HomeRoast Digest


Topic: New York Times article on adding water to (17 msgs / 600 lines)
1) From: Bob Hazen
<Snip>
Oh Noooooo.......  Ice?  Gack!
Neat; maybe with a little bit of water....  but 50:50??  Now I admit, I 
haven't ever tried it 50:50.  I will strive to be open minded and give it a 
go.  Nothing ventured, nothing gained.  But ice?  Not for me!
Bob
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2) From: Joseph Robertson
Bob,
Yes, I believed in my post I mentioned that it was already covered. I try to
cover my cybertracks between my coffee's and SBOI drinks.
;^))
On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 10:23 PM, Bob Hazen  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Ambassador for Specialty Coffee and palate reform.
Homeroast mailing list
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3) From: Brian Kamnetz
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4) From: Yakster
My formula is 28 g coffee + 450 ml water for a full CCD which yields two 200
ml cups.  I've also made single cups at 14 g coffee and 225 ml water for a
single 200 ml cup.  In either case, I use two timers, the first set for 30
seconds to take care of the bloom using about 50 ml of water and the second
set for five minutes for the extraction.  Both these methods have resulted
in cups within the desired TDS and % extraction: 1.2-1.45% TDS and 18-22%
extraction.
I use the same timers for Chemex and have good luck making 600 ml (half pot)
in the Chemex using these same timings and grind as for the CCD.  I use 42 g
coffee and 675 ml water for a 600 ml pot.  This theoretically yields three
200 ml cups, but in practice fills up my Wife's travel mug with about 200 ml
and mine with about 400 ml for the commute to work in the morning.  I really
enjoy the Chemex and it's increasing my coffee consumption in the morning
which makes up for the fact that I don't drink coffee until I have a chance
to make it again either at work in the afternoon or when I get home.
Where this is all falling apart on me is for the full Chemex pot.  I've
tried grinding much coarser using 1350 ml of water and 84 g coffee to yield
1200 ml of brewed coffee, but it just won't drain in five minutes... it's
taking about nine minutes to pour the water through for this size batch
which worries me even though it is tasting good.  The TDS and % Extraction
were also on the high side, 1.53 % and 22.11 % respectively.  Any tips for
making full Chemex pots?  I don't get much of a chance to experiment since I
need company to use this volume of coffee.
Maybe I should take a tip from this NYT article and just add water... do the
bypass brewing trick and use less water for the Chemex extraction, whatever
volume will drain in five minutes with 84 g coffee and make up for the
volume by adding in hot water to the concentrated brew after the fact.  Does
this make sense?
-Chris
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Brian Kamnetz  wrote:
<Snip>
Homeroast mailing list
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5) From: Brian Kamnetz
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6) From: Brian Kamnetz
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7) From: Dave
I've been traveling this week, and using my CCD for my hotel room-coffee.
The best I've been able to do is to use a water glass to estimate the amount
of pre-ground homeroast grounds, then use TLAR (That Looks About Right) for
the water. What I've been drinking has been WAY BETTER, than anything else
available!
Dave
Some days...
It's just not worth chewing through the leather straps
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 2:30 PM, Brian Kamnetz  wrote:
<Snip>
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8) From: Yakster
I made a little travel kit out of a case I picked up at a thrift store
designed to carry Wii game remotes for my coffee tools.http://www.ezgear.com/Wii/Wii_ezTote.html. I had to cut down the top handle
of the AeroPress stirring tool to make it fit but it holds that plus
AeroPress filters, a mini-whisk, coffee scoops, etc to make a light travel
kit.  I also bring a hand grinder an AeroPress or CCD.  I estimate that a
regular coffee scoop is 7 g and the AeroPress coffee scoop (which I use to
measure at home) is 14 g.  That's why most of my measurements for ground
coffee are in multiples of 7 and 14 g.  Since the regular scoop fits better
for traveling I use that now.
Thanks for the conversions to fluid ounces... I've weaned myself off of
using ounces for measurements now and just use grams and ml to make things
easier.  The hardest part for me was thinking of green coffee inventory in
kg instead of pounds, and it's still a work in progress, but I've got about
20 kilos of greens in inventory now (very roughly 45 pounds).
The measurement for water for two cups (450 ml) is just below the top of the
filters I'm using after dialing it in and measuring it, I just eyeball it
now.  I find it much more difficult to estimate 225 ml for a single cup,
though, because of the tapered sides of the CCD, so I'll usually measure
this if I'm really going to do a single cup.  I'm really loving the CCD and
have one at work... I was using both of them for side-by-side for comparing
different things like aerating coffee.
-Chris
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9) From: miKe mcKoffee
Nothing inherently wrong with a goal of "satisfactory" coffee. Most
definitely preferable to "unsatisfactory" coffee.
OTOH some choose goals of excellence which includes exploring boudaries and
variations.
Slave to the Bean  miKe mcKoffee
www.NorwestCoffee.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/
<Snip>
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10) From: Joseph Robertson
According to RayO's story the ship went to the bottom because the captain
took the ship to the bottom because he was content with "satisfactory
coffee" or piloting the ship business as usual and making sure the paint on
his ships hull didn't get a scratch on it. Or in my case kept the paint on
the front door fresh but didn't care to do much with the business inside. In
my case I have found that if I let my new staff stay content with
"satisfactory coffee" the shop down the street will draw more and more of my
clientele and soon my business sails will falter. If I am drinking coffee or
desperate for my am cup I will suffer through "satisfactory" coffee but as a
purveyor of the Black Gold I will always seek out and drive my family and
friends to a shop like yours miKe before I will suggest the run of the mill
cup at "joes" place down the street. We have all been there.
RayO ? got any more books?
Joe
On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 7:18 AM, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>
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11) From: John A C Despres
I don't see that in Ray's post at all, Joe... Ray's never been an advocate
of mediocrity that I recall.  Captain Smith took the mostly untried Titanic
out and lost the gamble trying something new. Lessons were learned and
passenger ships improved. None since has sunk since scratching the paint on
an iceberg.
Try something new and if it doesn't meet satisfaction, try something new
again.
Don't give up trying.
Great story, Ray.
John
On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Joseph Robertson wrote:
<Snip>
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12) From: Joseph Robertson
John,
Sorry if you misunderstood my post or extreamly sorry if RayO did.
First I was not replying to RayO's post.
Second I am and always will be on the same page as RayO's when it comes to
"mediocrity" or in our case coffee quality.
Third and maybe most important I was replying to miKe's comment not RayO's
comment.
I was riding on the topic and using what I understood RayO to be saying in
regards to
The Captain paying attention and taking advice from a junior seaman in this
case a book RayO used as an example called "Management for Dummies". I was
serious in this regard. If you or RayO have a book I have not read on, in
this case coffee or the coffee world please tell me your favorites.
Now as we know John these threads can get convoluted in left field from the
original topic but I find it very fun to follow any thread that RayO posts
to.
Not only do I find it fun but a challenge to interpret and respond to
correctly.
When I post from gmail I hit reply nest to the person that I want to
following in line with and my post is more a reply to that person with all
the above posts as conversation leading up to my post.
Ohhh, so many ways to be misunderstood here on this way of conversing verus
face to face.
In fact I'm wondering at this point if you understand what I have just said
here. I hope RayO and mike do because I know we are mostly on the same page
when it comes to mediocrity and coffee quality.
I am aware that scratching the paint doesn't usually sink a ship unless it
is an ice berg you scratch it with. My point with that part John was that if
the captain was more concerned with something more than scratching the paint
he might come up with more than "satisfactory'" coffee or improve his craft
of seamanship.
I'm all for making mistakes if we do something with the information it can
provide us. What is that old story about Benjamin making 700 mistakes before
we got a light bulb that would work.
Well I'm still pulling shots and roasting to come close to the shots I get
from miKe's M. shop.
Much to learn here as a Padawan coffee guy.
Very sorry if I misread or confused anyone here John especially veteran
Lister's like you.
Sincerely,
Joseph
On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 7:52 AM, John A C Despres wrote:
<Snip>
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13) From: Andy Thomas
From: Joseph Robertson theotherjo
"...if I let my new staff stay content with "satisfactory coffee" the shop =
down =
the street will draw more and more of my clientele..."
If you define "satisfactory" as mediocre, yes. To me it means something t=
hat =
satisfies, meets my needs and expectations. Mediocrity is not satisfactory =
to me =
nor, I'd bet, to many people on this list, at least not as applied to coffe=
e.
      =
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14) From: Andy Thomas
Sorry all, I see this has already been addressed.
From: Andy Thomas 
To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this list, =
available athttp://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"=
Sent: Sat, August 7, 2010 2:17:25 PM
Subject: Re: [Homeroast] New York Times article on adding water to wineandc=
offee
From: Joseph Robertson theotherjo
"...if I let my new staff stay content with "satisfactory coffee" the shop =
down =
the street will draw more and more of my clientele..."
If you define "satisfactory" as mediocre, yes. To me it means something t=
hat =
satisfies, meets my needs and expectations. Mediocrity is not satisfactory =
to me =
nor, I'd bet, to many people on this list, at least not as applied to coffe=
e.
      =
Homeroast mailing list
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15) From: Joseph Robertson
Andy,
Thanks for your clarification.
Joe
On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 2:17 PM, Andy Thomas  wrote:
<Snip>
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16) From: raymanowen
One more thing-
<..."satisfactory" coffee. Most definitely preferable to "unsatisfactory"
coffee.>
["satisfactory" as in For Four Bucks It'll Do? or "satisfactory," I'll pay
for it?]
If coffee were served and paid On Approval, with the stipulation that any
cup be rejected or approved with a completed rating survey- one per evening.
That Cup or Shot is refunded when you turn in the survey at the end of the
visit if the comments are specific, whether negative or positive.
The inevitable habitual whiners have to correctly assess the Dreck cup
faults to get the free cup or shot. Consider hiring the ones that are
consistently correct.
My point with Titanic was that even the state-of-the-art ship of the day
with the most thoroughly vetted, experienced and respected Captain [not] at
the wheel, was doomed by a series of events. Captain Smith's credentials
were such that he should have seen things accumulating against his ship.
Foresight on just one of the problems might have broken the cascade and
prevented the disaster, although the missing binoculars for the Crow's Nest
might not have helped in the available darkness. Imagine the radio operators
of the most powerful receiver and transmitter afloat favoring commercial
traffic over weather and iceberg warnings?
Smith let his crew do things that cascaded the disaster, and was asleep
during passage through a known ice field. They diverted south, but not quite
far enough so they wouldn't lose record time getting to New York.
E.J. is on my "No Sail List" because of his misteaks. Misteaks contribute to
the mathematical variation that W. Edwards Deming taught Japanese
manufacturers to use to rein in quality control issues after UUW2.
The Japanese, starting from nearly Zero, listened and learned. Big American
[auto] manufacturers wouldn't give him the time of day. It shouldn't have,
but our stuff went pretty flaky. It's pretty hard to learn when You Already
Know.
American women, who might not have known anything about manufacturing,
acquitted themselves pretty well building the Rolls-Royce super charged V-12
Merlin engines for P51 Mustang aircraft. The Meteor was the same engine for
tanks, without the blowers.
When you have a dog in the race, things begin to happen. Even the Master
Race had no chance against American women in a Packard factory in Detroit.
Cheers, Mabuhay, Lloniannau -RayO, aka Opa!
Got Grinder?
On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 8:18 AM, miKe mcKoffee  wrote:
<Snip>
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17) From: Joseph Robertson
RayO,
Another wonderful story. My father served under Patton's Third army in ww2
so I can relate to many of your references regarding technology durning the
ww2.
Thank you for your analogy's to coffee quality.
Joe
On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 10:07 PM,  wrote:
<Snip>
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