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Topic: Anyone bought grinders from Whole Latte Love or 1st (27 msgs / 492 lines)
1) From: A
Can anyone who has let me know your experience with the purchase, the item =
and the service?
 
Thanks alot.
      =
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2) From: g paris
Hi there:
I bought my La Valentina from 1st Line several years ago. They have always
been ready to respond to any query I have had.
Whole Latte I have also purchased from and they were great.
a plus and more for both of these companies.
what are you looking for?
g
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 1:42 PM, A  wrote:
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3) From: Barry Luterman
Tom sells grinders. Unless you are looking for one he doesn't sell
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 10:42 AM, A  wrote:
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4) From: Ken B
Are you looking for something our host does not carry?  If so, then what 
are you looking for?  If not, it is poor form to ask about another 
vendor on a list supported by a company that sells that product.  
Support those who support you.  My .02.
Best Regards,
Ken B
A wrote:
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5) From: Barry Luterman
That's what I tried to say gently
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Ken B  wrote:
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6) From: Ken B
Heh, I am old and grumpy. ;-)  Actually, I wrote it before I saw your 
response.  I guess I should read first, THEN type.
Ken B
Barry Luterman wrote:
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7) From: Barry Luterman
My underwear is older and grumpier than you
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 2:45 PM, Ken B  wrote:
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8) From: Kent Landis
Agreed!!! my 2 cents!
Kent
On Dec 19, 2008, at 7:33 PM, Ken B wrote:
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Kent Landis
kelandis
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9) From: Michael Dhabolt
Barry
<Snip>
That really required a Spew Alert.
Mike (just plain)
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10) From: Scott Miller
Actually, there's this really scary image I'm having trouble getting
out of my mind... what I needed was an "EWWW" alert!
cheers,
Scott
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 11:07 PM, Michael Dhabolt
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11) From: Peter Genuardi
Folks -
I've bought plenty of things stuff Tom and am well aware of his excellent
service.  I am also very grateful for the community of homeroasters he has
helped us create online.
That said, I disagree that the only vendor we should mention here is Sweet
Marias.  Tom's service is second to none, and, in the discussion of other
vendors that will come out for certain and he'll rise to the top.
But, I feel that asking folks to cease conversation about what it's like to
purchase from and work with other suppliers discounts the tremendously rich
experience and knowledge that is held by the members of the list.
If we are all to abide by the notion that the "only talk about SM as if it's
the only vendor on the planet," what would be next?  Only allowing people to
discuss bean types that SM has for sale?  I doubt that would last too long.
Thanks for hearing me out.
 - Peter
On Sat, Dec 20, 2008 at 4:36 AM, Scott Miller  wrote:
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12) From: Kris McN
Peter,
The problem with what you've said is that the list rules explicitly bar
"commercial posts", that is, posts that discuss products offered by
competitors.  From Tom in the list rules, "It would be rude to come in our
shop, where we work so hard to offer so much, and talk about the guy down
the road who sells xxx for $x.xx!"  While A's initial post may not have
quite crossed that line, it seems we've always interpreted the rule to
specifically avoid talking about other vendors of any products Sweet Marias
offers.  Like Tom says, this isn't alt.coffee.
Respectfully,
Kris McN
On Sat, Dec 20, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Peter Genuardi wrote:
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13) From: Peter Genuardi
Kris -
First, thank G-d that this isn't alt.coffee.  My brothers and sisters on
this list are much more polite and helpful!
Second, I agree that it would be absolutely ludicrous for the people from
First Line and WLL to come onto this list and say "hey there's a great deal
on the mazzer mini at www.someothervendor.com/whatever.html."  But, I think
it's important for list members to offer insight into the experience of
buying stuff from other vendors. That's quite different from what most would
consider "commercial posts."
As a point of reference, I noticed no one got concerned about commercial
posts when we talked about getting genuine burr replacements from these
other vendors (to the tune of 50+ posts) this fall.  Should we not have
allowed that discussion? Should we not allow people to post links to items
on ebay, since after all those could be diverting business from SM?
Finally, It'd be great to get some guidance from Tom instead of for us to
debate it.  I completely respect that this is an online extension of Tom's
establishment and will of course defer to the rules he sets.
My two cents, though, are that it'd be great to:
1.  bar the enticement for and advertisement of specific offers from non SM
vendors
2.  allow the discussion of service and experience with other vendors
Best - Peter
On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Kris McN  wrote:
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14) From: Joseph Robertson
When it comes to cupping and judging the differences between origins or for
those of us who really love the taste of great coffee, sugar and the like
does not work. In some countries it is the way coffee is consumed. I
personally don't use it for any coffee drink. It helps to cover a less than
desirable roast.
My short answer, no.
JoeR
On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 4:55 PM, Sontheimer, Richard D. (HSC) <
Richard-Sontheimer> wrote:
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15) From: Seth Grandeau
Personally, I find that I can both better enjoy and better distinguish
coffee flavors, when I've added a little sugar.  I'm sure this is only me,
as I have grown up with sugar as a coffee adative, but I definitely
appreciate the subtle flavors better, after adding a little sugar.
On 12/22/08, Joseph Robertson  wrote:
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16) From: Barry Luterman
The difference is Tom does not sell burrs. The origional poster asked about
grinders which Tom does sell. Had he asked about a specific grinder that Tom
does not sell that might have been OK. but still questionable. Qusestionable
because he asked about the other vendors integrity not about the grinder.
On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 8:35 AM, Peter Genuardi wrote:
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17) From: MikeG
My answer to the question would be a very strong no, so while it's a
biased question, it's not a rediculous one.
On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 5:26 PM, Luis Zaman  wrote:
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18) From: Luis Zaman
I would agree that a very strong no is the appropriate answer. It is a  
good question. But I was confused by the "it's the ONLY way" to  
appreciate the taste of coffee, given that part of the taste of coffee  
I appreciate is the subtle sweetness in some varietals, the over  
sweetness of others, and the apparent lack of sweetness in even  
others. This seems like it would be particularly hard if one was to  
add sugar to the coffee. Thats why I was confused.
Maybe there was some miscommunication somewhere?
Luis
On Dec 23, 2008, at 3:24 PM, MikeG wrote:
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19) From: Alchemist John
What great diversity.  It may be the only way Angelo can appreciate 
the taste of coffee, but that is certainly not the case for me.  I 
cup coffees black, but for full and total enjoyment and appreciation, 
sugar and milk is how I drink it.  The ONLY way I do it ;)
At 12:24 PM 12/23/2008, you wrote:
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John Nanci
AlChemist at large
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20) From: Floyd Lozano
My cupping consists of 'make a pot of drip coffee and drink it.  If I
like it, repeat step 1'.  I'm not that sophisticated ;)  I kicked the
milk and sugar solely for weight reasons, i really used to enjoy them
(half and half actually).  These days I find the coffees I drink sweet
enough as is without sugar, but then again, I usually take a cookie or
5 with my coffee, so that might affect taste as well (so much for the
weight reasons, too!)
-F
On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 8:36 PM, Alchemist John
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21) From: Angelo
Sorry, John, I did it again... I keep forgetting that damn (i!)
However, I do add a tad of sweetened condensed milk (a la the 
Vietnamese) and some evaporated milk (a la the Cubanos) to my 
Americano.. And, I do sip the espresso black before I mix the batch..
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22) From: raymanowen
"...abide by the notion that the "only talk about SM as if it's the only
vendor on the planet,"
[Tom is pragmatic, the statement is false, and there is no Gestapo but the
self-appointed ones]
what would be next? [Nothing. Stay tuned- this party line is supported by
SM]
Only allowing...  [Just as restrictive as the 20mph speed limit in school
zones]
Jingle Bells, RayO.
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23) From: Angelo
Louis,
I wrote my message to balance what I thought would be an avalanche of 
messages stating that BLACK is the ONLY way to enjoy coffee and that 
milk and/or sugar is an "adulteration/abomination"..
Sorry for the confusion.
Angelo
At 06:13 PM 12/23/2008, you wrote:
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24) From: Joseph Robertson
I think for the good of the group and a clear understanding of coffee
tasting/cupping/general consuming someone with a fair amount of experience
should step forward and help out here. I guess you could say I have had a
fair amount of experience but not even close to some I know on this list. So
given that I will offer this up....I started out as a home roaster and just
enjoyed coffee on more simple terms. I still do roast at home but now I have
to Cup, you could say taste here but as Tom has pointed out personally on
this list and on the website there is a big difference. Nothing is
ever added to coffee before cupping. Except water. It would defeat your
purpose. If the particular coffee has sweet notes you want to be able to
pick it up at cupping time. Tasting and general consumption should never be
confused with Cupping. None of this is news for many on this list but for
those of you who this may have enlightened read Tom and Maria's website in
depth. Much experience and knowledge is buried in those pages.
JoeR
On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 7:50 PM, Angelo  wrote:
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25) From: raymanowen
"Tasting and general consumption should never be confused with Cupping.
None of this is news for many on this list but for those of you who this may
have enlightened read Tom and Maria's website in depth.
Much experience and knowledge is buried in those pages."
Brutally succinct, Joe. You hit the nail on the head. One can mix up
anything to drink- could even haul coal in the mouth if desired. The Carbon
Conoisseur shouldn't presume to tell others how things should taste or be
enjoyed...
Cheers, Mabuhay and Magandang Hapon -RayO, aka Opa!
If you need help to not kick the habit, talk to your cupper-
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26) From: Luis Zaman
I think we may be getting away from the question a bit. It was not how  
one tastes their coffee, but how they appreciate the taste of coffee.  
Again, you could say that appreciating the taste means appreciating  
the enjoyment they get from that coffee (which could certainly include  
sugar/sweetener) OR that it means finding the nuances in the taste of  
the coffee (which really shouldn't include these).
I thank you and Joe for pointing out the differences here, and I think  
they are important. I just think that the question may (or may not) be  
about what we think!
To the actual question: "Can you fully appreciate the taste of coffee  
if sugar or artifical sweetener has been added?"
Well, appreciate the taste... hmm, Joe? =D
Luis
P.S. Sorry 'bout the CC Joe, just wanted you to get this sometime this  
week! My replies here take forever for some reason.
On Dec 26, 2008, at 6:17 PM, raymanowen wrote:
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27) From: Luis Zaman
Oh, I see :). Less of those than I thought! I was just taken off guard  
I suppose. Some interesting points were raised regardless!
Luis
On Dec 25, 2008, at 1:52 PM, Angelo  wrote:
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