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Topic: Can a botched air roast be saved (9 msgs / 227 lines)
1) From: Robert Flanery
I have had a few roasts of late that came out grassy and was wondering if
there were any options as to roasting it again to get rid of the grass.  I
would not be adverse to taking it as far as Vienna if needed.  I use a
Popcorn Pumper to roast in, and have been tinkering with slowing down the
roast between 320 and 380 in the hopes of bringing more character, and it
appears that often I have less control than I would like.  But that is
another problem.  Can botched coffee be brought back to life?
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2) From: Sandy Andina
I've reroasted too-light roasts--both air and drum.  Both turned out  
fine.
On Jul 28, 2008, at 8:53 PM, Robert Flanery wrote:
<Snip>
Sandy Andina
www.myspace.com/sandyandina
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3) From: Robert Flanery
Any particular advice or trick to it?  Or is it simply a matter of re
running it like a normal roast?
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 3:13 AM, Sandy Andina  wrote:
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4) From: Brian Kamnetz
Robert,
When I started roasting I used a hot air popper. I had lots of trouble
with grassy roasts, and to make make matters worse, the outsides of
the beans were burned and oily. I was racing from first crack right
into second crack. I had been following suggestions that I roast 2/3
cup at a time, which turned out to be way too much for 6500 feet
elevation. Someone suggested cutting back to 1/3 cup, and that was the
big turn-around for me. So, you might try cutting the size of your
roasts. That will stretch the roasts out so that you get a nice first
crack, followed by a pause. In poppers I found that I liked the
results best if I took everything to the first snaps of second crack.
Good luck!
Brian
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 9:53 PM, Robert Flanery  wrote:
<Snip>
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5) From: Robert Flanery
I am kind of there with that advice Brian.  My biggest single problem is
probably not having an accurate scale to follow with the scientific method.
I keep trying variations in techniques and temps, reinventing the wheel at
times, but observing (and drinking) my way along towards understanding what
makes a good cup.  I have struggled with coming up with a strategy of
temperature manipulation and the resultant cup.  I spend a good amount of
time reading in the archives for that elusive tip.  I have a decent digital
thermometer for the roaster, but it only displays to 460, so I am at a loss
for the endings other than by visual.  I have been for the most part noting
the time when the temp goes beyond the readout, and the first audible second
crack.  That is where I generally cut the roast.  Once I get enough notes
under my belt I will try to put this all into a spread sheet and see if I
can find a trend .
I would love to know if there is a correlation to better coffee roasts and
stretching the time when the coffee is in the 300-400 degree range.  I have
not accurately done this as yet, but would like to know if I am just wasting
my time trying.
Or I could just cave to my wife and buy a ready made tool like the Behmor.
But with the wife going back to college and two kids to raise, I would
rather focus on spending the time and effort to low tech it.  Plus, I am a
little hard of the head.
Rob
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 11:27 AM, Brian Kamnetz  wrote:
<Snip>
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6) From: Martin Dobbins
Robert,
 
I'm using a Freshroast (not much different from a popcorn pumper) and I hav=
en't been doing it long so this is NOT the voice of experience(!)  I've b=
een happy enough with the FR but the way it's designed it does roast fast a=
nd even faster with heavily chaffed beans as the exhaust gets blocked with =
chaff.  I've had some reasonable roasts off it but the one complaint that=
 keeps cropping up is "grassy".  Going to Vienna doesn't help because you=
 get an under roasted interior with a really heavy sun tan.
 
I recently acquired some temperature measuring devices to see if I could se=
e what was going on and if any changes could be made.  I've been trying t=
o stretch the time between first and second crack because that seems like t=
he "window" encompassing City to Full City+ that most people would be aimin=
g for.  I am beginning to believe that the period approaching first crack=
 also has an impact, so I don't think you are wasting your time trying to s=
tretch the 300 to 400 degree time frame.
 
Martin
--- On Tue, 7/29/08, Robert wrote:
<Snip>
nd
stretching the time when the coffee is in the 300-400 degree range.  I ha=
ve
not accurately done this as yet, but would like to know if I am just wasting
my time trying.<<<<
<Snip>
r.
But with the wife going back to college and two kids to raise, I would
rather focus on spending the time and effort to low tech it.  Plus, I am a
little hard of the head.<<<
Rob
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 11:27 AM, Brian Kamnetz 
wrote:
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<Snip>
wondering if
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grass.
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a
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the
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and it
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is
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7) From: Sandy Andina
On Jul 29, 2008, at 7:31 AM, Robert Flanery wrote:
<Snip>
I just reran it and watched and listened to make sure first crack had  
fully ended--and hit "cool" when it began to hit second.
Sandy Andina
www.myspace.com/sandyandina
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8) From: Sandy Andina
I forgot to mention that in each case I used an i-Roast 2.
Sandy Andina
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9) From: Doug Boutell
Martin,
 From my experience with the FR Roaster(2000) and the last 1800 were PID 
controlled
it sounds like that you are going thru the beginning stages of the roast 
way too fast which
results in a grassy flavor. You can rid some of the grassy flavor if you 
take the roast into
the second crack. But  that will also eliminate some of the flavors that 
Tom describes
when he recommends a city -full city plus. If you can place a TC in the 
top of the green
beans and measure the temp. You will want something similiar to this 
profile and you
will not have the grassy flavor.
 From ambient to 265 in 2 minutes
 From 265 to 295 in 2 minutes
 From 295 to 385 in 3 minutes
 From 385 until you finish the roast try for 10 deg per minute rate of 
climb.
If you go from ambient to 285 under 4 minutes you will be close to the
the grassy flavor.
Doug
Martin Dobbins wrote:
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