HomeRoast Digest


Topic: Quest: Engineer v Artisan, or Engineer + Artisan? (9 msgs / 247 lines)
1) From: Robert Yoder
Greetings, all, and thank you for the continuing wealth of useful information!
 
I really hope to own and operate a Quest, but it's not yet in the cards for me.  Even if it became available to me, the next step of hyper-instrumentation might take awhile to materialize.
 
I'm imagining that coffee-roasting has existed since long before digital thermocouples and their accoutrements.  Is it possible that the Quest M3 requires these inputs? Software?  A MAC?   I wonder how/if the roaster might be used by us old analog-types?  Or is the consensus that the roaster's results, absent augmentative instrumentation, must be inferior? (I do concede, that, in some cases, instrumentation can help replicate an artisan-developed roast profile, and I'm glad to hear about it, in the off-chances that I will have a Quest, and, later, have the ancillaries.)
 
Happy Valentine's Day, everyone!  A special Happy Valentine's Day wish to Tom, Maria, BOO, Derek and the rest of the SM Staff!
 
I just love the way you serve coffee!
 
robert yoder
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2) From: miKe mcKoffee
I'd wager large sums of money that give me an M3 with the existing bi-metal
analog environment thermometer and adding a simple bi-metal analog bean mass
thermometer in the existing hole already drilled for it and quite repeatable
roasts of desired profiles would be very possible. Just like I could
routinely do very repeatable roasts using analog thermometer with split
wired dual variable voltage controlled Caffe' Rosto. 
It's not just the tools, it's how you use them. True artisan roasting is a
marriage of art and science.
Slave to the Bean  miKe mcKoffee
www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/
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3) From: Josh Schwartz
Actually I'd say that's anything but the case. The thing I like most about
the Quest over my previous roasters is that it's a very manual roast. I'm a
very technically-oriented person, but I roast on my Quest entirely by
time/temp/sight/smell and get very good results.
On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 12:08 AM, Robert Yoder wrote:
<Snip>
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4) From: Joseph Robertson
Josh,
Are you sure you didn't just repeat what miKe just said?
Joe
On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 10:21 PM, Josh Schwartz  wrote:
<Snip>
-- 
Joseph Robertson
Sasquatch Coffee Roasters
Craft Coffee Roasting by Design
joe http://www.jolindas.com(360)521-3104     PO Box 451 Stevenson,Washington 98648 USA
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5) From: Hank Perkins
Robert,
You absolutely do not need any of the instrumentation I currently have
installed on my quest.  For the first 4-6 weeks of ownership I ran
with just the analog thermometer. Every roast I did was successful.
What the instrumentation has provided for me is a way to tweek my
roasting and develop repeatability with ease.  Almost everything I do
with the electronics can be (and was)  done with pencil and paper. The
electronics only make it easier and a bit more precise.  I have
advised several to start with the quest in a purely manual mode.
Watching the window, smells, and sounds can become secondary if
reliance on the electronics is too high.
That said, working out how to increase the rate of rise using manual
methods would have been more difficult.  To be honest, if I move the
roaster around all the cabling and connectivity becomes a real pain.
Now, if I roasted several roasts, every day  I am not sure I would
have added the instruments.  I roast twice a week at the most. 4-5
loads each roast day.  Each session takes an hour or two.  If I spent
4 hours 5 days a week roasting much of this would be more intuitive.
Good Luck.
On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 2:35 AM, Joseph Robertson  wr=
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6) From: Frank Parth
Robert,
Absolutely you don't need anything more than what came in the box (except for coffee beans and a source of power!).
But the QM3's design allows much more control over the roast than you get with other machines such as the GC or 
theBehmor. This opens the door for those of us who are nerdy and/or control freaks to monitor, record, and tweak the 
roast inreal time to get consistent results.
I've received everything except the thermocouple adapter and will start logging the roasting data as soon as I receive 
it.  In the mean time I've been roasting and logging the temperature data shown by the included temperature gauge every 
minute to see how the machine behaves while playing with the dials.
IIRC the use of a Mac was brought up because that's how Hank set his up and recommended Artisan software to log 
thedata, and it runs on a Mac.
Frank
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7) From: sci
Robert, et. al.,
I am using the Q with one temperature probe: BT. I don't bother with ET at
all right now. I plan on getting it set up for Artisan some day with the
right probes. But for now I log the BT every 30 seconds. I get very
consistent and great tasting results. I have a baseline roast: 200g, 7.5A,
Fan 4, Charge at 200C. [BTW, thanks to Bob, I have a thermal blanket on the
drum which helps]. From there some slight tweaks can be applied. I manually
plot each roast curve and they all look similar. I use the fan to moderate
the temperature, to slow down 1C and flatten the curve between 1C and 2C.
Hitting 2C is a snap, if I want it.
So, it's not necessary to have lots of instrumentation for basic
repeatability, even if it is desirable for precise repeatability. I will go
there eventually. I'm still absorbing the cost of the initial purchase.
Ivan
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 05:17:25 -0600
From: Hank Perkins 
To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this
       list,   available athttp://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"       
Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Quest: Engineer v Artisan, or Engineer +
       Artisan?
Message-ID:
       
Content-Type: text/plain; charsetO-8859-1
Robert,
You absolutely do not need any of the instrumentation I currently have
installed on my quest.  For the first 4-6 weeks of ownership I ran
with just the analog thermometer. Every roast I did was successful.
What the instrumentation has provided for me is a way to tweek my
roasting and develop repeatability with ease.  Almost everything I do
with the electronics can be (and was)  done with pencil and paper. The
electronics only make it easier and a bit more precise.  I have
advised several to start with the quest in a purely manual mode.
Watching the window, smells, and sounds can become secondary if
reliance on the electronics is too high.
That said, working out how to increase the rate of rise using manual
methods would have been more difficult.  To be honest, if I move the
roaster around all the cabling and connectivity becomes a real pain.
Now, if I roasted several roasts, every day  I am not sure I would
have added the instruments.  I roast twice a week at the most. 4-5
loads each roast day.  Each session takes an hour or two.  If I spent
4 hours 5 days a week roasting much of this would be more intuitive.
Good Luck.
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8) From: Robert Yoder
Thanks, Frank and all, for the perfectly-pertinent posts! 
 
My batches are so small and infrequently roasted, that it would take the rest of my natural life to accumulate the experience you have already gained. 
 
I am curious about the use of a thermal blanket.  What does this thing look like, as fitted to the Quest M3?  Why is it recommended?  Where is it found?
 
What is Artisan software?  Is there a PC "equivalent"?
 
Now if the Lottery comes through, I will start my own Quest quest.  B)  If there is anyone here in the SF Bay Area who would host an opportunity to watch the Quest in action, I'd be happier than a Pig in Garbage! Willing to sweep out the shop.
 
Happy Roasting,
 
robert yoder
 
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9) From: Frank Parth
Robert,
The old saying that knowledge is a journey is very true. We're all continuing to learn and much of that learning 
isfromeach other.
The logging software called Artisan is still in beta release, and it comes in versions for the Mac, for Windows, and 
for Ubuntu Linux. You can download it from:http://code.google.com/p/artisan/downloads/listFrank
Knowledge may be a journey, but wisdom just takes alcohol.
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