HomeRoast Digest


Topic: On Topic: Popper-Roasting (11 msgs / 515 lines)
1) From: Robert Yoder
Greetings, group,
 
I am currently using a modified popper (Independetly-controlled Heat and Fan with Bean Mass Temperature Probe) and have a question about optimal  adjustment of the Fan Speed.  I haven't had much in the way of guidance, but have found some discussion of Fan Speed in respect to Bean-Lofting, so I've started roasts with enough fan to loft the beans and reduced fan as the beans lose weight (in order to keep them from being blown out)  Lately, I seem to be noticing difficulty in reaching a target Bean Mass Temperature and wonder if I should increase or decrease fan speed to speed the roast to its conclusion. I am considering the possibility that the heater element is tiring out, and also considering increasing batch-size. 
 
I would be greatful for any experience-sharing offered, and would also be happy to see the list turn away water-gazing, at least for awile.
 
Happy Roasting,
 
robert yoder
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2) From: miKe mcKoffee
Back when I was Frankenformer Rosto roasting (mucho same as your setup) used
just enough fan to keep good bean movement, reducing speed as beans
lightened as you are. Question: what else has changed? Specifically ambient
temp greatly affects roast since colder air coming in takes more power to
heat. I roasted in the garage and during cold months even throwing my max
142v at heater wasn't enough to compensate, used a box to keep warmer air
surrounding the roaster, sliding top variable how much on but never fully
enclosed. Maybe this will help!
Slave to the Bean miKe mcKoffee
www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
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3) From: miKe mcKoffee
Thinking back not a sliding top and not full box, settled in using a 3 sided
box with top flap adjustable like a draw bridge.

4) From: miKe mcKoffee
Jeeze I'm bread dead this morning it's summer not winter! (first cup of the
morning Esmeralda Americano hadn't kicked in yet :)
Slave to the Bean miKe mcKoffee
www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/

5) From: John Nanci
E-gads, this is like old times.  Loving it.
To my knowledge, nichrome (or any resistive heater) does not 'tire 
out' to any noticeable degree.  They fail, but that's it.  So you can 
take that off the table.
My basic take is that you should continue to reduce the air flow to 
the point it is just able to keep the beans lofted.  If you are 
already there, then instead of increasing bean mass, you may need to 
lower bean mass.  I know often you increase mass to reduce loft, but 
in your case, that is already covered with the fan.  If you have a 
low fan, and heat at maximum, the only other place to go is reducing 
the amount of heat needed.
BTW, which popper are you using?  And what is your initial bean 
mass?  And are you tilting your popper or is it flat?
John
At 10:09 PM 7/10/2013, you wrote:
<Snip>
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6) From: miKe mcKoffee
Yup like old times - including I was so "brain" dead turned to "bread"
pudding!
Slave to the Bean miKe mcKoffee
www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/

7) From: Robert Yoder
Hi, Alchemist,
 
Thanks for your thoughts!  Glad to know nichrome doesn't 'tire out' (indeed that was one of my worries).
 
I will try reducing air flow.  The Wear-Ever 1400W Popcorn Pumper is tilted to improve bean motion.
 
It seems to me that I read that Increasing Bean Load shortened popper roast time (counterintuitively), but I might be mis-remembering.
 
I will check the line voltage, too.
 
This list has been a wonderful resource for me!
 
Happy Roasting,
 
robert yoder
 
<Snip>
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8) From: John Nanci
Hi Robert,
Yes, you read correctly that increasing bean load shortens popper 
roast times IF you don't have a way to reduce the air flow.  By 
increasing load, you are decreasing flow.  But in your case, you 
already have dial control of your air flow, so a higher load won't 
help.  It will just cause you to turn up your air flow to keep the 
system fluidized.  Clearer?
And yes, voltage will make a huge difference.
John
At 02:37 PM 7/11/2013, you wrote:
<Snip>
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9) From: Martin Maney
On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 08:28:17AM -0700, John Nanci wrote:
<Snip>
    The resistance of the elements will increase with age, due to the
    reduction in cross section by oxidation, and also, due to
    elongation of the loops.  This will result in decreased power
   http://www.nationalelement.com/hottips.cfm?TipID=6Of course, many of the same things that cause this aging also
contribute to the eventual failure.  I was hoping to find confirmation
of the longstanding impression I have that, in the sort of wire-coil
heaters we're talking about here, there wasn't usually a whole lot of
increase before they would check out.  OTOH, especially when talking
about a popper that's working well up to some roast level but then
struggles (and maybe fails) to go further, small changes in the roast
chamber inlet temperature can make a surprising difference.
-- 
Happy Holidays!  Cry "Charge it!" and let slip the dogs of more.
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10) From: John Nanci
So far, in about 15 years of playing with nichrome, what I have found 
is that in theory, that is true, but in practice the element just 
burns out and breaks.  For very heavy nichrome in non-corrosive 
atmospheres like a kiln (per your reference) it has a better chance 
of being true but in roasting applications, where the wire is thin 
they just burn through quickly.
John
At 03:59 PM 7/11/2013, you wrote:
<Snip>
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11) From: miKe mcKoffee
I'll add that increasing bean mass to reduce air flow will only increase
heat rate of rise to a point, then rise will drop because of too great a
mass for available btu's versus mass to absorb heat. 
As far as actual available voltage affecting heat, extremely so. Which is
why you don't just want a variable transformer than can "only" attenuate
voltage, but want one that can also increase voltage. Not all can. I've
always used models capable of 20% voltage increase to both compensate for
voltage sags during peak usage times as well as better profile control
hitting the heater hard as/when needed.
Slave to the Bean miKe mcKoffee
www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:http://www.mckoffee.com/Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archiveshttp://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/


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