coffees, Indian, I believe, have 
more of a peanut flavor and I would have expected a semi-sweet 
chocolate, but this was peanut.  I had three cups this morning and 
all of them had it in it.
Can a bean that isn't generally known to have a flavor have one 
anyway, maybe due to something at the orchard, the processing, or my roast?
Thanks for any light you can shed on it.
At 05:31 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
--=====================_31314468==.ALT
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you, Mike.  I think a better way for me to go is
by what I like, anyway, not a score.  I see the usefulness of it for
some, but I am more of a try it, have fun with it, and almost no matter
what I will have a good cup of coffee.  I might not be my best, but
it will be fun roasting it and more fun tasting what I actually roasted
myself.
I am confuse about one other thing, in the 7 roasts I have done, on one
in particular, I swear I tasted a flavor that just isn't in the
description or I am missing it.  I roasted Panama Boquete - Lerida
Estate Peaberry.  Now, I know I am going through chemo and I take so
many pills a day that you would never believe it, so maybe my taste buds
could be off.  However, I think they are more sensitive than
ever.  On this roast I swear I tasted peanuts at the end of the
swallow.  It was light, but very real.  The entire sip was
bright, had a bit of citrus and just what you would expect, then I tasted
this peanut flavor.  I know some coffees, Indian, I believe, have
more of a peanut flavor and I would have expected a semi-sweet chocolate,
but this was peanut.  I had three cups this morning and all of them
had it in it.
Can a bean that isn't generally known to have a flavor have one anyway,
maybe due to something at the orchard, the processing, or my
roast?
Thanks for any light you can shed on it.  
At 05:31 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
Stephen,
 
I wouldn't worry too much about the
"16" value point bit. It's one person's way of determining what
a coffee's value is to "them" and only them. Those cupping
scores are IMO relative and can't really apply one origin score to
another origin because of different origin characteristics. For instance
even the very top Sumatra's won't score relatively high compared to many
or most other coffees. Does that mean all Sumatra's since scoring lower
and having a lower "value point" than for instance most
Centrals means all Sumatra's are inferior or bad deal? Not in my book. It
seems confusing at first, and like many I too thought higher score always
meant better regardless the origin when first starting the journey.
 
Pacific Northwest Gathering VI
http://home.comcast.net/~mckona/PNWGVI.htmKona Kurmudgeon miKe mcKoffee
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:
http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I
must first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal
enlightenment found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who
have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archives
http://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/From:
homeroast-admin
[] On Behalf Of
Stephen Carey
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 2:11 PM
Justin, please help a newbie out here.  So, I take
the cupping score (provided on the SM site) and divide it by the cost per
pound.  Then, if the total is 16 or better (does that mean higher or
lower) I have a great value.  How did 16 become the cut-off
number?  I am sorry if this is a dumb question, but it is all so new
to me. 
 I am still using what came with my roaster order (all very
good), plus some Costa Rican coffees that I love when down there, and I
want to see how close I can come.  (I kind of figure I can't really
hit it because the environment means a lot to me and I won't have that
here; and drinking coffee is partly experiential for me, if that makes
sense.)
Then, as I mentioned earlier, I bought the expensive Panama coffee
just coming in due to the groups reaction.  I had to try it just to
see what the positive commotion was about.
Anyway, I am not questioning your method, I just don't understand
it.
Do you mind walking me through the process of 16 being good and
whether higher or lower is better?
Much appreciated,
Stephen
At 04:58 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
I don't buy coffee purely on cost/# nor purely on the score.  I
did buy some Agua Tibia because I have tried it in the past and it is a
wonderful coffee and at a bargain price.  If you divide the cupping
score by the cost per pound and it comes out to 16 or better, you've
probably got a great value coffee, assuming of course that the origin is
one you usually like. (Agua Tibia's ratio is 18.2 - at the top of the
scale.) We almost always like a nice Guat. and Agua Tibia is a really
NICE Guat.
 
BTW - There is no way in the world I would spend $70 for a bottle of
wine, either, for exactly the same reasons I gave about coffee.  (My
two vehicles are a Ford 500 and a Chevy Silverado, not a Beamer nor an
Excalibur - same logic for me.) Others may find a value difference making
the extra cost worthwhile to them, but I just have not seen it. 
 
And I do see your good point about supporting the farmers. Let me
hasten to say that it doesn't upset me when the truly rare and excellent
coffees are selling for $20+ per pound. The free market will judge the
proper selling price.  Due to curiosity I will occasionally buy a
pound. (Truth is, I live in fear that I'll find one I MUST HAVE!)
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX) 
 
On 7/31/07, Les
<les.albjerg >
wrote: 
I buy the rare and expensive for two reasons.  First and
foremost those high prices are going to the farmers.  Getting
rewarded for doing an exceptional job is going to continue the
improvement of coffee for all of us.  Money does motivate.  The
reality is the great coffees we are getting are inexpensive at $20- 30.00
a pound.  Look what people pay for a limited  bottling of
fermented grape juice!  My nephew married into a family that owns a
vineyard and the special stuff they were serving was over $70.00 a
bottle.  Sure Tom spoils us with great coffees for less than $10.00
a pound, so I feel I should support the cause and go for some of the
coffee that will continue to motivate growers to strive for the
best.  Second, I enjoy the differences in the coffees.  I just
roasted some more Misty Valley, and wow what a wonderful coffee, cheap at
twice the price.  I have yet to have a rare and expensive coffee
that wasn't a cut above the average.  I don't try to quantify taste
by price.  So, I would encourage everyone to buy at least a pound of
the rare coffees to enjoy the experience.   As far as I am
concerned the Aqua Tibia is the big sleeper on the list.  The great
thing is we have a dealer in Sweet Marias that has honesty and
integrity.  I would be willing to pay $14.00 a pound of the Aqua
Tibia.  It really should be priced up with the Kona coffees, it is
that good IMNSHO.   I wonder how many of you have breezed over
that one because it is so affordable?  However, Tom doesn't price
based on cupping results, but on what he has to pay for the coffee. 
  
Les
  
On 7/31/07, Kris McN
<krismcn> wrote: 
This is one of the great things about home roasting for me. 
Since I usually only spend +-$5/lb for my daily, superior coffee
experience (much less than the $8-11/lb I used to spend on pre-roasted
beans (even fresh, well-roasted beans from local roasters) that weren't
as good as what I drink today, I don't feel too guilty about splurging on
the occasional pricey bean from SM.  I may never order the Gesha
again if it's always around this price, but I'm happy to have the chance
to try it for myself.  I also ordered 5 more lbs. of the Guat Aqua
Tibia with it at $4/lb. - it's been a recent favorite around here. 
Kris McN
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43) From: Justin Marquez
*Absolutely!*
**
I already know from the past 3 years that I like most Central American and
Brazilian coffees, Panama, Kenyan, Uganda, Sumatra and the Aussie. The
challenge is finding the most bang for the buck for me (cheepskate).
Frankly, I can't usually isolate the specific flavor notes that Tom gets in
the reviews.  I just know when I like it. Usually I can't really tell you
exactly WHY.
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX)
On 7/31/07, Stephen Carey  wrote:
<Snip>

44) From: Stephen Carey
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Justin,
I doubt you are a cheapskate, for you could go buy a few pounds of 
Chock Full of Nuts for $7.00 and not have to even grind them.
It is good to have a personal benchmark.  I was looking to see how 
yours worked, now I do.
I don't really have one yet, but I am sure as I do this more and more 
something will just be what I use.  I can't say what it is at this 
point, but I bet it happens, even if I am not fully aware of it.
And, I only hear good things about Tom and this site and it's 
coffee.  I have looked at other sites, but this feels like home.  I 
don't know why.  I do love the explanations, the backgrounds, then 
the technical information that I don't yet understand, but it is 
there for me when I am ready.
The confusing thing for me is what to do with the two pounds of some 
very good Costa Rican pre-roasted coffee that I brought back on my 
last trip.  I think I will give it to a friend who likes it, but 
would have no interest in doing his own roasting.  And pre-roasted or 
not, I was at the roasting building, it is fairly fresh, and will be 
better than what he gets from a can.  Plus, he will truly appreciate 
it.  It just feels like such a waste.  BUT, it was being at that 
roasters, in Quepos, talking to the roaster that got me into 
this.  He suggested it.  He had this monstrous machine, but he was 
delicate in using it.  He said I could taste a world of coffees, not 
just theirs if I learned to roast.  The only thing I had to promise 
was to eat breakfast or lunch there when I am at the house and to buy 
my coffee for the house from him.  So each house rental (we also rent 
the house out) gets a pound to enjoy each morning as they listen to 
the jungle come alive.  Very cool and very cool guy.
t 05:35 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
<Snip>
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Justin,
I doubt you are a cheapskate, for you could go buy a few pounds of Chock
Full of Nuts for $7.00 and not have to even grind them.
It is good to have a personal benchmark.  I was looking to see how
yours worked, now I do.
I don't really have one yet, but I am sure as I do this more and more
something will just be what I use.  I can't say what it is at this
point, but I bet it happens, even if I am not fully aware of it.
And, I only hear good things about Tom and this site and it's
coffee.  I have looked at other sites, but this feels like
home.  I don't know why.  I do love the explanations, the
backgrounds, then the technical information that I don't yet understand,
but it is there for me when I am ready.
The confusing thing for me is what to do with the two pounds of some very
good Costa Rican pre-roasted coffee that I brought back on my last
trip.  I think I will give it to a friend who likes it, but would
have no interest in doing his own roasting.  And pre-roasted or not,
I was at the roasting building, it is fairly fresh, and will be better
than what he gets from a can.  Plus, he will truly appreciate
it.  It just feels like such a waste.  BUT, it was being at
that roasters, in Quepos, talking to the roaster that got me into
this.  He suggested it.  He had this monstrous machine, but he
was delicate in using it.  He said I could taste a world of coffees,
not just theirs if I learned to roast.  The only thing I had to
promise was to eat breakfast or lunch there when I am at the house and to
buy my coffee for the house from him.  So each house rental (we also
rent the house out) gets a pound to enjoy each morning as they listen to
the jungle come alive.  Very cool and very cool guy.
t 05:35 PM 7/31/2007, you wrote:
Stephen - That is a personal
benchmark I have set on my own as I have navigated the coffees of Sweet
Maria.  It is in no way necessarily anyone else's benchmark. I have
NEVER had a coffee from SM which Tom scored above 87 that was not a great
coffee, flavor-wise.  If it scores  87 or more, it gets my
immediate attention and consideration.  If it score 90+, it must be
an amazing coffee. Now, ALL of Tom's coffees are just about the highest
quality you can find, regardless of the exact score.  I feel really
good if I can find one in the lower half of his price range which scores
87 or better. The lower half of his typical pricing is about $5.50 or so.
87/5.5 = 15.8. That would be a coffee less than the median cost/pound (1#
quantity cost as the benchmark) and in the upper regions of the score.
Agua Tibia is 87.5 / 4.80 = 18.2. If you like Guat coffees, this one has
GOT to be tried. 
 
My benchmark is probably weigted too heavily on cost/#, but it is my
benchmark and I am a cheepskate. So, there you have it.
 
I repeat - do NOT buy purely on $/#, or on score or on this or any other
ratio. Decide what origins you like and check review notes from Tom's
reviews , based on what you buy and checking what he said until you
"know what you usually like".  If an 85 score coffee is an
origin that you love, chances are you'll like that one, too, even though
it didn't score thru the roof. The fact is, there is really not a lot of
difference between and 85 score and an 88 score. 
 
 With the exception of the educational UGH! coffee, ALL the stuff SM
sells is good coffee. The hard part is just deciding which to order.
Learn to calibrate your tastes with what Tom's review notes say.
 
Safe Journeys and Sweet Music
Justin Marquez (CYPRESS, TX) 
 
On 7/31/07, Stephen Carey
<steve
> wrote: 
Justin, please help a newbie out here.  So, I take the cupping
score (provided on the SM site) and divide it by the cost per
pound.  Then, if the total is 16 or better (does that mean higher or
lower) I have a great value.  How did 16 become the cut-off
number?  I am sorry if this is a dumb question, but it is all so new
to me.  
 
Do you mind walking me through the process of 16 being good and
whether higher or lower is better?
Stephen 
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45) From: Phil Bergman Jungle Music
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

46) From: DJ Garcia
What he said :-)
DJ

47) From: Kevin
I gave in and had to purchase the two Panama's (along with a Kenyan)
Panama Auction Lot - Moma Cata Gesha (2lbs)
Panama Esmeralda Especial Gesha (2lbs)
Kenya Thika Gethumbwini Peaberry (2lbs)
-- 
My home coffee roasting blog:http://homecoffeeroastblog.blogspot.com/Kevin


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