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Topic: WBC machines (5 msgs / 188 lines)
1) From: Jeffrey Pawlan
I have no information to say one way or another whether there was money 
involved in the WBC decision to use Nuova Simonelli machines rather than La 
Marzocco.
But I can tell you that I have personally done extensive testing on both and I 
found that the actual brew temperature stability that I measured using my own 
precision thermocouples laying right on the coffee definitively shows the Nuova 
Simonelli to be the best of all machines regardless of mods or cost.
   I can also say that based on my research which included side-by-side 
espressos made from my own beans, I purchased a Nuova Simonelli Appia 
and I have been extremely happy with it. The Aurelia was not needed by me at 
home since I only needed a single group.
Jeffrey Pawlan
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2) From: Brian Kamnetz
It's always interesting to hear from you, Jeffrey.
I know very little about espresso machines, so I looked up the machine
you mention and noticed that it comes in "automatic" and
"semi-automatic" variants. I didn't know what that meant, so I looked
it up. There is a good start toward understanding these and similar
things regarding espresso machines on Wikipedia:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Espresso_machineAnyone who is trying to get the basis of an understanding of things
related to espresso machine may enjoy this page. Be SURE, however, to
read the materials under the "Discussion" tab. Also, be ready for any
given point to be not quite correct or even in error.
Brian
On Mon, Sep 15, 2008 at 4:44 PM, Jeffrey Pawlan  wrote:
<Snip>
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3) From: Les
Jeffery you are right the Nuova Simonelli is a very stable machine,
maybe too stable.  Unless you go in an change the  flow restriction
you are stuck at basically one temperature for your shots.  So as long
as you only drink one blend or single origin at the same roast level,
you are in great shape with the Nuova Simonelli once you have the temp
dialed in..  However since most of us like a variety in our shots, I
think the best bet is to learn to temp surf on an HX machine that is a
little less stable or get a good double boiler.
Les
On Mon, Sep 15, 2008 at 2:14 PM, Brian Kamnetz  wrote:
<Snip>
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4) From: denis bordeleau
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5) From: Les
Denis,
The machine in reference is the Nuova Simonelli Appia.  It is a
beautiful machine.  It is a HX machine.  It has a massive boiler.
Once you flush it, the temperature doesn't move.  Say you have it set
a 203 degrees.  It will be 203 degrees.  What if you want to pull a
shot a 198?  I have a single origin that is awesome at under 200, but
is bitter at 203.  In the Nuova Simonelli Appia you have to go inside
and change the flow restriction to change the temperature.  With a
good double boiler, you can do the same thing with changing the
temperature on the front of the machine, i.e. the Brewtus and the
LaSpaziale.  On a less stable machine, like my Expobar Office Control,
you can drop the temp with a flush and having worked out the timing, I
can pull a shot at 198. However as the shot progresses, it will end at
about 200. I can also go as high as 205. However a shot at 205 ends at
about 203.  My pressurestat is set at 203. Since most of my espresso
meets my taste satisfaction at 203, that is where I set my machine.  I
was able to borrow a Scarce PF to set my machine up.  I also used a
good K-Probe thermometer.  My temperature varies much more during the
25 second shot than the Nuova Simonelli Appia.  I still get great
shots.  With that said, I wouldn't mine having a $3700.00 machine.
Les
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 12:13 PM, denis bordeleau  wrote:
<Snip>
ons.  The Nuova Simonelli ( please say what model ...)  "is very stable but=
 might be too much of stability". Flow restriction, unique basic temperatur=
e degree but no surfing capacities makes it perfect for the non adventurous=
 shot.  Is the next step after learning to temperature surf on an Heat Exch=
ange machine really a double boiler?  I hope you don't mind if I make a cal=
l to the crowd.  Just to be sure.   Will wait and see.    Denis
<Snip>
ee.com
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