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Topic: A Burr Grinder is a Burr Grinder ... maximizers and satisfiers (8 msgs / 320 lines)
1) From: Lubos Palounek
Alchemist John wrote that if you are happy with your grinder you should 
not upgrade.
I strongly disagree.
If you never tasted any coffee better than Starbucks, should you never 
try a better coffee or home roasting?
If you never drove a better car than your old cheap Chevrolet, should 
you never try a better car?
I was happy with my old Solis grinder, but I am very happy that I 
upgraded to a Mazzer.  I never realized how big a difference a better 
burr grinder makes in the resulting aroma and taste!
(The whole discussion reminded me about maximizers and 
satisfiers...Maximizers are people who always try to choose the best 
thing. They want the best toothpaste, the best car, the best significant 
other, the best dreams at night. Satisfiers will take the first thing 
that matches their requirements. They want clean teeth, and therefore 
choose the first toothpaste that they believe will do the job. They want 
to get to work, and buy the first car that will take them there. 
maximizers and satisfiers. You can read a lot about maximizers and 
satisfiers.  It seems to me that most people who roast their coffee are 
maximizers, not satisfiers.  Am I wrong?)
Lubos

2) From: raymanowen
"...people who roast their coffee are maximizers..."
True, and they don't accept any less than the best they can accomplish.
Their goal is not to accumulate plastic toys that look like the real
thing, or push-button machines that generate coffeelike drinks.
"I can do better than that, and I can beat my last one, too."
Cheers and Mabuhay -RayO, aka Opa!
Eschew Spinet Grinders.

3) From: Larry Dorman
<Snip>
Fair enough... :)
<Snip>
I continously explore new coffee roasts, grinds, brewing methods, etc.
 However, I do not upgrade all of my equipment to accomplish this.
Instead, I look for the coffee shops and individuals who can help
facilitate this experience.
I think we're close to saying the same thing.  I would not recommend
that someone upgrade their grinder to find out if they like the
change.  I would recommend that someone try properly brewed / prepared
coffee with a better grinder and see if they like the difference
sufficiently to warrant an upgrade.
<Snip>
Depends.  If driving is something that brings you particular pleasure
(or in some cases, particular displeasure), then it would be
reasonable to shop around and see if something different could improve
that experience.  On the other hand, I see nothing wrong with being
satisfied with what one has and sticking with it.
<Snip>
I'm somewhere in the middle.  The argument could be made that anyone
home roasting for the coffee quality (and not just as a hobby) is at
least in the direction of being a maximizer.  At the same time, I
consider some people on here to be (affectionately) obsessive.  I
would not enjoy taking the process to the nth degree as they do.  I am
satisfied where I'm at...
LarryD

4) From: Lubos Palounek
John,
You are right and I agree with you: “Trying and changing are two 
different things”. My goal, too, is “contentment within my means.”
I fully agree that if someone has tried many cups of espresso properly 
made from freshly roasted Sweet Maria’s beans just correctly ground in a 
good burr grinder, and still likes that espresso (made in a clean 
espresso machine using good fresh water) less than his or hers Starbucks 
espresso, he or she should be happy with Starbucks and stay with 
Starbucks. The same is true for similar situations with cars, grinders, 
cameras, lenses, home theater equipment etc.
Many people are happy with Starbucks. Others, including me, prefer the 
long difficult, but enjoyable “quest for Coffee Nirvana”.
As far as burr grinders go, I strongly believe that a really good burr 
grinder is more important for making an espresso with great aroma and 
taste than the espresso machine being used. As I said before, I was 
“happy with my old Solis grinder, but I am very happy that I upgraded to 
a Mazzer.” Not just for the espresso.
I strongly suggest that people try coffee made their usual way from 
beans ground in a good (and clean) burr grinder and compare it to the 
“same” coffee from beans ground in their present grinder. They might be 
surprised by the improvement in the aroma and taste.
Lubos
----
Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2007 10:05:25 -0700
To: homeroast 
From: Alchemist John >
Subject: Re: +A Burr Grinder is a Burr Grinder ... maximizers and satisfiers
Reply-To: homeroast 
I agree with the fortune cookie.
As for the 2nd one, you are welcome to disagree.
If you are happy with *$, then no, you should not change.
If you are happy with your car, you should not change.
If you are happy with your grinder, you should not change.
But I will note you are saying to different things.
I did NOT say
"if you are happy with your grinder you should not TRY another grinder."
Trying and changing are two different things.
It could be true - I may be an anomaly. I am NOT a maximizer. It is
probably why I don't have upgrade fever. I am a DIY'er. My goal is
contentment within my means.
<Snip>
has enough."

5) From: Paul Carder
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Lubos, perhaps I misinterpret your letter, but it seems that your are =
calling "satisfiers" in the coffee roasting hobby second rate because =
they choose not to purchase the most expensive,  top of the line =
equipment. As a "satisfier" roaster, I'm enjoying the best coffee of my =
54 yr old life! I could afford whatever coffee machinery I want, but =
choose not to. Whover wants to be a "maximizer" and own the high end =
equipment, more power to them. That's great! I've learned a great deal =
from those on the list. But no "maximizer" should be looking down their =
nose at us "satisfiers" ALL of us home roasters are enjoying the best =
coffee out there. A fun comaraderie it should always be.
PAUL CARDER

6) From: raymanowen
"I have more junk than most people..."
Is a Minolta 300 ER or a Viking Thunderbolt and Heathkit DX-100 part
of your living room furnishings? I should sell tickets- a Kimball/
Schwander piano and Thomas organ, too.
I'm ready for "Bring a wheelbarrow, don't leave empty-handed" party!!
I never used to hoard stuff before I got my belfry tapped.
Spin the wheel- it's either $250, or Free to a good home.
Cheers -RayO, aka Opa!
On 9/9/07, Angelo  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
"When the theme hits the bass, I dance the Jig!" - -Virgil Fox at the
Mighty Wichita (ex- NYC Paramount) WurliTzer- 1976

7) From: Lubos Palounek
Paul,
I am sorry if you read my input to mean that “"satisfiers" in the coffee 
roasting hobby are second rate because they choose not to purchase the 
most expensive, top of the line equipment. That is not what I meant to 
say. My goal, too, is “contentment within my means” and I do not have 
all the most expensive, top of line equipment.
What I was trying to stress is that, in my opinion, a good burr grinder 
is the most important part of the equipment on the road to excellent 
coffee. In my opinion, you can make better coffee with first rate burr 
grinder and less expensive espresso machine as compared to using the 
best espresso machine and second rate burr grinder.
Lubos
PS
About the "I have more junk than most people..." thread ... I still have 
and (rarely) use an AR turntable with a Shure V cartridge … and do not 
consider those being junk.
* Paul Carder *homeroast 
/Sun Sep 9 12:48:16 2007/
Lubos, perhaps I misinterpret your letter, but it seems that your are
calling "satisfiers" in the coffee roasting hobby second rate because =
they choose not to purchase the most expensive, top of the line =
equipment. As a "satisfier" roaster, I'm enjoying the best coffee of my =
54 yr old life! I could afford whatever coffee machinery I want, but =
choose not to. Whover wants to be a "maximizer" and own the high end =
equipment, more power to them. That's great! I've learned a great deal =
from those on the list. But no "maximizer" should be looking down their =
nose at us "satisfiers" ALL of us home roasters are enjoying the best =
coffee out there. A fun comaraderie it should always be.
PAUL CARDER

8) From: raymanowen
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