HomeRoast Digest


Topic: documentation to support the fact that coffee goes (9 msgs / 296 lines)
1) From: Lynne
Was wondering if anyone has any documentation to support the fact that
coffee goes stale.
Of course, I share the knowledge just what everyone on this list just knows
from tasting - but I've been staying with my daughter and her boyfriend, and
I got some strange looks because I actually clean (TRY to clean - ugh, it's
close to impossible w/this Mr. Coffee whirly blade, which seems to be the
worst grinder on the face of the earth - and all I own at home is a whirly
grinder!!!) the grinder.
Not that it'll make any difference in how they prepare coffee, but I'd like
to show her something 'official'. I thought maybe it's due to the coffee
oils - but since they can't tell the difference (they also think I'm going
to get bad stomach ailments because I drink much stronger coffee, and they
think there is no difference what the stale, burnt stuff they currently buy
at Trader Joe's - and, gasp, my homeroast).
(My daughter used to enjoy my homeroast when she lived at home so much - but
I think she adjusted her taste buds for her boyfriend... which is fine,
actually... as there are more important things in life).
He's in higher education, she's going to be graduating soon - major is
Biological Anthropology - so anything with a scientific slant would be
helpful.
As for me - I taste - that's all I need!
Lynne
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

2) From: Stuart Frankel
Lynne wrote:
<Snip>
Hmmm - you got strange looks from a soon-to-be biological
anthropologist when you went to clean coffee apparatus.
There are two approaches to this, which are compatible with
each other. The anthropological approach should discourage
strange looks when presented with poorly understood
lifeways, even lifeways as strange as those of your parents.
The idea that all cultures, even those of preceding
generations, have something to teach or, at least, their own
integrity is not a bad way to look at things.
The biological approach is simpler. Your daughter is
probably familiar with the process of oxidation which, among
other things, makes oils go rancid. Rancid oils (as I hope
you didn't indicate by example, but my mother did once, by
accident), even in the smallest quantities, pretty small
spoil everything they touch.
This doesn't count as documentation, of course.
regards,
 Stuart
-- 
i still have a very small websitehttp://dustyfeet.comHomeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

3) From: MikeG
I'd fuggedabowdit Lynne.
They are both educated folks capable of making a decision according to
their values, even if it isn't a well informed one.  Enjoy their
company and drop the coffee thing would be my advice.
On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lynne  wrote:
<Snip>
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

4) From: Stephen Carey
Hi, Lynne,
I would MikeG on this one.  Even the best roasted and brewed coffee 
can be ruined by the company we share with which we share it.  And 
the mediocre canned coffee can become a wonderful experience if are 
sharing it with our loved ones, with good conversation, that person 
we know will be our partner one day, or that person who is our 
partner for yet another morning.
Stephen
At 12:14 PM 2/16/2009, you wrote:
<Snip>
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

5) From: Scott Miller
I have a number of regular customers who buy my coffee "for the
weekend"; they drink convenience store swill or brew canned coffee
during the week. I suppose I could understand the economic aspect of
drinking more expensive coffee less frequently, however some of these
folks can certainly afford whatever they want.
How folks come to their buying & consumption decisions is a puzzler sometimes.
cheers,
Scott
On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 12:14 PM, MikeG  wrote:
<Snip>
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

6) From: Dave Huddle
Lynne,
I searched a _VERY LARGE_ chemical information database "the global
leader in chemical information" for the terms 'coffee' and 'staleness'
and found 9 documents dating from 1930 to 2001.    I'm sure if I'd
made a broader search I'd find more research on the concept.   So, yes
- there is documentation to support the fact that coffee goes stale.
I went back and searched 'coffee' and 'stale?- and found 21 references.
Searching 'coffee' and 'preserve?' gave 126 references.
Dave
Westerville, OH
---On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 11:51 AM, Lynne  wrote:
Was wondering if anyone has any documentation to support the fact that
coffee goes stale.---
--
On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 11:51 AM, Lynne  wrote:
<Snip>
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

7) From: David Martin
I think you're barking up the wrong tree, somewhat.
You're trying to make the case that they should clean their grinder,
because of these assertions:
1. Coffee contains oils
2. Oils go rancid
3. Rancid oils taste bad
4. Therefore, regularly cleaning one's grinder will result in
better-tasting coffee.
You can prove #1 and #2 objectively with scientifically valid
documentation. In particular, for #2 the relevant documentation would
describe the types of oils found in coffee and the rate at which those
oils go rancid.
However, it seems their real problem is with #3 and #4, which for all
practical purposes are subjective. Perhaps it's possible that some
people really can't taste the difference. A better way to settle the
question would be for both you and them to take a blind taste test,
comparing coffee brewed with clean and dirty equipment. Or you could
just come to terms with the fact that they are coffee philistines, try
to overlook this personality flaw, and move on. :-)
-Dave
On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 8:51 AM, Lynne  wrote:
<Snip>
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

8) From: Bill
"Personality flaw"!!!  Her daughter and son-in-law.  I love it, Dave!
That's the perfect answer to the other thread about what to do about
 coffee drinkers.
Don't worry, they just have a personality flaw!!!
I'll be chuckling all night about that...
bill
btw I think that you email broke down the dilemma well, but it was the last
line that got me laughing.
On Tue, Feb 17, 2009 at 7:45 PM, David Martin wrote:
<Snip>
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20

9) From: Lynne
Thanks, everyone, for your terrific replies!
We arrived back home late Mon. (the third dog I couldn't bring, my biggest
sweetie, was almost despondent according to my sons - never left him home
before - but recovered the minute we entered through the door!) and I didn't
realize how much a toll the trip took on me. My pain level and fatigue is
worse than ever - but oh, it was *so* worth my visit!!
I don't intend to 'convert' my daughter and her bf. She does love to argue,
in a very good natured way - so I hope to borrow your thoughts for a bit of
supporting argument.
(going to write everyone in one email, to minimize my typing a bit... but as
usual, I'm so wordy, I'll prob. end up typing more... haha)
Stuart: I loved your analysis! I DEF. going to use this, maybe sending it to
her in an email or via FB. Love it!
MikeG: just going to have some fun w/my kid. I certainly did enjoy my time
with them - they were both so very generous w/me - but I now know that my
gifts of homeroasted coffee isn't the best for them, so I need to figure out
something different to give them.
Dean: perfect!! Just what I was looking for. For people like me - which
means, this entire list, of course - something like this is just plain
redundant. I mean, one sip of stale coffee and - blech!!
Dave: what is the database that you are referring to? (did a google search,
came up w/CAS, but didn't get any results w/a search)
Ray: very wise words indeed. One would think the logic would be obvious,
right? But they don't go to McDonald's, or any other fast food restaurant -
they actually eat a very healthy and varied diet (they had a good selection
of really delicious cheeses when I was there, and both took turns making me
some great meals - very tasty, and different from what I usually have, so it
seemed even more of a vacation!). My daughter has inherited my love of
desserts, but she's wise, and keeps it in tow.
They both are pizza connoisseurs, as I am - New Haven is a runner up to NY
as the capital of near-perfect pizza. I was amazed that he was able to tell
subtle differences w/the pizzas we ate!!
I had so much fun....
David:
<Snip>
hahahahaha! yes - I realize that. Believe me, they are both sweethearts -
and so generous, so this is nothing.  I feel very lucky that the two of them
are together (love him like a son, too). Just want to have some fun w/my
daughter, though... ;D
Bill: he had me laughing, too!
The other thing is they both expressed concern about the condition of my
stomach because I drink coffee that's much, much stronger than what they
drink. I couldn't get it across to them that drinking stale coffee is much
worse, and that I don't experience any of the acidity in my homeroast.
My daughter used to go nuts over my homeroast when she lived home. But he
can't tell the difference - they are avid wine drinkers, but he admits that
he can't tell the difference w/wine, either. Interesting...
I'll have fun w/all of this, but as I said, I don't intend to convert. If I
do make a return trip, I will, however, make sure I bring my own coffee
equipment. Good to do this w/any trip... boy, I missed my French Press and
Chemex!
Just an OT side note: First morning we were back, my daughter (she's in her
last semester at UMass Boston, so she's staying here during the week to save
some commuting $$) wanted to make her morning coffee, but didn't know how to
use the Chemex.
She woke up Shiloh, my oldest dog (who couldn't partake in the traveling fun
- their cat would have really freaked at three dogs, one being nearly 80
lbs!), and asked him if he wanted to go outside. She figured it would be
better if he woke me, instead of her - so she told him to "go wake up mom so
she'll take you out..." (obviously, he wouldn't do it if she told him to
wake me in order for me to show her how to make the coffee... duh!)
Of course, he walked into my room, and came over, wagging his whole body,
and kissed me, ever so persistent until I did wake up... man, that dog is
smart!
:D
Lynne
(who had a wonderful time, but is glad to be home)
Homeroast mailing list
Homeroasthttp://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20">http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/listinfo.cgi/homeroast-sweetmariascoffee.comHomeroast community pictures -upload yours!) :http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemIdx20


HomeRoast Digest