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Topic: that Nekkid bottomless Portafilter (17 msgs / 441 lines)
1) From: Rbt Tut
My appologies if this has been mentioned in the various portafilter threads
I have a very hard time following some threads as the replies fail to delete
older parts of a thread and i get Migranous
trying to find the next post.
that may be just me ...
miKe mentioned easy cleaning with the spout off, and ability to monitor
channeling
my channeling is now non-existent!
but the bottom-less also tells me early if the shot will extract in the
correct ball park of time:
keep an eye on the thickness of the stream
this works well for me on my Alexia PID!
it would work better if I could justify that Beautifull M3 Quest!
RT
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2) From: Allon Stern
Okay, I'll post a video.
I think I had a little channel causing the stream to move to the left, but not certain. It was a very tasty shot.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKIE61K6TFIanyone care to point out any flaws to my uneducated eye?
-
allon
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3) From: Greg Hollrigel
Right on Allon!  To my basic eyes, that looks great.  I guess I have some
work to do on my technique.  I get good flavors, but much more movement of
the cone and too often donuting of the stream in the first leg of the pull.
Greg
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Allon Stern  wrote:
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4) From: Allon Stern
On Sep 1, 2010, at 3:52 PM, Greg Hollrigel wrote:
<Snip>
I'm experimenting with WDT. What I did was cut the bottom off one of the paper coffee cups they have here at work, and broke the center two tines off of a plastic fork; then, after dosing, I put the paper cup over the PF basket and fluff the grinds with the two-tined fork. Then level, tamp, and pull. This has solved my donut extraction problems.
I think the WDT helps overcome issues with the grinder/doser not related to the grind, but more to the way it is dosed out.
I'm gonna try an experiment - dose into a cup, then pour the grinds from the cup into the PF basket, and see if that helps. Maybe with a shake beforehand, we'll see.....
I grind premeasured beans with a Rossi RR45, into the doser, then empty the doser into the PF basket.
-
allon
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5) From: Greg Hollrigel
Yeah, I guess I'll play with WDT a bit.
I use a Zass Mokka hand grinder (it yields very fluffy non-clumpy grinds
into the drawer).  I usually put my Aeropress Funnel in the portafilter
basket, and dump the grinds from the drawer into the funnel, and then slowly
remove the funnel.  I think there might be an overabundance of coffee in the
center of my filter based on this technique.  Sometimes I tap the full
portafilter, either vertically or horizontally, prior to tamp to see if I
can get more even distribution.  Hopefully WDT will work more.  I'll see in
a few hours.
As an aside for the group, when people pull singles versus doubles, do they
just put a single dose in a double basket, or do they use the single
basket.  Currently I'm using the single basket for the singles, but it is on
my spouted portafilter instead of the nekkid portafilter.  And ... I'm too
lazy to repeatedly swap them out.  I'm just wondering if a single dose in a
double basket is too much underdosing.
What say the experts here?
Greg
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 1:01 PM, Allon Stern  wrote:
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6) From: Mike Koenig
Allon,
Try flipping the doser handle continuously (slowly filling the PF) during
the grinding process.  I get little clumping, but even less if I thwack the
doser.
--mike
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:01 PM, Allon Stern  wrote:
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7) From: Yakster
I do singles in the single basket, but I haven't gone bottomless yet (you'll
lose the handle going bottomless on a La Peppina).
I'm thinking of a portafilter to chop for Christmas.
-Chris
(pecked out on a mobile device)
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8) From: miKe mcKoffee
Absolutely you can tell how a shot will pull by watching the cone develop,
and usually know within 10sec or less if the shot is off even if no
channeling etc.
Slave to the Bean  miKe mcKoffee
www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
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9) From: Allon Stern
On Sep 1, 2010, at 4:13 PM, Greg Hollrigel wrote:
<Snip>
I put a triple dose in the triple basket :D
And a nekkid portafiliter makes it easy to swap baskets - just push on the bottom of the basket, no prying necessary.
-
allon
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10) From: Bryan Wray
Re: the video
Coffee looked too fresh to me, but I also didn't taste it.  The extraction =
may have been a leeeetle fast, but fresh coffee is going to do that as well=
 (make an extraction "speed up" more).  When the cone moved you should have=
 stopped the shot.  I always train our baristas to "watch for the flash."  =
What I mean by that is to look out for a flash of "blonding" near the end o=
f the shot.  That flash of blonding is indeed channeling and it's the first=
 indication that parts of the puck have given all they can give to the shot=
.  I tell my baristas to stop the shot at this point.  If you are looking a=
t the bottom you can visibly see the tiger striping break apart, if you are=
 staring at it from above you'll notice the cone jump off center.  For me, =
in my experience, that's the stop point.  Again, it comes down to your 'bud=
s.  I didn't drink that shot, and I can visibly drink shots all day but tha=
t doesn't mean I know exactly what to do to make it better.  You
 said it tasted pretty good, so... yeah! lol
I'm not touching the single/double thing.  Except I will say too much headr=
oom if you dose a single into a double.  The puck will expand too far and b=
low apart too quickly.  Also I feel it's near impossible to get a solid, "j=
ust as good as a double" extraction from a single basket.  I'll let you do =
the 1+1 on how I feel about singles. =)
-bry
Bryan Wray
Compass Coffee
360.831.1480
Bryan
It is my hope that people realize that coffee is more than just a caffeine =
delivery service, it can be a culinary art- Chris Owens
--- On Wed, 9/1/10, Greg Hollrigel  wrote:
From: Greg Hollrigel 
Subject: Re: [Homeroast] that Nekkid bottomless Portafilter
To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this list,=
 available athttp://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
Date: Wednesday, September 1, 2010, 1:13 PM
Yeah, I guess I'll play with WDT a bit.
I use a Zass Mokka hand grinder (it yields very fluffy non-clumpy grinds
into the drawer).  I usually put my Aeropress Funnel in the portafilter
basket, and dump the grinds from the drawer into the funnel, and then slowly
remove the funnel.  I think there might be an overabundance of coffee in =
the
center of my filter based on this technique.  Sometimes I tap the full
portafilter, either vertically or horizontally, prior to tamp to see if I
can get more even distribution.  Hopefully WDT will work more.  I'll se=
e in
a few hours.
As an aside for the group, when people pull singles versus doubles, do they
just put a single dose in a double basket, or do they use the single
basket.  Currently I'm using the single basket for the singles, but it is=
 on
my spouted portafilter instead of the nekkid portafilter.  And ... I'm too
lazy to repeatedly swap them out.  I'm just wondering if a single dose in=
 a
double basket is too much underdosing.
What say the experts here?
Greg
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 1:01 PM, Allon Stern  wrote:
<Snip>
off
<Snip>
to
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he
<Snip>
ariascoffee.com
<Snip>
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11) From: Allon Stern
On Sep 1, 2010, at 10:26 PM, Bryan Wray wrote:
<Snip>
THANK YOU!
This is exactly what I needed. I guess I was too focused on that 30 second thing....okay, I'll look for the flash.
Extraction a little fast?! That was a triple basket, maybe 18-20g (guessing!), into 1.5oz in 30s.
The coffee is about a week or so old; lessee, I roasted it on...damn. It's written down on the bag. I think it's around a week old; I just got the machine and I haven't properly gauged how much I need to roast to keep up with my demand... 
Yes, it tasted pretty good, but it's all about improvement. I want to make the next shot better :D
Again, thanks!
-
allon
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12) From: Bryan Wray
In regards to extraction... with very little variance here is what I want t=
o observe when I'm watching an extraction
0-10 seconds:  The coffee can do whatever the hell it wants as far as I'm c=
oncerned in regards to little cones forming, etc.  Perfect beading is great=
, but it's rare in my experience and usually a sign of coffee that is a lit=
tle too old, too high of a dose (too little headroom) or too fine a grind.
11-15 seconds:  I want one(!) cone to form damn near perfectly in the cente=
r.  The cone should be at it's widest about a dime (at the top, not the str=
eam, obviously), sometimes a penny, rarely a nickel.  Shots with cones larg=
er than this are usually super dry, salty and lack dynamics in the finish (=
due to being too fresh, more often than not).
From "one cone form" to end of shot: A slow and steady increase in the rate=
 of flow until the "blonde flash" I spoke of earlier.
At no point should I see any swaying of the cone (after the one cone forms)=
 or any sprays/jets whatever you want to call them.
If measuring by volume: I'm looking for a 25(ish) second extraction, starti=
ng with approximately 17g of coffee yielding 1.5oz.  =
**All of this obviously varies by coffee, but I'd generalize this as my gol=
den rule.**
If measuring by weight (preferred) all things above would remain true, with=
 final yield falling between 18 grams and 24 grams, again depending on coff=
ee.
Bryan Wray
Compass Coffee
360.831.1480
Bryan
It is my hope that people realize that coffee is more than just a caffeine =
delivery service, it can be a culinary art- Chris Owens
--- On Wed, 9/1/10, Allon Stern  wrote:
<Snip>
t, available athttp://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>
<Snip>
ariascoffee.com
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ee.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=7820
<Snip>
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13) From: Allon Stern
On Sep 1, 2010, at 10:36 PM, Bryan Wray wrote:
<Snip>
25 seconds from when? From when you start the pump, or from when espresso first appears at the screen?
I counted 30 seconds on my shot, but I started the timer when I pressed the button.
-
allon
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14) From: miKe mcKoffee
Start of pump/shot OR more precisely start of shot after "end of
pre-infusion". With a vibe pump this means around 25 plus about 5 to 6sec
(with E-61 group and rotary around +3) from pushing button/pulling up
leverette on E-61 etc.
Hell, you can screw up a build so start of beading isn't until 30 or 60
seconds or even longer! Not long ago switch out the SO grinder to a
different SO and first beading was a full minute with a whopping ~0.5oz
after 2 minutes, so most definetly ya don't time your shots from start of
seeing espresso come down:)
So if you counted 30sec from pushing the button with a vibe right on the
"start of dial it in to taste" money. (Didn't watch the video so don't know
if vibe or rotary...)
Slave to the Bean  miKe mcKoffee
www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/
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15) From: Allon Stern
On Sep 2, 2010, at 12:07 AM, miKe mcKoffee wrote:
<Snip>
Faema Compact C85 - vibe pump and E61 compact group.
So I should be in the ballpark - it was about 8 seconds to start of flow, maybe a little on the long side.
-
allon
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16) From: Allon Stern
On Sep 2, 2010, at 12:30 AM, Allon Stern wrote:
<Snip>
Okay, I should clarify...I've been told it's an E61-kinda-sorta-not really group.
Maybe E61 *style*. Too strong?
okay, truth be told, I have no idea how to class the group. I've been trying......
-
allon
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17) From: Allon Stern
On Sep 1, 2010, at 10:36 PM, Allon Stern wrote:
<Snip>
Okay, I was wrong; looking at the bag this morning they were only 6 days old, closer to 5.5, I guess since I roasted them in the evening on the 28th.
Unfortunately, I'm demolishing this coffee so it'll never have a chance to age properly. Even though I've greatly increased the amount I'm roasting, I still haven't reached the point where I'm roasting faster than I'm drinking....gotta work on that, build up a stash of roasted, then slow back down a bit; that'll get me a pipeline going.
-
allon
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