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Topic: What do you say to normal coffee drinkers? (22 msgs / 565 lines)
1) From: R Nepsund
When somebody has shown  interest in my coffee roasting hobby I usually
compare it to making bread in a bread machine.   For a few bucks for a
popper and some green beans which cost less than the roasted stuff they
normally get,  I make coffee that is as much better as bread from a bread
maker is from the flavorless store bought stuff.
How do you usaully describe it?   And any converts?
PS: I think the reason more people don't roast coffee is the same reason a
lot of people have bread machines collecting dust at home.
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2) From: Stephen Carey
I have learned a bit; I don't overly explain what they may taste, 
what flavors lay hidden.  For it is almost certain that I will over 
sell the coffee and get a "very good coffee, Stephen.  Personally, I 
like it a bit darker, but this was excellent." They don't seem to 
have a sense of what excellence is.  But, they do ask for more coffee 
to try at home.  Over time they find they like trying the SOs from 
around the world and they find that because a cup of coffee is 5,50 
doesn't mean it is a great cup of coffee.
For the ones who have been hitting the major chains, it is unlikely 
that with one or two cups of coffee they will jump up and say, a 
pound sir, please.
I do give them coffee taken to full City and slightly above, but I 
encourage them to try the City+ beans and let their tongue decide 
what it tastes, not their expectation of what coffee should taste 
like.  Almost all of my chain drinking friends have taken a while to 
come around.
But, I have to couples, who use a coffee shop downtown, which roasts 
its own coffee and one can put in an order and pick it up that 
evening or the next day.  They get a piece of paper about the coffee, 
where it is from and the tastes they may find on their tongue if 
their mind is clear of expectations.  For them, well, WOW, I have 
been able to let them try all sorts of coffee and they can tell me 
things that help me in my roasting.  I don't mean to take food off of 
the table of their local roaster, but sometimes I will have something 
he doesn't and I roast it for them.  They always pay, which isn't 
necessary, but it makes them feel better about asking for coffee at 
other times.
Good luck with your future roasting.  I hope you not only find a 
convert or two, but mostly enjoy your good work.
Stephen
At 02:22 AM 2/5/2009, you wrote:
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3) From: Steven Van Dyke
At 01:22 AM 2/5/2009, you wrote:
<Snip>
I also describe home roasting in bread terms.
Coffee is like bread - it's only good for so long and the fresher it 
is, the better it is.
Regular coffee is like regular bread.
The 'gourmet' coffees at the store are like the stores that bake 
their own bread.  It's much fresher and better than the 'regular' stuff.
Home roasted coffee is like home made bread, except it's a lot less 
work.  If you can pop popcorn without a microwave you can roast coffee.
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4) From: webviking6
For me the bread machine analogy doesn't quite work. While fresh 
homemade bread is nice, it's not something that I can use all the time 
or feel I need to have all the time. Home roasted coffee is different. I 
absolutely refuse to drink anything else, mainly because I have yet to 
find anything that I can get that is as consistently fresh as what I 
roast myself. I actually start to panic a bit when my supply of green 
beans runs low and I'm waiting on a order from Sweet Maria's.
But the other problem with real fresh roasted coffee, single origin 
beans, and lighter roasts that most home roasters find so wonderful, is 
that the average American coffee drinker just has not had the experience 
with really good coffee to appreciate it. I have given friends what I 
consider wonderful samples of my best roasting efforts and about half of 
them don't like them. "Too flowery" was one actual complaint. The other 
half usually threaten to beat down my door unless I give them more, though.
If you're going to give coffee to friends, I've found it best to start 
out with darker roasts that only hint at the subtleties of flavor that 
you can achieve. Most people expect the bitter, harsh taste of over 
roasted, substandard beans, unfortunately, and you really need to help 
them develop their palettes so they can appreciate better coffee.
For the most part, I've found that giving friends lighter roasted, 
single origin coffee that I have roasted myself is like giving a wino 
some exquisite rare wine and listening to them complain that they didn't 
get a good enough buzz off of it.
R Nepsund wrote:
<Snip>
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5) From: james McDougal
I like to compare coffee roasting to wine tasting. It's probably a mistake
and a big oversell, but I see so many commonalities! I have really enjoyed
trying to educate my palate with wines. It's really fun to sip wine with
someone knowledgeable or a good sommelier and find out what flavors they are
tasting in the wine and see if I can find those flavors. Great fun - been
doing it for years.
Coffee roasting and tasting seems very similar to me with some great
exceptions:
1. I'm mostly in control of the process of making the coffee (choosing
beans, roast level, preparation method etc.)
2. From beginning to end the process is much quicker than winemaking/tasting
and feedback comes in days not years.
3. It seems that the flavor profiles for coffee are nearly as wide as for
wine
4. But, best of all - nobody looks at me strangely for drinking coffee at 6
in the morning! ;-)
Mac
On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 6:44 AM, Steven Van Dyke  wrote:
<Snip>
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6) From: John Letoto
I've found I'm cyclical with how I interact with "regular" coffee
drinkers.  Sometimes, I'm more than happy to sit and talk to people,
letting them know what's present in the cup, yet cautioning them by
letting them know they may not taste any of that beyond one generic
flavor: coffee.  I've found that walking them through the tasting
process by telling them how to sip and systematically pay attention,
and not just letting them sip on their own, helps a great deal.  At
other times, I feel way too tired to even offer a cup to someone I'm
not certain will appreciate it...I mean, when you've only got a half
pound left of your current stash of IMV, you're far less likely to be
free with it, right? ;)
The vast majority of those I offer coffee to are very appreciative,
though, so I really can't claim to be frustrated by my general
coffee-sharing experience.  Over the course of a year and a half, one
of my coworkers has gone from adding packets of instant hot chocolate
to telling me the subtle differences he detects in cup character as
it's cooling.  Aaaahh, if only they were all such rewarding converts!
-toto
On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 7:41 AM, james McDougal  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
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7) From: Tom Ulmer
As with most hobbies there is a typically intense interest in the subject
matter. The motivation for its pursuit is another consideration. Outside of
this list I've yet to find anyone who shares the passion of roasting. There
are many who will share and praise the results.

8) From: Jim and Tina Wheeler
Some of our friends share an interest in a good cup of coffee, but few share
an interest in roasting coffee.  Nearly all will happily share in the fruits
of home roasting.  Others will merely wonder why our coffee isn't as
"strong" as the Charbucks product or one from a megamart.  The latter will
normally add a lot of cream and sugar to the cup and not really care.
We settle for telling visitors about the coffee being home roast and let the
conversation move on.  There are a lot of subjects for conversation and it
is easy to let the discussion move on to mutually shared interests.   Most
accept a pound or so of our latest home roast coffee with gratitude and
enjoy it later.
As far as I can tell, only one person in our range of acquaintances has
gotten into home roasting.  She is also a dedicated foodie who just spent
megabucks on a major kitchen remodel, including a big plasma TV so she can
watch the Food Network in the kitchen.  That is dedication.
-- 
Jim in Skull Valley
On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 8:13 AM, Tom Ulmer  wrote:
<Snip>
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9) From: Les
What I most often tell normal coffee drinkers is that I drink
"homeorast."  I have had a similar experience as Stephen Carey as I
share my coffee with others.  I have three folks that are willing to
buy coffee from me rather than roast their own.  I buy 20 pounders of
3 district regions from Tom and sell them homeroast for $12.00 a pound
including shipping.  I thought I had two converts at work, but their
rejection of homeroasting was interesting.  One co-worker said, "I
really don't want to get used to such high quality coffee because then
I won't want to drink anything else!"  The other co-worker said
basically the same thing.   I guess I understand, because I won't
drink poor coffee.  I went out to breakfast the other week and the
waitress looked at me funny when I said, "No thanks." to the coffee.
I am going to start a new thread, "How did you get into homeroasting?"
 It should be interesting.
Les
On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Jim and Tina Wheeler
 wrote:
<Snip>
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10) From: Benjamin VerHage
My stash was getting a little out of control so I roasted a lot of coffee a=
t xmas for different people around the office. It was interesting to see wh=
o came to me blown away by how good it was compared to what they usually dr=
ink. Then there are the people like one guy who brought the beans back to m=
e a month later and asked me to grind them for him. I think he missed the p=
oint. I do get a warm fuzzy feeling inside when someone tries my beans and =
I know that I've flipped a switch in their brain and ruined bad coffee for =
them.
Ben
From: Les 
To: homeroast
Sent: Thursday, February 5, 2009 8:02:08 AM
Subject: Re: [Homeroast] What do you say to normal coffee drinkers?
What I most often tell normal coffee drinkers is that I drink
"homeorast."  I have had a similar experience as Stephen Carey as I
share my coffee with others.  I have three folks that are willing to
buy coffee from me rather than roast their own.  I buy 20 pounders of
3 district regions from Tom and sell them homeroast for $12.00 a pound
including shipping.  I thought I had two converts at work, but their
rejection of homeroasting was interesting.  One co-worker said, "I
really don't want to get used to such high quality coffee because then
I won't want to drink anything else!"  The other co-worker said
basically the same thing.  I guess I understand, because I won't
drink poor coffee.  I went out to breakfast the other week and the
waitress looked at me funny when I said, "No thanks." to the coffee.
I am going to start a new thread, "How did you get into homeroasting?"
It should be interesting.
Les
On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Jim and Tina Wheeler
 wrote:
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      =
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11) From: Douglas Hoople
I let them come to me. I serve coffee in my home like it's nothing
special. If a friend drinks a cup of my coffee and think it's good enough to
comment and ask about it, I'll 'fess up. The conversation leads naturally
from there.
I've found that people edge away sideways if I volunteer information about
my obsession unsolicited.
It does seem to be true that people drinking light-roasted Africans for the
first time are puzzled that it's even coffee that they're drinking. So I
usually limit initiates to things like FC+ or Vienna-roast
Sumatra/Sulawesi/Timor. Those are very safe bets, and the darker roasts are
appropriate for those coffees.
Doug
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12) From: Ed Needham
"What do you say to normal coffee drinkers?"
So sorry.
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13) From: Joseph Robertson
Try something abnormal for a change....
On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 6:53 PM, Ed Needham  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Ambassador for Specialty Coffee and palate reform.
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14) From: Bob Hazen
So how would we go about characterizing >normal< coffee drinkers? 
Particularly this bunch of listees?
Bob

15) From: Joseph Robertson
Well lets start with this...one this is for sure, there is nothing
"normal" about this bunch of listees.
Coffee or not...
<];^)
Joe
On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 7:30 PM, Bob Hazen  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Ambassador for Specialty Coffee and palate reform.
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16) From: miKe mcKoffee
YB or AB Normal? And/or as I like to say: "Sanity is highly over rated".
:-)
miKe 
<Snip>
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17) From: jeff michel
I kNoW wHaT yOu MeAn miKe
jeF
On Feb 12, 2009, at 10:40 AM, miKe mcKoffee wrote:
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18) From: Joseph Robertson
here here.....
I'll toast to that.
JoeR
On Thu, Feb 12, 2009 at 10:40 AM, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
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19) From: Bob Glasscock
If only I were normal...Bob Glasscock

20) From: MikeG
I haven't followed this thread so forgive me if this is redundant, but
what I say is "let me roast you up some coffee"
My 2nd convert is coming over tomorrow.  He came to my home to weld up
a bike rack for me and I roasted him some Yemen Mattari in the Behmor
while he packed his gear back to the truck.
He remarked that his Wife only used "gourmet quality beans" from the
local grocery store bulk bins.
He was fascinated as he watched me finish the roast in the Behmor,
then called a couple of days later saying his wife was raving about
the coffee and asking if he could come over again to learn more.
That will make convert #2 to purchase a Behmor.  I hope he will take
my advice to place himself in Tom and Marias capable hands for all his
online purchases.
On Thu, Feb 12, 2009 at 11:54 AM, jeff michel  wrote:
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21) From: g paris
good questions!!
I have had three converts in the last two weeks.
I gave some fresh roasted Bonko Black Sun to a neighbor who uses a French
Press.
She called the next morning and said WOW; she has never had such a wonderful
cup of coffee.
She in turn treated her friends who now want fresh roasted.
For me having some one taste the coffee is the best way to have them
discover how great it is.
As for bread machines laying dormant, people do not want to even take the
time for that or they use the ready
mixes which are horrid!!
ginny
On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 12:22 AM, R Nepsund  wrote:
<Snip>
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22) From: golfermd01
Great response, Ginny. I roast for a close friend who just loves the coffees. She has been an invaluable source of feedback and suggestions. Needless to say, I would never let her pay for any of the coffees. Although, she keeps tell me that she feels she ought to pay me something for the coffee. Nah, I couldn't accept any money from her. 
Dan 
good questions!! 
I have had three converts in the last two weeks. 
I gave some fresh roasted Bonko Black Sun to a neighbor who uses a French 
Press. 
She called the next morning and said WOW; she has never had such a wonderful 
cup of coffee. 
She in turn treated her friends who now want fresh roasted. 
For me having some one taste the coffee is the best way to have them 
discover how great it is. 
As for bread machines laying dormant, people do not want to even take the 
time for that or they use the ready 
mixes which are horrid!! 
ginny
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