HomeRoast Digest


Topic: new "coffee beanery" in town (41 msgs / 1412 lines)
1) From: Frank Awbrey
Hi, I have a quick question about a local (franchised) coffee shop that has
just opened in the last week or so. It is called the "Coffee Beanery". I
stopped by on Saturday evening to get a quick cup (to try an espresso)(had
been a long drive and was still 30 minutes from home), but they were closed.
I googled them and I think it says that they do their roasts in Michigan.
Anyway, I was wondering if anyone has tried their espresso and how you think
it might compare to something like *$. Are their roasts fairly fresh or are
they like *$. This is the only type of espresso I have tried, *$ and a
couple of small shops. I'm still looking for what I think might be a very
good espresso (don't think I've ever had a good one) with only 5 or 6
different places tried.
 Thx.
"Still the one"
Frank

2) From: Sandy Andina
--Apple-Mail-67-730121097
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The good news is that they generally don't roast as dark as *$, but  
the bad news is that they're not necessarily fresh, either--I was  
told once that their espresso was "less than a month old."  They sell  
a lot of flavored beans and cute tchotchkes, and all manner of  
flavored foo-foo drinks that make *$ look like the House of Purists.   
I don't know if they are sui generis or the successors to another  
chain such as Gloria Jean's, Barnie's Beanery or Brothers.  But  
they're all over the Simon chain of shopping malls.
On Oct 30, 2007, at 5:06 PM, Frank Awbrey wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
--Apple-Mail-67-730121097
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	charsetO-8859-1
The good news is that they generally don't roast as dark as *$, but the =
bad news is that they're not necessarily fresh, either--I was told once =
that their espresso was "less than a month old."  They sell a lot of =
flavored beans and cute tchotchkes, and all manner of flavored foo-foo =
drinks that make *$ look like the House of Purists.  I don't know if =
they are sui generis or the successors to another chain such as Gloria =
Jean's, Barnie's Beanery or Brothers.  But they're all over the Simon =
chain of shopping malls.
On Oct 30, 2007, at 5:06 PM, Frank =
Awbrey wrote:

Hi, I have a quick question about a = local (franchised) coffee shop that has just opened in the last week or = so. It is called the "Coffee Beanery". I stopped by on Saturday evening = to get a quick cup (to try an espresso)(had been a long drive and was = still 30 minutes from home), but they were closed. I googled them and I = think it says that they do their roasts in Michigan. Anyway, I was = wondering if anyone has tried their espresso and how you think it might = compare to something like *$. Are their roasts fairly fresh or are they = like *$. This is the only type of espresso I have tried, *$ and a couple = of small shops. I'm still looking for what I think might be a very good = espresso (don't think I've ever had a good one) with only 5 or 6 = different places tried.    Thx. = "Still the one" Frank = Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-67-730121097--

3) From: TERRY TITSWORTH
I tried one in Ft. Smith. Ark. Pretty sure it is the same fran. I didn't
like their coffee or service. I originally asked for a Costa Rica drip brew
and they stated that they did not have any. Told them give me what ya
got...Need Caffeine...some lame something or other. Browsed the shop while I
waited and noted a COSTA RICA whole bean coffee bag on the shelf. Odd,
'they' don't have any. The swill was bitter...couldn't finish...next time
through asked for an espresso. Same problem, Bitter.
My son called Sunday and stated that they were now closed. Oh, Well.
TerryT
PS...new coffee shop opened in my home town, Okmulgee, Ok. They get beans
from a Tulsa Roaster, JAVA DAVE'S. Tried them last Friday and to my
surprise, their espresso was not bitter, not much creme, but at least not
bitter. Next step was trying JAVA DAVE'S franc. in Sapulpa, OK on Saturday.
This time I noted an actual sweetness to the espresso. So maybe things are
looking up "in the Oklahoma Hills where I was born."
On 10/30/07, Frank Awbrey  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Start HOT and work your way Down...
Peppers AND Coffee.
[|:{O....[|:{U...
(I'm the tall guy in the middle)

4) From: Sandy Andina
--Apple-Mail-91-812041924
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Well, just because they have certain bulk bean varietals for sale  
doesn't mean they can brew them up to order.  A select few, who have  
Clover machines or dedicated per-cup grinders for individual press- 
pots or cup-top drips, might be able to (and they tend to reserve  
them for premiums like JBM); but most coffee shops have an espresso  
and a decaf espresso grinder (each preloaded with the day's supply),  
one grinder for bulk beans and one for flavored bulk beans (if that  
many), and usually brew up their drip in advance and dispense it from  
Fetco brewers or air-pots.
On Oct 31, 2007, at 4:03 PM, TERRY TITSWORTH wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
--Apple-Mail-91-812041924
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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	charsetO-8859-1
Well, just because they have certain bulk bean varietals for sale =
doesn't mean they can brew them up to order.  A select few, who have =
Clover machines or dedicated per-cup grinders for individual press-pots =
or cup-top drips, might be able to (and they tend to reserve them for =
premiums like JBM); but most coffee shops have an espresso and a decaf =
espresso grinder (each preloaded with the day's supply), one grinder for =
bulk beans and one for flavored bulk beans (if that many), and usually =
brew up their drip in advance and dispense it from Fetco brewers or =
air-pots.
On Oct 31, 2007, at 4:03 PM, TERRY TITSWORTH =
wrote:
I tried one in Ft. Smith. Ark. Pretty sure it is the = same fran. I didn't like their coffee or service. I originally asked for = a Costa Rica drip brew and they stated that they did not have any. Told = them give me what ya got...Need Caffeine...some lame something or other. = Browsed the shop while I waited and noted a COSTA RICA whole bean coffee = bag on the shelf. Odd, 'they' don't have any. The swill was = bitter...couldn't finish...next time through asked for an espresso. Same = problem, Bitter. My son called Sunday and stated that they = were now closed. Oh, Well.   TerryT = PS...new coffee shop opened in my home town, Okmulgee, Ok. They get = beans from a Tulsa Roaster, JAVA DAVE'S. Tried them last Friday and to = my surprise, their espresso was not bitter, not much creme, but at least = not bitter. Next step was trying JAVA DAVE'S franc. in Sapulpa, OK on = Saturday. This time I noted an actual sweetness to the espresso. So = maybe things are looking up "in the Oklahoma Hills where I was born." =   On 10/30/07, Frank Awbrey <frankeegee1> = wrote:
Hi, I have a quick question about a local (franchised) = coffee shop that has just opened in the last week or so. It is called = the "Coffee Beanery". I stopped by on Saturday evening to get a quick = cup (to try an espresso)(had been a long drive and was still 30 minutes = from home), but they were closed. I googled them and I think it says = that they do their roasts in Michigan. Anyway, I was wondering if anyone = has tried their espresso and how you think it might compare to something = like *$. Are their roasts fairly fresh or are they like *$. This is the = only type of espresso I have tried, *$ and a couple of small shops. I'm = still looking for what I think might be a very good espresso (don't = think I've ever had a good one) with only 5 or 6 different places tried. =    Thx. "Still the = one" Frank
-- = Start HOT and work your way Down... Peppers AND = Coffee. [|:{O....[|:{U... (I'm the tall guy in the middle) = Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-91-812041924--

5) From: Frank Awbrey
Well, I still haven't had a chance to go in and try them, yet. But, after
reading on their website that it is roasted in Michigan, I don't give it
much chance to be better than *$. I want to try the espresso, not the
regular coffee, since I roast and brew my own, but don't have an espresso
machine to brew my own espresso.
thx
On 10/31/07, TERRY TITSWORTH  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Frank
"Still the one"

6) From: raymanowen
"since I...don't have an espresso machine to brew my own espresso."
And they likely have only trained employees that can push buttons like any
trained Orangutan...
Show of hands: Who can regularly procure a shot of straight espresso that is
10% as good as the shots you pull at home? Any nominations? They gotta roast
their own- they gotta care that much...
"Barista" is a misapplied moniker. How about Artista?
"Better than *$" is a foul damnation. I, too, am better than some of the
World's Worst. EGAD!
Cheers, Mabuhay -RayO, aka Opa!
On 10/31/07, Frank Awbrey  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
"When the theme hits the bass, I dance the Jig!" - -Virgil Fox at the Mighty
Wichita (ex- NYC Paramount) WurliTzer- 1976

7) From: Sandy Andina
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Don't tar all Michigan commercial roasters with the same brush.  One  
of the best in the country is Dead River Coffee Roasters up in  
Marquette (on the Upper Peninsula).
On Oct 31, 2007, at 6:33 PM, Frank Awbrey wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
--Apple-Mail-97-827264182
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	charsetO-8859-1
Don't tar all Michigan commercial roasters with the same brush.  One =
of the best in the country is Dead River Coffee Roasters up in Marquette =
(on the Upper Peninsula).
On Oct 31, 2007, at 6:33 PM, =
Frank Awbrey wrote:
But, after reading on their = website that it is roasted in Michigan, I don't give it much chance to = be better than *$. Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-97-827264182--

8) From: Sandy Andina
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Metropolis (4 bl. away) and Intelligentsia (3 mi. away).
On Oct 31, 2007, at 8:25 PM, raymanowen wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
--Apple-Mail-100-827944911
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Metropolis (4 bl. away) and Intelligentsia (3 mi. away).
On =
Oct 31, 2007, at 8:25 PM, raymanowen =
wrote:
Show of hands: Who can regularly procure a = shot of straight espresso that is 10% as good as the shots you pull at = home? Any nominations? They gotta roast their own- they gotta care that = much... Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-100-827944911--

9) From: raymanowen
That's two-  easy counting all the hands... -ro
On 10/31/07, Sandy Andina  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
"When the theme hits the bass, I dance the Jig!" - -Virgil Fox at the Mighty
Wichita (ex- NYC Paramount) WurliTzer- 1976

10) From: John Brown
Javalina's just across the street from my home
Sandy Andina wrote:
<Snip>

11) From: Frank Awbrey
Well, I did stop by the place this evening on my way home and had a single
shot of espresso. I thought it tasted about the same as a *$. I couldn't
tell any difference. The people all seemed nice, but I got the impression
that they don't know too much about espresso.
The young girl acted like she couldn't believe I didn't want milk or
anything in it. The person that actually pushed the button (no visible
tamping, etc.) tried to give me a large (16 oz) cup for my single shot. So,
I wasn't really impressed with them, even with my very limited knowledge
about espresso.
Thx
On 10/31/07, John Brown  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Frank
"Still the one"

12) From: James Raven
No store wants to know or care that much, it's bad for their instant profit=
s!!  Isn't that why we all go to the trouble we go to,  for one single cup =
of enjoyable coffee, espresso or otherwise?
YEP, that would be why.
From: frankeegee1
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +new "coffee beanery" in town
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 22:32:45 -0700
Well, I did stop by the place this evening on my way home and had a single =
shot of espresso. I thought it tasted about the same as a *$. I couldn't te=
ll any difference. The people all seemed nice, but I got the impression tha=
t they don't know too much about espresso.
The young girl acted like she couldn't believe I didn't want milk or anythi=
ng in it. The person that actually pushed the button (no visible tamping, e=
tc.) tried to give me a large (16 oz) cup for my single shot. So, I wasn't =
really impressed with them, even with my very limited knowledge about espre=
sso.
Thx
On 10/31/07, John Brown  wrote:
Javalina's just across the street from my home
Sandy Andina wrote:
<Snip>

13) From: Les
Hey lets stop the store bashing!  I used to do it.  Mike McKoffee is
having his opening today, and I bet it will be great coffee.  I can
get a drinkable brew at "Gotta hava Java" here in Roseburg.  There are
two pretty good shops in Eugene and one just 10 miles North,
Whitehorse Coffee that roasts their own as well as pulls shots.
Besides somebody has to buy all of those beans that Tom rejects.  If
they didn't the price of those great beans would be way too high.
Les
On 10/31/07, James Raven  wrote:
<Snip>

14) From: Julie Tieszen
I ordered a shot of espresso at *$ one time and the teenager said, "What?"=
Julie
----- Original Message ----
From: Frank Awbrey 
To: homeroast
Sent: Thursday, Nove=
mber 1, 2007 1:32:45 AM
Subject: Re: +new "coffee beanery" in town
W=
ell, I did stop by the place this evening on my way home and had a single s=
hot of espresso. I thought it tasted about the same as a *$. I couldn't tel=
l any difference. The people all seemed nice, but I got the impression that=
 they don't know too much about espresso.
 
The young girl act=
ed like she couldn't believe I didn't want milk or anything in it. The pers=
on that actually pushed the button (no visible tamping, etc.) tried to give=
 me a large (16 oz) cup for my single shot. So, I wasn't really impressed w=
ith them, even with my very limited knowledge about espresso.
 
=
Thx
 
On 10/31/07, John Brown  wrote:
Jav=
alina's just across the street from my home
Sandy Andina wrote:
> Me=
tropolis (4 bl. away) and Intelligentsia (3 mi. away).
> On Oct 31, 20=
07, at 8:25 PM, raymanowen
>  wrot=
e:
>
>> Show of hands: Who can regularly procure a shot of straight esp=
resso
>> that is 10% as good as the shots you pull at home? Any nomina=
tions?
>> They gotta roast their own- they gotta care that much...
>
=
<Snip>
homeroast mailing listhttp://l=ists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast
To change your personal l=
ist settings (digest options, vacations, unsvbscribes) go tohttp://sweetma=rias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings
-- 
Frank=
"Still the one" 

15) From: TERRY TITSWORTH
Sorry Les,
My intent was not as a 'store bashing' as much as a service
bashing/complaint. I also failed to interject that the young lady appeared
'annoyed' that I was breaking her 'routine'. Sort of reminds me now of the
Ad for Visa where everything come to a halt because someone had the common
sense to pay with cash.
Remember folks Visa TAKES Life.
TerryT
On 11/1/07, Les  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Start HOT and work your way Down...
Peppers AND Coffee.
[|:{O....[|:{U...
(I'm the tall guy in the middle)

16) From: Frank Awbrey
Sorry, Les, I also did not intend to do any store bashing. I have drank
coffee for over 30 years, but did not realize what I was missing out on
until I started doing my own roasts, etc, earlier this year. I have read so
much about home brewed espresso and have never had what I would call a
"good" shot of it (only have had a total of about 6 or 8 shots of espresso,
mainly from franchise places). I really would like to try a good shot of
espresso to see what everyone is talking about. So far, I have not liked any
of these 6 or 8 or so shots that I have tried. If that is what "good"
espresso is supposed to be, then I don't like it and don't want to waste
money on espresso equipment. I will stick to my normal coffee until I
find/taste what every one raves about.
Thx, still looking,
On 11/1/07, TERRY TITSWORTH  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Frank
"Still the one"

17) From: Jim Gundlach
Les,
       Thanks for the reminder.
Mike,
      Best of luck on opening day.  Try to remember that these kinds  
of things can be very stressful so take a few breaks and let yourself  
unwind and relax a bit.  Remember nothing can work out in the long run  
if you don't take care of yourself.
      Pecan Jim
On Nov 1, 2007, at 8:10 AM, Les wrote:
<Snip>

18) From: James Raven
Les, 
Out of curiosity, did any of the stores you worked in ask you to alter your=
 own particular style or speed of making drinks? Try to alter it not realiz=
ing that it also altered the quality? Just as business men I mean?
<Snip>
fits!! Isn't that why we all go to the trouble we go to, for one single cup=
 of enjoyable coffee, espresso or otherwise?
<Snip>
le shot of espresso. I thought it tasted about the same as a *$. I couldn't=
 tell any difference. The people all seemed nice, but I got the impression =
that they don't know too much about espresso.
<Snip>
thing in it. The person that actually pushed the button (no visible tamping=
, etc.) tried to give me a large (16 oz) cup for my single shot. So, I wasn=
't really impressed with them, even with my very limited knowledge about es=
presso.
<Snip>
cribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>
llenge with star power.
<Snip>
_oct
<Snip>
cribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>
ribes) go tohttp://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettingsHelp yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Café. Stop =
by today.http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Oc=tWLtagline=

19) From: Les
I used to lump all of the "commercial" establishments in the same bunch.
One of the nicest experiences was at Stumptown a couple of years ago.  I
asked for a Ristretto and I thought the Barista has done a nice job, as my
wife and I were enjoying our coffee he came over with another ristretto and
said, "I wasn't 100% happy with the one I served you, please give me the one
you have, I think you will enjoy this one more."  It was a much better
shot.  That is what I call customer service.  I don't mind hearing about
poor service at an individual establishment, I think that will keep us all
on our toes.  So thanks for the clarification.
Les
On 11/1/07, TERRY TITSWORTH  wrote:
<Snip>

20) From: Les
Jim,
I have never worked in a store.  Don't think I want to either.
Les
On 11/1/07, James Raven  wrote:
<Snip>
e
<Snip>
o,
<Snip>
oct
<Snip>
p
<Snip>
OctWLtagline
<Snip>

21) From: James Raven
confusion. I thought you were a barista , sorry for the misunderstanding. N=
o disrespect intended. I was just curious Les. 
"We are what we think.
All that we are arises
With our thoughts.
With our thoughts,
We make our world."
       -- Buddha 
From: les.albjerg
To: homeroast
Subject: Re: +new "coffee beanery" in town
Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 10:19:58 -0700
Jim,
I have never worked in a store.  Don't think I want to either.
 
Les
 
On 11/1/07, James Raven  wrote:
Les,
Out of curiosity, did any of the stores you worked in ask you to alter your=
 own particular style or speed of making drinks? Try to alter it not realiz=
ing that it also altered the quality? Just as business men I mean?
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>
fits!! Isn't that why we all go to the trouble we go to, for one single cup=
 of enjoyable coffee, espresso or otherwise?
<Snip>
homeroast
<Snip>
le shot of espresso. I thought it tasted about the same as a *$. I couldn't=
 tell any difference. The people all seemed nice, but I got the impression =
that they don't know too much about espresso.
<Snip>
thing in it. The person that actually pushed the button (no visible tamping=
, etc.) tried to give me a large (16 oz) cup for my single shot. So, I wasn=
't really impressed with them, even with my very limited knowledge about es=
presso.
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>
www.sandyandina.com
<Snip>http://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast<Snip>
cribes) go to http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>
<Snip>
llenge with star power.
<Snip>
_oct
<Snip>
cribes) go to http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings<Snip>
<Snip>
ribes) go to http://sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettingsHelp yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Café. Stop =
by today.http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us=">http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Oc=tWLtaglinePeek-a-boo FREE Tricks & Treats for You!http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us=

22) From: David Martin
Sandy -
Are you a Yooper!?
I'm from Marquette, but I haven't tried Dead River, as I haven't been
back there in years.
Geeze, you're making me homesick.
-Dave
On 10/31/07, Sandy Andina  wrote:
<Snip>

23) From: Sandy Andina
--Apple-Mail-106-885023476
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Not a Yooper, but my singing partner owns a cabin up near Brevort; we  
play up in Marquette, Munising, Marinette and Escanaba several times  
a year.
On Nov 1, 2007, at 1:01 PM, David Martin wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
--Apple-Mail-106-885023476
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html;
	charsetO-8859-1
Not a Yooper, but my singing partner owns a cabin up near Brevort; we =
play up in Marquette, Munising, Marinette and Escanaba several times a =
year.
On Nov 1, 2007, at 1:01 PM, David Martin =
wrote:
Sandy - Are you = a Yooper!?I'm from Marquette, but I = haven't tried Dead River, as I haven't beenback = there in years.Geeze, you're making me = homesick. -Dave On 10/31/07, Sandy Andina <sandraandina> = wrote:  Don't tar all Michigan = commercial roasters with the same brush.  One of thebest in the country is Dead River Coffee Roasters up = in Marquette (on theUpper Peninsula). On Oct = 31, 2007, at 6:33 PM, Frank Awbrey wrote:But, = after reading on their website that it is roasted in Michigan, I = don'tgive it much chance to be better = than *$. Sandy homeroast mailing listhttp://li=sts.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroastTo change your personal list settings (digest = options, vacations, unsvbscribes) go to http://=sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html#personalsettings = Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-106-885023476--

24) From: miKe mcKoffee
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
Did something similar this afternoon myself. Not a ristretto but a 8oz
double shot skinny mocha latte. I wasn't really happy with the milk steam
job (slightly over heated it) though the shot was gorgeous and smelled
great. At first made the mistake of figuring the chocolate would compensate
for any milk sweetness loss but as soon as he sat down did the right thing.
While he was drinking it made another and brought it to him. He said this
one is fine but I took away the half empy cup anyway in exchange for the one
I was satisfied with. Later when I asked how he liked the second one he said
it was much better.
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffeehttp://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must">http://www.mcKonaKoffee.comURL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/ 
From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Les
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 10:19 AM
I used to lump all of the "commercial" establishments in the same bunch.
One of the nicest experiences was at Stumptown a couple of years ago.  I
asked for a Ristretto and I thought the Barista has done a nice job, as my
wife and I were enjoying our coffee he came over with another ristretto and
said, "I wasn't 100% happy with the one I served you, please give me the one
you have, I think you will enjoy this one more."  It was a much better shot.
That is what I call customer service.  I don't mind hearing about poor
service at an individual establishment, I think that will keep us all on our
toes.  So thanks for the clarification. 
 
Les

25) From: Frank Awbrey
Since I am so new at trying/tasting espresso, I have a quick question about
the shots. I have only ever ordered a "single" shot. Does a double shot have
a different or a similar flavor as the single?
Ok, I have a second quick question. I don't drink any "flavored" drinks. I
really don't know the difference between a latte or cappacino, etc. Would
trying one of these be a better shot than just a straight espresso at
someplace like the Coffee Beanery or *$? As you can see, I don't spend a lot
of money at these places.
On 10/30/07, Frank Awbrey  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Frank
"Still the one"

26) From: miKe mcKoffee
Do NOT attempt to use Charbucks as a benchmark for espresso in any form,
unless as a benchmark for what good espresso is NOT. Can't speak for the
"Coffee Beanery". Seek out a good Third Wave shop. Maybe pop on BGA forum
and ask who's near you. http://www.mcKonaKoffee.comURL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must">http://www.baristaguildofamerica.org/index.phpKona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffeehttp://www.mcKonaKoffee.comURL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/	From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of Frank Awbrey
	Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:21 AM
	
	Since I am so new at trying/tasting espresso, I have a quick
question about the shots. I have only ever ordered a "single" shot. Does a
double shot have a different or a similar flavor as the single?
	 
	Ok, I have a second quick question. I don't drink any "flavored"
drinks. I really don't know the difference between a latte or cappacino,
etc. Would trying one of these be a better shot than just a straight
espresso at someplace like the Coffee Beanery or *$? As you can see, I don't
spend a lot of money at these places. 
	
	On 10/30/07, Frank Awbrey  wrote: 
		Hi, I have a quick question about a local (franchised)
coffee shop that has just opened in the last week or so. It is called the
"Coffee Beanery". I stopped by on Saturday evening to get a quick cup (to
try an espresso)(had been a long drive and was still 30 minutes from home),
but they were closed. I googled them and I think it says that they do their
roasts in Michigan. Anyway, I was wondering if anyone has tried their
espresso and how you think it might compare to something like *$. Are their
roasts fairly fresh or are they like *$. This is the only type of espresso I
have tried, *$ and a couple of small shops. I'm still looking for what I
think might be a very good espresso (don't think I've ever had a good one)
with only 5 or 6 different places tried. 
		 
		 Thx.
		"Still the one"
		
		Frank 
	-- 
	
	Frank
	
	"Still the one"

27) From: Dean
I only drink doubles, so I can't answer your first question.....other 
than to suggest that a lot of places will usually serve a double as a 
shot.  Double here is about a half ounce (14 gm) of coffee to 2 fl oz 
+/- of water using the "big" basket.
To your second question, the difference is proportions--how much coffee 
to steamed milk to foam, with a latte being (basically) a glass of 
steamed milk flavored with a little bit of coffee (and a lot of 
chocolate, caramel, sugar, etc).  Whether you would enjoy one of these 
more than a straight shot at Fourbux--probably: the high volume of milk 
mutes the stale, burned & badly extracted defects, to they don't offend 
as much.  Unless the milk is held-over, resteamed in a crusty pitcher, 
over-heated, and poorly foamed........ Still, these wouldn't help you 
much on your path to espresso learning
Back when I was a noob (3-4 years ago) there was a lot of chatter here 
and on alt.coffee about espresso.  Machines, beans, blends, technique, 
etc.  Got me started back down the dark side....  Welcome, enjoy the ride!
Dean
Roastin in the weeds in Iowa
We're getting a 4$ here next week, so we won't have to go to the big 
city no more!  Whoo-Hooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!
Frank Awbrey wrote:
<Snip>

28) From: Bryan Wray
I would definitely order a double when going into a shop, for two reasons:
1)  A lot of baristi (myself partly included) find a single basket awkward/difficult to correctly dose, distribute, and tamp compared to a double.
2)  With a double you get more volume so you essentially get to taste it from piping hot out of the machine down to 100F or so.  This will allow you to evaluate the shot as it cools (more/different flavors often come out as a shot of espresso- or cup of coffee- cool).
HTH
-Bry
 
Bryan Wray
NaDean's Coffee Place
Kalamazoo, MI
"It is my hope that people realize that coffee is more than just a caffeine delivery service, it can be a culinary art"- Chris Owens.
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29) From: Bryan Wray
It's a daily routine for me to run shots of espresso out to customers after I have given them one if I didn't like the way the first one came out.  Couple of days ago I had a customer who ordered a double.  I pulled the shot, and it seemed like it was pretty under-extracted so (no drops at 10 seconds, only about 1 ounce at 20ish seconds) so I stopped the shot and dumped it.  The guy was blown away.  "I've never seen anyone do that before..."
I was kind of puzzled...  "You've never seen anyone scrap a crap shot before?"
"Not around here!  Just because of that you guys have my business exclusively, and I will spread the word about you guys to everyone I know."  (we have only been open at this location for a 5 weeks).
It made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside to serve him a great shot 2 attempts later and say, "Here ya go... I would even drink this one!"
-Bry
 
Bryan Wray
NaDean's Coffee Place
Kalamazoo, MI
"It is my hope that people realize that coffee is more than just a caffeine delivery service, it can be a culinary art"- Chris Owens.
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30) From: Scott Miller
When you consider the cost of a shot, it amazes me that more shop owners
don't insist on tossing the marginal shots. Dumping shots is expected in my
shop: I know that it's impossible for me to get a winning pull every time
and let my staff know that I don't expect them to either.
I'm in a small town with 2 *$ and 5 shops, yet our shop is the only one
(according to customers & my own observations) where sink shots are regular
part of the daily routine.
cheers,
Scott
On Nov 3, 2007 11:30 PM, Bryan Wray  wrote:
<Snip>

31) From: gin
Scott:
Great! More places should do it. The small shops, three/six stool places in the little villages of Paris all dump shots...
they just know!!
ginny
---- Scott Miller  wrote: 
<Snip>

32) From: Brian Kamnetz
Hey Bry,
Looks like I will probably be in Kazoo around Christmas time to visit
my sister and her family. If so I look forward to visiting NaDean's. I
have had very little espresso; the best I've had was in Madison, at a
place on Willy Street where Sandy sometimes plays (when I asked her
for suggestions it was one of the places she mentioned). I look
forward to a double at NaDean's!
Brian with an I
On Nov 3, 2007 11:30 PM, Bryan Wray  wrote:
<Snip>

33) From: Frank Awbrey
Thx, for the link, Mike. I have bookmarked it so I can go to it
periodically. I guess what I need to do is actually read up on espresso,
baristas, etc. as I really have no idea what it is all about except for just
the general talk on this site and coffeegeek (only two coffee sites that I
normally visit, so far). I really doubt that the two franchise places that I
have visited here in Flagstaff really have actual "baristas". They look more
like young, run of the mill hired help, not someone knowledgeable about
coffee making.
I think I will try the "double" shots from now on (when I do order
espresso). I mostly went with the single shots just because of the lower
cost and the unknown "taste" factor of espresso for me. I will probably
continue to stay away from the other, non-espresso type drinks, for now.
Well, I just finished my second of two "self alloted daily" cups of
coffee--Columbia Supremo 15943. I may even take a break from my "computer
cruising" and make some breakfast for me and my wife :-),  (maybe sneek in a
3rd cup?). Now that sounds good.
Thx, Frank
On 11/4/07, gin  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Frank
"Still the one"

34) From: Brian Kamnetz
Where are you, Scott?
Brian
On Nov 4, 2007 7:55 AM, Scott Miller  wrote:
<Snip>

35) From: Scott Miller
Statesboro, GA
A fine little peanut patch of a town! About 1 hour from Savannah up I-16 as
you head towards Macon & ATL.
cheers,
Scott
On Nov 4, 2007 11:08 AM, Brian Kamnetz  wrote:
<Snip>

36) From: Brian Kamnetz
Scott,
I was in your neck of the woods Friday, Ridgeland SC. I don't get down
there very often, though. Did you say you work at a coffee shop?
Brian
On Nov 4, 2007 2:02 PM, Scott Miller  wrote:
<Snip>

37) From: Bryan Wray
Hey, we have a new location (and I like this one a lot more, I have more freedom to do things because I'm sort of the GM of this store.)  We run 2-3 espresso blends every day and have different guest coffees that we switch out monthly or so (depends on when the greens run out).  We actually run totally different coffees between the two locations and I'm much more impressed by the coffees and blends at Dino's than the coffees at NaDeans (just my personal opinion).  If you would like more info, let me know.
-Bry
 
Bryan Wray
NaDean's Coffee Place
Kalamazoo, MI
"It is my hope that people realize that coffee is more than just a caffeine delivery service, it can be a culinary art"- Chris Owens.
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38) From: Brian Kamnetz
Bry,
I would like more info, especially the location of Dino's. I will
contact you off list to ask for the specifics.
Brian
On Nov 4, 2007 4:05 PM, Bryan Wray  wrote:
<Snip>

39) From: Sandy Andina
--Apple-Mail-19--970958476
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	charset-ASCII;
	delsp=yes;
	format=flowed
Not necessarily--a caffe latte does not have any flavorings unless  
one is specified in the name.  As usually constituted in America  
there is a little foam (usually rises to the top of the steamed milk,  
except in a true Third Wave shop where it is all microfoam).  A  
traditional cappuccino has equal thirds espresso, steamed milk and  
foamed milk (again, a Third Wave shop will use all microfoam, perhaps  
a tad thicker than for a latte).  It is usually 5-6 oz. total. And an  
"American" or "Seattle" style cappuccino has more milk in relation to  
espresso than a trad, and more of that milk will be steamed--in most  
chain shops the foam is not integrated into the rest of the milk,  
with the foam being held back while the milk is poured and the foam  
then spooned on top.   Regardless of how much espresso there is, an  
American cappa usually has equal parts of steamed milk and foam--and  
the drink is usually no smaller than 12 oz.  But in a Third Wave shop  
the milk in an American cappa will usually be all thicker microfoam-- 
with the milk and foam integrated.
On Nov 3, 2007, at 10:43 AM, Dean wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy
www.sandyandina.com
www.sass-music.com
--Apple-Mail-19--970958476
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Content-Type: text/html;
	charsetO-8859-1
Not necessarily--a caffe latte does not have any flavorings unless one =
is specified in the name.  As usually constituted in America there is =
a little foam (usually rises to the top of the steamed milk, except in a =
true Third Wave shop where it is all microfoam).  A traditional =
cappuccino has equal thirds espresso, steamed milk and foamed milk =
(again, a Third Wave shop will use all microfoam, perhaps a tad thicker =
than for a latte).  It is usually 5-6 oz. total. And an "American" or =
"Seattle" style cappuccino has more milk in relation to espresso than a =
trad, and more of that milk will be steamed--in most chain shops the =
foam is not integrated into the rest of the milk, with the foam being =
held back while the milk is poured and the foam then spooned on top.   =
Regardless of how much espresso there is, an American cappa usually has =
equal parts of steamed milk and foam--and the drink is usually no =
smaller than 12 oz.  But in a Third Wave shop the milk in an American =
cappa will usually be all thicker microfoam--with the milk and foam =
integrated.
On Nov 3, 2007, at 10:43 AM, Dean =
wrote:

 a latte being (basically) a = glass of steamed milk flavored with a little bit of coffee (and a lot of = chocolate, caramel, sugar, etc). 

= Sandywww.sass-music.com
= = --Apple-Mail-19--970958476--

40) From: James Raven
great way to run a business Mike, all should do the same, or employ people =
who care that much about their passion for coffee. 
Good Luck.
From: mcKona
To: homeroast
Subject: RE: +new "coffee beanery" in town
Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 23:53:13 -0700
Did something similar this afternoon myself. Not a
ristretto but a 8oz double shot skinny mocha latte. I wasn't really happy
with the milk steam job (slightly over heated it) though the shot was
gorgeous and smelled great. At first made the mistake of figuring the choco=
late
would compensate for any milk sweetness loss but as soon as he sat down did=
 the
right thing. While he was drinking it made another and brought it to him. H=
e
said this one is fine but I took away the half empy cup anyway in exchange =
for
the one I was satisfied with. Later when I asked how he liked the second on=
e he
said it was much better.
Kona Konnaisseur miKe mcKoffeehttp://www.mcKonaKoffee.comURL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes
etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the
quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must first not know.=
 And
in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment found exploring the=
 many
divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List -
Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/From: homeroast-admin
[mailto:homeroast-admin] On Behalf Of
Les
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 10:19 AM
I used to lump all of the "commercial" establishments in the same
bunch.  One of the nicest experiences was at Stumptown a couple of years
ago.  I asked for a Ristretto and I thought the Barista has done a nice
job, as my wife and I were enjoying our coffee he came over with another
ristretto and said, "I wasn't 100% happy with the one I served you, please
give me the one you have, I think you will enjoy this one more."  It was
a much better shot.  That is what I call customer service.  I don't
mind hearing about poor service at an individual establishment, I think tha=
t
will keep us all on our toes.  So thanks for the clarification.
Les
Peek-a-boo FREE Tricks & Treats for You!http://www.reallivemoms.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us=

41) From: raymanowen
"If that is what "good" espresso is supposed to be, then I don't like it and
don't want to waste money on espresso equipment. I will stick to my normal
coffee until I find/taste what every one raves about."
This is Exactly what I had in mind when I got a Thrift Store aluminum Moka
Pot. It made a good drink after I cut down a fruit jar gasket to fit. A
steam toy and a Vietnamese coffee filter made neat drinks, too.
Mr. Coffee also had a toy pump machine that occasionally made very good
shots (for a neophyte espresso drinker.) I was trying to expose the Error of
all the Raving Lunatics on the list re: Espresso- the Misuse of Coffee
beans. Bad stuff, and I was going to prove it, fair and square.
Silly Me! All I did was prove that all brewing methods improve vastly with a
real grinder, and that I do indeed like espresso brewed coffee. Big Dummy!
I will go out on a limb and opine that, of the coffee chain outlets,*
Maybe*One in a Thousand can distinguish their own anatomical features
from
topographic landmarks. Of the ones that can, very few could blow their nose
if coffee knowledge were TNT.
A friend opened her own coffee/ jazz shop a decade ago. Great jazz, big band
combos, Mary Flower and other singers with steel guitars and hammered
dulcimers. Crazy good sounds. Carole asked me one afternoon, "Hey, Ray- have
you ever had an espresso drink? Here, try this, you'll like it-"
Nope, I did, and I didn't. It started out bitter and mellowed out a little.
Subsequent shots were about the same. I thought Carole was just saddled with
a hugely expensive, noisy yuppie drink maker that she wouldn't operate while
someone was playing or singing.
Due to a certain encounter between my Corvair and an Olds wagon, I didn't
even remember that I had roasted coffee about 20 years earlier. I'll find
the AromaRoast while we move all this stuff to new digs...
Cheers, Mabuhay -RayO, aka Opa!
Got Grinder?
On Nov 1, 2007 9:28 AM, Frank Awbrey  wrote:
<Snip>


HomeRoast Digest