HomeRoast Digest


Topic: rocky grinder questions (43 msgs / 1127 lines)
1) From: Dean De Crisce
Hi all
wondering what grind people use on the rocky for different preps.
My true zero is set at zero.
I use 8-11 for espresso, 17 for moka pot, 20 for drip, and 50 for french
press.
Espresso is easier for me to judge, because of the golden rule (25 sec for 2
oz with approximately 15 gm),
but I am sometimes clueless what other forms of coffee 'should' be at or
taste like.
-- 
Dean De Crisce
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2) From: Gary Foster
My rocky zero is true zero also.  I've been using 6 to 11 for espresso 
(normally around 10, slightly finer for decaf, way finer for the decaf 
black cat).  I use 25 for drip and 35 or so for the FP.
-- Gary F.
Dean De Crisce wrote:
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3) From: Frank Parth
Wow, I'm jealous.
My Rocky's true zero is about 10 on the ring. I do about 40 for FP and about 12 for espresso. I've been tempted to 
replace the number band just so I won't have to keep track of what true zero is.
Frank Parth
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4) From: Coffee
Strangely My rocky zero is 0. Go figure. I do 4 or 5 for espresso  
(sometimes I want 4.5 and then that makes me want a better grinder ...  
best not think that way. That will only get me in trouble). I bought  
another grinder for drip/french press, etc, but when I was using the  
rocky, I used 30 or 35 for the french press and 25 or 30 for drip  
depending on mood and whether I remembered to change it.
-Peter
On Mar 22, 2008, at 6:51 PM, Frank Parth wrote:
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5) From: Kris McN
I've seen other posts where someone has a Rocky for espresso grinding, and
another grinder to grind for other brewing methods.  Is this because it's
difficult to change settings on the Rocky? I'm asking because I'm thinking
about upgrading my grinder.  I don't currently do espresso - I do pour-over,
FP, AP, moka pot, and KMB - but I might start to move darkward in the near
future.
Best,
Kris McN
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6) From: Gary Foster
Don't know other people's reasons, I use my Rocky for everything and
it's a matter of about 2 seconds to change the grinder setting.
Couldn't possibly be any easier.
-- Gary F.
On Sat, Mar 22, 2008 at 10:05 PM, Kris McN  wrote:
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7) From: Coffee
It's easy to change the settings, but not so easy to change beans. It  
leaves a couple of grams of grinds in the shoot (I have the doserless  
model). Some people use and appropriately sized "Click-Clack" lid to  
puff out the grinds. Other use a vacuum. I find it easier to just  
leave the Rocky espresso. I toss the first couple of grams of grind to  
get rid of the stale grinds left in the shoot.
For FP/Drip/Vacuum Pot I have more variety of coffee than I do for  
espresso. I have a Breville grinder for non-espresso use. It has a  
relatively straight down grind path. I weigh out the beans before I  
add it to the grinder and it grinds it all with no static so it's  
pretty clear for the next bean.
-Peter
On Mar 22, 2008, at 10:05 PM, Kris McN wrote:
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8) From: Bob Hazen
How would y'all compare an old Gaggia MDF (metal case) to a Rocky?  I'm 
mostly a pour-over or Technivorm guy, but sometimes I pull shots with an 
equally old Gaggia Coffee machine.  The MDF does "store" some grinds which I 
find somewhat irritating.  Would a Rocky be a step up in grind quality?  I'm 
thinking the doserless model would help a bit in the stale grinds arena.  Or 
do you think I should consider something like a Mazzer?
Thanks,
Bob

9) From: Sean Cary
out of curiosity and pure laziness to find the manual...how do you find
"true zero"?  I have only been using my Rocky for the month I have been
home, and have not done anything other then fill it and fire it up.
Did order the on/off switch that was posted a few weeks back - that will
make me much happier, I hate holding that switch in.  S/H was
excessive...but hey, doing my part to kick the economy along.
Sean
On Sat, Mar 22, 2008 at 9:51 PM, Frank Parth  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Sean M. Cary
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10) From: Brett Mason
I have several grinders.  Rocky does espresso for me, although it IS
easier to change.  I have a 1950's Cory CCG Grindmaster for drip, and
a 1940's Cory DEG for drip as well.  I have a Zass for road trips...
For drip, the CCG gets it all ground in about 6 seconds, with amazing
consistency - so that's my standard.  I also find that Rocky can't
grind as coarse as I sometimes like - but that's why I have it for
espresso...
Enjoy,
Brett
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 12:05 AM, Kris McN  wrote:
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Cheers,
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11) From: Dean De Crisce
In the process of opening the rocky up to clean the burrs...you can set the hopper to any number you wish when you put it back together. Its easy.. 
Also "coffee," if I were to go down to 4 or 5...i start hearing the burrs touch. I have used this for turkish but not for espresso.  When I go below 7 or so...and tamp at my normal tamping...id get a 60 second shot. How do you do it.
Dean De Crisce
Sent from a Treo.

12) From: Sandy Andina
On Mar 23, 2008, at 1:05 AM, Kris McN wrote:
<Snip>
For me it certainly is.  I am fairly lazy, and prefer not to have to  
constantly switch settings between methods. The Rocky needs to be  
running to change grind settings, and for it to be running requires  
that you hold down the black spring-loaded rocker switch (it has  
another white rocker switch that powers it on). To switch settings,  
you need to move the hopper--and to do that you need to hold down the  
hopper release (also spring-loaded); if you do not have a firm grip on  
the hopper, the hopper will spin out of control and you won't get to  
control the setting. Thus, it takes two (preferably large) hands, and  
three would be better.  That's why I've relegated the Rocky to decaf  
and S.O. espresso beans--I store my regular espresso blends in the  
Mazzer Mini hopper and use the MM for regular espresso--though it too  
needs to be running to set the grind finer, it has a separate  
pushbutton "on" switch that stays on until the "off" button is pushed,  
so that I can grab the burr adjustment stick to turn the collar.  And  
the Solis Maestro Plus is very easy to adjust--just turn the hopper,  
and it doesn't need to be running.  It just isn't optimal for espresso.
Sandy Andina
www.myspace.com/sandyandina
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13) From: Brett Mason
I agree with Sandy on the need to keep the Rocky empty.  I premeasure
beans before each shot-&-brew - keeping beans in the hopper removes my
choices...  This is true of all my grinders, even though the
GrindMaster holds 6lb if I wanted....
Rocky is also a 3-handed operation with the "ARE-YOU-SURE" on switch.
Barry's recommended replacement is part of my tax return package,
along with new tires for the fun car...
Cheers,
Brett
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 9:09 AM, Sandy Andina  wrote:
<Snip>
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14) From: Coffee
With an empty grinder ;-) and the hopper set at 10 or more. Turn the  
grinder on then off again. As the burrs are slowing down, move the  
hopper slowly towards 0. When you first start hearing the burrs rub  
back off immediately, that's your new zero. If you don't get there  
before it stops spinning, do it again starting a little lower this time.
-Peter
On Mar 23, 2008, at 5:19 AM, Sean Cary wrote:
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15) From: Sean Cary
It's just under $25 w/ shipping...  S/H was as much as the part!
I've not had the Rocky running when I change the grind...
Guess I should have read the manual...  Doh.  I never read the manual.
Sean
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 11:12 AM, Brett Mason  wrote:
<Snip>
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16) From: Coffee
My burrs start touching just above 0. Typically I grind espresso at 5.  
I occasionally have a bean that seems to need 4 (really closer to  
about 4.5 -- that's where you need a step-less grinder). In that case,  
I grind at 4 and tamp a little looser. If your burrs start touching at  
4 then your 7 would be like my 3. I would probably get a 60 second  
shot there too.
-Peter
On Mar 23, 2008, at 6:23 AM, Dean De Crisce wrote:
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17) From: James C. Hathaway
My Rocky's true zero is at 4, and I usually grind espresso at 7.

18) From: Jim Anderson
A couple of things.
First, on my Rocky, true zero ended up at about 4. I guess I was a little
aggressive on checking as I got a couple of brass curls out the chute.
Inspection of the burrs showed it was just off of the top flat spots so no
harm, no foul. I only grind for Swiss Gold pourover and have it set at 32.
If you don't keep beans in the hopper, I can't see any reason that the
machine has to be running to change grind settings. Sandy, I think even the
SMP wants to be running if there are beans in there and you are going down
with the adjustment. Although with the timer it stays running so it is no
big deal.
As to the switch, if you are at all comfortable with AC wiring, there are a
couple of ways around the stock configuration, which seems overly
complicated but was probably done to keep the lawyers happy.
I have mine set up so that either switch runs the motor. That way the pulse
function is there for cleaning and the off/on can be used for grinding. If
you didn't care about the pulse, you could just plug the motor into the
white switch and be done with it. While I was in there playing with the
wiring, I moved the white switch to the front and put the black pulse switch
on the side.
Jim
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19) From: Frank Parth
<Snip>
Peter,
Why waste beans that way? I drilled a tiny hole in the top of the hopper and give it a blast of compressed air fromone 
of those cans you buy at the computer store to clear the dust out of electronics. A short blast and a whole lotta 
grinds come out. Or as you say others use the top from a small ClickClack to blow out the grounds. No need to waste 
beans.
Frank Parth
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20) From: Sean Cary
Wes gifted me a EggStractor when I got home last month, and I am amazed at
the amount of gind that comes out with a push or two on that!
Sean
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 4:08 PM, Frank Parth  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Sean M. Cary
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21) From: Ross
Kris,
Unless you are running a coffee house where you would be switching back and 
forth constantly, one grinder will do the job just fine.  I use the Rocky 
for everything, it's a very heavy duty machine that will truly last a 
lifetime, (if not dropped down stairs) with cleaning and replacement of the 
burrs being the only maintenance. (new burrs are < $50.00).  It's easy to 
change grind settings on the Rocky (doser model) if going coarser just set 
it coarser, if going a lot finer, run the grinder as you set it finer so you 
don't jam the burrs (this is easy to do with the doser model, you need three 
hands with the non-doser model).  Assuming your Zero is at Zero (where the 
burrs touch) ball park settings are:  7 to 9 for espresso, 25 to 30 for pour 
over, drip, or moca, and wide open 45++ for Press.  There are better 
grinders for more money.  The Rocky is a good sturdy, easy to use, easy to 
maintain machine.
You have to choose if you want the doser or non doser model.  There are 
advantages and disadvantages to each.  But either variant (doser or not) 
will do it all just fine.  I opted for the doser model and modified it as 
has been discussed here and other places on-line.  I took the portafilter 
holder and finger guard off and put scotch tape over the screw holes, took 
the plate off the top of the doser and modified the doser blades so they 
sweep the doser clean.  I don't store coffee beans in the hopper, I measure 
only the beans I'm going to grind then grind them, and dose it all out. 
Many people opt for the non doser, remove the finger guard and portafilter 
bracket, and use some special method to get the old grinds out of the chute, 
or they just flush with some fresh ground and throw the first little bit 
away every day.  With the non-doser you can easily replace the portafilter 
holder if desired.
There are three and 1/2 advantages to the doser model, none have anything to 
do with actually using the doser to dose.
Reason 1:  The doser model gives you direct access to the chute to clean it. 
The non-doser model is harder to get to.
Reason 2:  The doser will de-clump your espresso grind so you don't have to 
de-clump it with a needle.
Reason 3:  With a flip of the switch the doser model will grind away and not 
make a mess until it is done, you are free to do other things like getting 
water or getting the filter ready ect. while the coffee grinds.  With the 
non doser model you are stuck there with your finger on the button while the 
coffee grinds, (an eternity) for me this reason was the show stopper, I got 
the doser model.
you could do an electrical mod to the non-doser to convert to just the 
On/Off switch.
Reason 3 1/2:  You don't need three hands to run the grinder while selecting 
a finer grind.  On/Off switch vs. push and hold on.
Again this would be solved by an electrical switch mod to the non-doser.
If none of those reasons are a big deal to you the non doser model is your 
best choice.  I'm sure others will give you other considerations for doser 
vs. non-doser.
Again don't think "Do I need a doser?" think in terms of what that doser 
does for you other than dose a fixed amount.  In fact if you do need a 
doser, don't get the Rocky, its doser is not adjustable, it doses a ball 
park 7 gr. , I found myself needing 2 and 1/8 doses for a double shot dose 
so it defeated the purpose of using the doser, I just pre measure the beans 
and dose it all. The doser blades do need to be modified to sweep the doser 
clean, however; that mod is probably not worth it in the long run if you can 
tolerate the little bit left after dosing and sweep the doser and chute 
clean at the end of the coffee or espresso session.
Regards,
Ross

22) From: Coffee
That's a great idea... I've been meaning to do the ClickClack thing,  
but never got around to finding the right size. Yours sounds much more  
Fun/Dangerous. Always a good combination.
-Peter
On Mar 23, 2008, at 1:08 PM, Frank Parth wrote:
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23) From: Rich
I bet one of the clever individuals here could find the parts so you 
could set the can on the counter and have a tube permanently installed 
in the grinder hopper.  Maybe even a single shot solenoid so it is 
totally automatic.  As the grinder switches off the canned air gives the 
hopper a shot.  I bet *$ will buy it also...
Coffee wrote:
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24) From: Bryan Wray
 As the grinder switches off the canned air gives
 the 
hopper a shot.  I bet *$ will buy it also...
If only they had grinders to use it in! haha.
-Bry
Bryan Wray
NaDean's Coffee Place
Kalamazoo, MI
"It is my hope that people realize that coffee is more than just a caffeine delivery service, it can be a culinary art"- Chris Owens of Cafe Grumpy in NYC.
       
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25) From: Paul Helbert
I know I've been living under a rock, but must ask. What is a click clack
lid? I googled and looked at pictures. No clue. Some sort of food storage
containers. How does it work?
Once or twice in a decade I pay the price for not watching any TV.
-- 
Paul Helbert
There are two ends on a candle for good reason. Burn 'em.
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26) From: Rich
Its a lid that when you install it results in a slight puff of air 
through the grinder, or internal pressure increase.  Buy a can of Monica 
and drill a small hole.  cheaper and works much better.  Hang onto the 
hopper top...
Paul Helbert wrote:
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27) From: Barry Luterman
I posted these pictures on Tom's web site.http://www.homeroasting.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId‚22On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 1:38 PM, Paul Helbert 
wrote:
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28) From: Paul Helbert
Great, I wonder if one will fit the top of a Baratza Virtuoso? And what is a
can of Monica?
-- 
Paul Helbert
There are two ends on a candle for good reason. Burn 'em.
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29) From: Larry Selzler
I missed the post on the Switch.  Where did you get details to order the switch?
On 3/23/08, Sean Cary  wrote:
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30) From: John Despres
Cool, Barry. Thanks. I need one so I don't have to get out the vacuum =
every time I want to detail my grinder.
Barry Luterman wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
ee.com
<Snip>
<Snip>
e.com
<Snip>
/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=7820
<Snip>
<Snip>
-- =
John A C Despres
Hug your kids
616.437.9182
Scene It All Productions 
JD’s Coffee Provoked Ramblings =
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31) From: John Despres
I'm wondering the same on both questions...
Paul Helbert wrote:
<Snip>
 a
<Snip>
<Snip>
-- =
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Hug your kids
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32) From: Barry Luterman
Switch can be ordered here:http://www.espressoparts.com/results.cgis?catalog=&selectME&keywords=rockyIt is part number MR_188. It is the switch from the back of the machine.
Just a simple click on/off. Un- plug Rocky,  Pry the old switch off using a
flat bladed screwdriver wrapped in a rag( avoids scratching Rocky). Replace
three wires on old switch to the three terminals on the new switch (bayonet
type). Pop new switch in and Voila Rocky is now a 2 handed machine
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 2:28 PM, Larry Selzler  wrote:
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33) From: Barry Luterman
I am thinking that is a crude reference to Monica Lewinsky. On easter Sunday
no less
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 2:37 PM, John Despres <
john> wrote:
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34) From: Paul Helbert
WhoHoo, fell for that one!
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 8:41 PM, Barry Luterman  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Paul Helbert
There are two ends on a candle for good reason. Burn 'em.
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35) From: Dean De Crisce
Thanks Ross what a great set of comments. Thank you for taking the time.
Dean De Crisce
Sent from a Treo.

36) From: Dean De Crisce
Thanks Ross what a great set of comments. Thank you for taking the time.
Dean De Crisce
Sent from a Treo.

37) From: Kris McN
Thanks to everyone for their responses (and especially to Ross for such a
detailed and thoughtful reply)!  If I'm understanding everyone, those who
have multiple dedicated grinders like to store beans in the hoppers.  I
always measure out just what I'm going to use at that moment, so my grinder
sits empty.  I wasn't thinking about that when I asked.  I also currently
have a KitchenAid ProLine, which has a completely vertical bean path, so I
don't encounter a portion of left-over grounds.  I just wish the KAP was a
better grinder.  I really like the vertical path, and glass hopper and
catcher.
Best,
Kris McN
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38) From: raymanowen
"I'm asking because I'm thinking about upgrading my grinder."
<Snip>
Because of the variety of brewing methods, coffee beans and degrees of
roast, one should include in the selection criteria the facility for grind
pitch adjustment.
The size and quality of the particles- just one homogeneous size, and a
crisp, regular shape of the particles is the main consideration for any
grinder.
I guess you have to hope the designer made it all adjustable. The burr
quality and the rigidity of the machine will make for a quality grind
throughout the machine's range of adjustment.
The comment that some grinders are "good for an espresso grind," while
another may be exclusively good for drip or press, is an amazing scam.
If the ground particles look like fuzzy dice hanging from the rear view
mirror on your '56 Olds, they might not botch a quick espresso brew as much
as they might an extended press brew.
Be that as it may, or not- we just had the pleasure of a couple of doubles
of SM Classic Italian Espresso Blend. Flash frozen right out of the FR
roaster last night, and this morning. Almost shocking good flavor. What a
treat!
I stretched the roast to 16:34, to nurse it definitely in to Second Crack
without going supercritical. A nice dark semigloss appearance made me wish I
had film in the Topcon with the 58mm macro and bellows.
"Don't get the large quantities of green coffee at first."
OK, class- Pop Quiz! Use a sheet of paper and a #2 pencil. Write down the
name of every SM coffee you Don't like...
Cheers, Mabuhay -RayO, aka Opa!
-- 
"When the theme hits the bass, I dance the Jig!" - -Virgil Fox at the Mighty
Wichita (ex- NYC Paramount) WurliTzer- 1976
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39) From: Dean De Crisce
Is true zero when the burrs begin to touch and you can hear metal scraping...or when they stop moving?
Dean De Crisce
Sent from a Treo.

40) From: Jim Anderson
On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 6:11 AM, Dean De Crisce 
wrote:
<Snip>
True zero would be just when they start touching. Right at the first sound
of contact.
Jim
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41) From: Coffee
It's all relative, and just a starting point. You don't want to ever  
run your rocky with the burrs scraping, even just a little, so I would  
call that 0 and never use that setting. The setting that you use for  
espresso, drip, french press etc. When anyone says that they use X for  
this type of pot and Y for that, you should treat it as a starting  
point. Experiment from there. Every bean is different, every roaster  
is different, every grinder is a different, every espresso machine is  
a different, every drip pot is different. With any type of art, there  
is craft. You have to know how to use your tools in order to achieve a  
desired result. Try to be rigorous in your methods so that when you  
change something, you know what the result is, otherwise it's all  
random and you haven't learned anything.
Wow, that all sounded really pompous, I need more coffee.
-Peter
On Mar 25, 2008, at 6:11 AM, Dean De Crisce wrote:
<Snip>
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42) From: Barry Luterman
It's when they first touch and don't worry its not actually the burrs that
are touching . You won't hurt anything finding true zero. I believe it is
the carriers and not the burrs that are touching.If I am wrong someone is
going to correct me very soon.
On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 3:11 AM, Dean De Crisce 
wrote:
<Snip>
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43) From: Bryan Gros
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 8:47 AM, Coffee  wrote:
<Snip>
I had a Rocky for a number of years, and my zero point was about 2.
I found that I was down to grinding at 3 or 4 much of the time, especially
for decaf. (Never could figure out why decaf needs a finer grind, but I
still find it usually is finer even on my new Cimbali Jr.). This is for a
Silvia machine.
Getting so fine on the grinder--does that mean it is time to replace the
burrs? Where's the best place to get new burrs? Tom carry those?
Bryan
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