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Topic: Ethiopian Koratie (19 msgs / 635 lines)
1) From: Coffee Willard
Roasted the last of this today and of course it was the best. It tasted just
like strawberry jam. I gave some to my taste-tester daughters and that was
their unanimous comment. I've been homeroasting now for almost a year, and
I'm finally able to consistantly (almost) get great roasts. As time goes by
I can anticipate better what is going on, so the roasts don't get away from
me so much. Also, I've saved beans from previous roasts at different stages
- City, Full City, Vienna, etc. This helps to judge the color. I find that
I'm tempted to always go a bit darker than I want.
Thanks for all the help from all of you.
Randy
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2) From: Douglas Hoople
That's great, Randy! I just finished posting on the topic myself. Once
you've got a taste of how good it can be, you're hooked. Even if a roast
slips, you keep on reaching for the perfect cup.
The great thing about hitting a consistent patch is that you can have one
world-class cup of coffee after another, and that's sheer heaven.
I probably don't have to tell you, do I!
Doug
On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 4:00 PM, Coffee Willard wrote:
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3) From: silascoelho
Randy
I'm also saving my old roaster beans for future reference, and is even more 
coincidental that I'm also just one year in home roasting, and nowadays able 
to reproduce the beans color/coffe taste with more precision.
Seems that 1 year is where everything became funny
Regards
Silas

4) From: Ed Needham
I wish I was that good.  After 31 years of roasting, I still find my 
roasting skills lacking.  The longer I roast, the more I realize I don't 
know.
*********************
Ed Needham
"to absurdity and beyond!"http://www.homeroaster.com*********************

5) From: Ed Needham
Saving beans for reference might not be that beneficial.  As beans stale, 
the oils seep through the woody cellular matrix and darken the color of the 
beans.  The same roast will look different after two or more weeks.  Oil 
will come to the surface and it will look like a darker roast than it 
actually is.
*********************
Ed Needham
"to absurdity and beyond!"http://www.homeroaster.com*********************

6) From: raymanowen
But saving pictures of the roasted beans, Against some standard color
reference- Click!
Cheers, -ro
-- 
"When the theme hits the bass, I dance the Jig!" - -Virgil Fox at the Mighty
Wichita (ex- NYC Paramount) WurliTzer- 1976
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7) From: Ed Needham
I don't roast to color.  There are a few things I look for to clue me in to 
whether a roast has hit it's sweet spot, but color is not one of them. 
Since I roast in batches that are somewhat larger than the typical 
homeroaster, I use a small 3 oz Hearthware Precision to do sample roasts and 
cuppings of the roast at various roast levels.  To gauge these levels, I use 
overall time, time in relation to second crack, smell, and the appearance of 
the color of the chaff in the crack of the bean.  The color of the same bean 
type works fairly well, but color from bean type to bean type won't give you 
much predictability of the level of roast.
A high grown, dense bean will roast way differently than a low grown, less 
dense bean.  The color may also vary significantly when the beans are at the 
same roast level.
People ask me, "Ohhhh I like a dark roast.  Is yours a dark roast?"  I say, 
I don't roast to color, I roast to flavor.  The big coffee marketers like 
Starbucks roast so the beans look pretty in the bag.  But when they are at 
their big, pretty, shiny best, they taste like crap.
A color reference might be helpful for some, but even with a sophisticated 
Agtron automated color matching system, the results will only give 
consistency from roast to roast using the same coffee type.
*********************
Ed Needham
"to absurdity and beyond!"http://www.homeroaster.com*********************

8) From: Bob Hazen
Oh boy did I prove that for myself.  I sorta feel like I don't know 
 >anything< at all!  And I've got 25+ more years to go to learn enough to not 
know as much as you don't know; or something like that....
I was humbled tonight.  At least I didn't set off the smoke alarms.  But, I 
proved that a Behmor will go into 2nd, alright >well< into 2nd, French in 
fact.  The beans aren't charcoal, per se, but they are dark.  Probably 
should be called Kingsford Roast.  Although I was tempted to dump the beans, 
I will force myself to try this batch in the morning.  Certainly it will be 
another data point.
This thread is timely as it was DP Koratie that suffered the indignity at my 
hands.  I usually roast with P2 and adjust the time to drop power anywhere 
between zero and 20 seconds before 1st would hit on P1.  This time, I 
thought I'd try P3.  No real reason, just experimenting.
I don't think I ever heard the beginning of 1st.  I heard some clicking but 
thought it was the Behmor relays.  Then (I thought) I heard 1st start with a 
vengeance.  OK I thought, it >was< the relays before...  Then the beans and 
I proceeded to blast right through first and ran screaming into 2nd.  Gobs 
of smoke!  The beans are ticked.  Phooey.  My pals were smoking 2 minutes 
after I hit cool.  I opened the door a crack at about 3 min into cool and a 
cloud of smoke poured out and little bits of ash.  I definitely uttered some 
of Ray's German cuss words.
Not my best performance.  Here's hoping that "regression to the mean" holds 
here.
Bob

9) From: MikeG
Ed if one takes beans just to the earliest snap or two of 2C but the
chaff in the cleft is very light in color - what does that indicate?
I "achieved" this with some Hue Hue something or other today (cleaning
up some old, unloved vac sealed beans) using Behmor's most agressive
P1 profile.
I do wish SM's bag labels would indicate 'high' or 'moderate' or 'low'
elevation on their bag lables for each blend.
Tom, you listnin? :-)
Mike
On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 11:35 PM, Ed Needham  wrote:
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10) From: james McDougal
Mike,
It would be nice if Tom put the elevation grown on the beans, but if I
understand correctly is the density of the bean (affected by elevation) that
is important.
I measure the density of all the beans before I roast and usually use a
Behmor profile that is recommended. I'm assuming that Joe Behm in
consultation with professional roasters suggested appropriate profiles for
hard bean (P1 & P2) and soft, low grown bean (P3 & P4).
DP Koratie is the densest bean I have measured (88 g/100 ml), Huehue is
moderate (82.7 g/100ml) and Mokha Mattari is among the lighest (76.7). You
can see the full list herehttp://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pW9AmAE95FFf1FgiuOGBvGQIn a confusing world - my dog and I both like rules! This measurement gives
me a starting place, but I confess I don't always follow it!
Mac
On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 2:44 AM, MikeG  wrote:
<Snip>
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11) From: Brent Burkhart
Gentleman,
I have a question, is there a problem if you finish your roast in a bemohr,
the roast did not turn as well as expected so you re roast it to make it
darker?  I have done that not noticing any harm but assumed it certainly was
not the way to go.  Has anyone else basically roasted same beans twice?
Brent

12) From: Mark Lizotte
Wow Mac...
That's pretty cool. Never really thought about how density could affect the=
 roast. Seems that the more dense the bean is the more heat needed to move =
the bean through the roast cycle...right?
I am learning so much as I read what everyone has to say.
I'm a pretty new home roaster. My Behmor should be arriving today with 15 p=
ounds of coffee...can't wait
I look forward to learning and gleaning for you "old timer" roasters.
Thanks,
Mark
From: james McDougal 
To: homeroast
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 10:34:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Ethiopian Koratie
Mike,
It would be nice if Tom put the elevation grown on the beans, but if I
understand correctly is the density of the bean (affected by elevation) that
is important.
I measure the density of all the beans before I roast and usually use a
Behmor profile that is recommended. I'm assuming that Joe Behm in
consultation with professional roasters suggested appropriate profiles for
hard bean (P1 & P2) and soft, low grown bean (P3 & P4).
DP Koratie is the densest bean I have measured (88 g/100 ml), Huehue is
moderate (82.7 g/100ml) and Mokha Mattari is among the lighest (76.7). You
can see the full list herehttp://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pW9AmAE95FFf1FgiuOGBvGQIn a confusing world - my dog and I both like rules! This measurement gives
me a starting place, but I confess I don't always follow it!
Mac
On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 2:44 AM, MikeG  wrote:
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Homeroast mailing list
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      =
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13) From: MikeG
Thanks for sharing your data James.  I've bookmarked your list.
On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 11:34 AM, james McDougal  w=
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14) From: John Mac
Sure have!
If you can't drink it as roasted, you've got nothing to lose!
I've stopped a roast too soon and the cup was vile, back in the Behmor it
went and the re-roast was far more palatable.
I've also hit the cool button instead of the light by mistake and those
beans got a second go round in the B1600.
What do you have to lose?
Cheers,
John in Nor Cal
On 3/25/09, Brent Burkhart  wrote:
<Snip>
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15) From: Dino De Crisce
I've done it once in the behmor without any problem at all.
Dino De Crisce
Sent from a Treo phone

16) From: james McDougal
Hi Mark,
Your comment "Seems that the more dense the bean is the more heat needed to
move the bean through the roast cycle...right?" makes sense, but perhaps
someone who knows for sure will pitch in!
Mac
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17) From: John A C Despres
Indeed this is true. The more dense a bean is, the more heat you need to
apply at the early stage of the roast dropping to a more moderate heat
during the middle and last stages of the roast.
Higher grown beans tend to be more dense as they grow a little slower at
higher, cooler altitudes. Consider anything above about 3500 to 4000 feet
high grown and more dense.
Another clue is look at the grade on Tom's note sheets. It may say SHG
(Strictly high grown) or SHB (strictly hard bean). These will definitely be
dense beans.
You can also do your own density studies of the beans in your own stash.
with a good scale at hand and perhaps a quart canning jar, fill the jar with
your beans to the top, leveling it off even with the lip of the jar and
weigh the whole thing, then weigh the jar & do the math. Repeat for every
bean you have and record your information. The heavier quart batches are
more dense. Now this is not infallible and your density is only relative to
the previous or next weight. It's a help, though.
I hope this is helpful.
John
On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 7:26 AM, james McDougal wrote:
<Snip>
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18) From: Mark Lizotte
Thanks a lot.
This is very interesting.
I am learning so much from everyone.
I am forever ruined by my coffee addiction!
Mark
From: John A C Despres 
To: homeroast
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 7:03:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Ethiopian Koratie
Indeed this is true. The more dense a bean is, the more heat you need to
apply at the early stage of the roast dropping to a more moderate heat
during the middle and last stages of the roast.
Higher grown beans tend to be more dense as they grow a little slower at
higher, cooler altitudes. Consider anything above about 3500 to 4000 feet
high grown and more dense.
Another clue is look at the grade on Tom's note sheets. It may say SHG
(Strictly high grown) or SHB (strictly hard bean). These will definitely be
dense beans.
You can also do your own density studies of the beans in your own stash.
with a good scale at hand and perhaps a quart canning jar, fill the jar with
your beans to the top, leveling it off even with the lip of the jar and
weigh the whole thing, then weigh the jar & do the math. Repeat for every
bean you have and record your information. The heavier quart batches are
more dense. Now this is not infallible and your density is only relative to
the previous or next weight. It's a help, though.
I hope this is helpful.
John
On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 7:26 AM, james McDougal wrote:
<Snip>
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19) From: Barry Luterman
Not ruined.Expanded
On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 7:14 AM, Mark Lizotte  wrote:
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