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Topic: Not sure how to go about roasting now - Behmor (28 msgs / 529 lines)
1) From: Ben Treichel
Clean the gunk from the interior surfaces and reflector. (simple green or
espresso machine cleaner). This might make a difference. Smaller lot size,
2 minute pre-bean warm up.
See how that works.
On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 3:26 PM, Jamie Dolan  wrote:
<Snip>
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2) From: John Nanci
Two fast things.
It's impossible for one element to burn out in a Behmor - they are in 
series so it's all or nothing.
Next, how is your cleaning?  In the inside shiny or dark.  If the 
later, that is your issue as the dark absorbs heat more and makes the 
roaster think it is hotter than it is, so cycles your elements.
And in about 90% of these cases, a good cleaning and a change of the 
thermistor usually brings it back.
If you want to drop me a line off list, I'd be happy to troubleshoot 
with you.  I repair these for Behmor.
John
At 01:26 PM 8/5/2013, you wrote:
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3) From: Michael Baladi
Yeah, if you've opened it once and were comfortable with it you can probably fix anything wrong with it. Get with John. At the same time though, I'm not sure it'll ever do super well with the dark roasts you seem to like.
From: Homeroast [homeroast-bounces] On Behalf Of John Nanci [john]
Two fast things.
It's impossible for one element to burn out in a Behmor - they are in
series so it's all or nothing.
Next, how is your cleaning?  In the inside shiny or dark.  If the
later, that is your issue as the dark absorbs heat more and makes the
roaster think it is hotter than it is, so cycles your elements.
And in about 90% of these cases, a good cleaning and a change of the
thermistor usually brings it back.
If you want to drop me a line off list, I'd be happy to troubleshoot
with you.  I repair these for Behmor.
John
At 01:26 PM 8/5/2013, you wrote:
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4) From: Brian Kamnetz
Unless I am missing something, Jamie regularly roasts to city+, which is
not all that dark, according to Tom's guide:http://www.sweetmarias.com/roasted.pict-guide.phpBrian
On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 4:01 PM, Michael Baladi  wrote:
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5) From: Bonnie Polkinghorn
Hello Jamie,
After all the great cleaning, if that doesn't help, also try wrapping your
chaff collector with aluminum foil.  That shaved 2 minutes off of my roasts.
I never roast an entire pound, I roast 12 ounces, so I can't tell how long
a full 1 lb roast will take on mine, but for 12 ounces, I usually roast on
1 lb P2 B - I have plenty of time.
You also didn't say with profile you are roasting on, if P3, P4, or P5, it
may be that profile may take longer to get to 1C as well.  I don't have a
lot of experience with them.
So, for comparison, with my clean insides and foil wrapped chaff tray, on
1lb P2 B, I consistently get to 1C at the 12 minute mark.  Some coffees a
little after, some a little before, but by far the average time is 12
minutes.
FWIW, I have over 600 roasts in mine, I can't remember how old, but I got
it for Christmas the year it came out, was it 2009?  I roast about the same
amount, two roasts every week or two.
I've never had to fix my Behmor but once to replace the fan.
I hope that John can help you out.
-Bonnie P.
On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Jamie Dolan  wrote:
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6) From: Ben Treichel
Also, if its hot where you are the power company could be dropping the line
voltage. I have used a variac  to compensate for that.
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7) From: Dennis True
you can always contact Joe he is awesome with customer service and will
gladly assist you to get your Behmor back in tip top shape....
On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Bonnie Polkinghorn <
bonnie.polkinghorn> wrote:
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8) From: Jamie Dolan
<Snip>
This is interesting to know.  I'm not sure how the diagnosis was made
of one element being out, my dad had the machine, said one of them was
out, contacted behmor and got the replacement.
<Snip>
I have not looked at it personally since my dad replaced the burners,
but he said he cleaned every surface of it inside and out; which for
him typically would mean he polished every last surface till it
shines.
Perhaps we need to change the thermistor(s).  I would guess we need to
order those from Behmor?
<Snip>
Thank You very much.  I need to run over to my parents house and have
a look at it for myself and see that it is totally clean; but from
what my dad told me I was confident that he cleaned it well.
Sounds like the thermistor replacement might be the next option.
Thank You;
Jamie
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9) From: Jamie Dolan
<Snip>
HI;
It does vary with what bean / blend we get.  We got around 30 pounds
of Moka Kadir last time they had it in stock and we definitely roast
that much darker than just about anything else.  Otherwise City+ to
Full City range is pretty normal with most other beans.
Jamie
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10) From: Jamie Dolan
<Snip>
I've actually always done P2 B.  I had been roasting 13 ounces like
that for quite a while at or close to the max time.
In the summer it isn't really an issue, but in the winter months the
smoke in the house had really started to bother my asthma, which is
the reason that my dad has the roaster and has been roasting most of
this year.
But I know there was a big problem when he couldn't even get a pound
of beans through first crack with a full cycle.
<Snip>
Thanks, that give me a good point to compare to.  I'm going to have to
go get the machine and try it myself to see exactly what is happening
when.  Obviously it's warm enough this time of year that I can roast
outside.
<Snip>
That's great to know that it's holding up so well and I'm now feeling
like whatever is going on can be fixed after reading these messages.
Thank You.
I was at the SCA show in 2008 and he had the Behmor there, I think it
was almost brand new at that point.
Jamie
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11) From: John Nanci
At 08:09 AM 8/6/2013, you wrote:
<Snip>
Curious.  Why do you wrap your chaff tray in foil?  And is it the 
high or low one?
<Snip>
Not quite knowing what you mean by this, a piece of info.  The Behmor 
actually can roast slower in hot weather compared to cold.  It sounds 
anti-intuitive, but true - I can explain why if you care.  If you are 
just meaning warm enough for you comfort....never mind :)
<Snip>
Totally true.
<Snip>
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12) From: Bonnie Polkinghorn
Hello John,
I wrap the chaff tray in foil to speed up my roasting time.  I must have
read about it somewhere, probably here,  tried it, and it worked for me.  I
have the original high one.  I wrap it up and use that high temp. tape to
secure it.  I change the foil every 20 roasts or so.  Like I said, it sped
up my roasts by 2 full minutes for the 12 ounce roasts.
-Bonnie
On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 8:29 AM, John Nanci wrote:
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13) From: Jamie Dolan
<Snip>
It's in the 70's here lately.  At what point do the warmer ambient
temperatures start to affect the roasting time?
I would assume that it ends up being related to the temperature
sensors thinking it is too hot when the ambient temperature is higher
and it adjusts accordingly, turning down the burners?
Sorry I wasn't more clear, I mentioned in another message; I have
asthma and the smoke from roasting inside has gotten to be too much
for me; thus my dad had been roasting most of this year for me.  I'm
fine if I can roast outside; though in Wisconsin, over half the year
is too cold to use the behmor outside (errors out in the cold, though
sometimes it's worked okay in the cold if I bring it out and start it
immediately).
Jamie
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14) From: Martin Maney
On Tue, Aug 06, 2013 at 08:29:50AM -0700, John Nanci wrote:
<Snip>
I'd be interested if there's is anything more than the obvious change
in the effective trip point of the "thermostat" the controller runs
based on the wall-mounted sensor and the fans that move the air on and
past it.
-- 
Minsky's Organism Principle: When a system evolves to become more complex,
this always involves a compromise: if its parts become too separate,
then the system's abilities will be limited; but if there are too many
interconnections, then each change in one part will disrupt many others.
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15) From: John Nanci
Nope, that is exactly it.
At 11:50 AM 8/6/2013, you wrote:
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16) From: Seth Grandeau
Bonnie,
Shiny side out or dull side?
-Seth
On Aug 6, 2013, at 6:00 AM, Bonnie Polkinghorn
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17) From: Bonnie Polkinghorn
Excellent question, Seth. I put the shiny side out.
-Bonnie
On Wed, Aug 7, 2013 at 11:51 AM, Seth Grandeau  wrote:
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18) From: Seth Grandeau
Interesting. Had your chaff collector dulled or is it that you're
covering part of the mesh section?
I tried the new "low profile" collector, but it extended the roast
times significantly. I switched back to the old one.
On Aug 7, 2013, at 11:11 AM, Bonnie Polkinghorn
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19) From: John Nanci
Do you pre-heat?
Alternatively, if you don't mind cleaning up a touch more, just don't 
use a chaff tray at all.
John
At 03:04 PM 8/7/2013, you wrote:
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20) From: Ira
Hello Seth,
Wednesday, August 7, 2013, 3:04 PM, you wrote:
<Snip>
<Snip>
I found that same reduction in roast time and I attributed more it to insulation and less to reflection. I only change that piece of foil when it finally tears and I probably put the shiny side facing in but I don't really think it's very shiny any more after the 30 or more roasts it's been in there.
-- Ira
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21) From: Bonnie Polkinghorn
I agree with Ira.  I am covering part of the mesh section, all but a small
1 inch square so I can still peak at the beans.  I don't know if the chaff
tray is dull.  I did see a newer Behmor than mine once, and the inside
walls were so much shinier.  It may be the early models are a little
different, I don't know.
I don't preheat because I figure the Behmor is like an oven, and if I
preheat, then open the door to put the beans in, I have just lost all of
the heat that was in there.
As with most anything, this method works great for me.   I don't want to
add another 2 minutes to my roast times to preheat when I shaved two
minutes off with the foil.  To be honest about when I change the foil, its
also when it tears or when I see the 1C times creeping up.  Since I started
using the high heat aluminum tape (make sure it is high heat, there are
aluminum tapes that are not) - the foil doesn't tear very often.  I do
clean the foil like I do the inside walls.
Also, if I don't use a chaff tray, and I have tried it, especially with
decafs (since they have little to no chaff), the time to 1C (and therefore
the total roast time) is longer.
Wow, I am totally out of lurker mode with this discussion!
-Bonnie
On Wed, Aug 7, 2013 at 5:57 PM, Ira  wrote:
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22) From: Seth Grandeau
I've tried preheating, and it helps me get to 1st C, before running
out of time, but I could feel so much heat "leaking" through the
glass, with the low profile model. I think the best solution would
have been a small "peak hole", maybe 2 inches, and a solid, high wall
chaff collector, everywhere else.
On Aug 7, 2013, at 3:25 PM, Bonnie Polkinghorn
 wrote:
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23) From: Michael Baladi
Interesting..... I once forgot to put the chaffe tray in, are there any long term affects on the Behmor from not using a chaffe tray? I actually find the tray a bit of a pain to clean up vs just vacuuming the inside of the behmore and giving it a quick wipe down. The tray has too many nooks and crannies.
From: Homeroast [homeroast-bounces] On Behalf Of John Nanci [john]
Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2013 7:17 PM
To: A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this list,      available athttp://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.htmlSubject: Re: [Homeroast] Not sure how to go about roasting now - Behmor close to death
Do you pre-heat?
Alternatively, if you don't mind cleaning up a touch more, just don't
use a chaff tray at all.
John
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24) From: John Nanci
Nope, none that I know of.  It's a convenience item.  Mine from 6 
years ago is still going strong and I never use one.  Just keep up on 
the cleaning as there is more surfaces to clean without the tray.
John
At 06:25 AM 8/8/2013, you wrote:
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25) From: Sheila Quinn
I haven't used my chaff tray in ages. Not needed. Plus, it makes it 
easier to see the beans as they're roasting. :)
On 8/8/13 9:38 AM, John Nanci wrote:
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26) From: Ben Treichel
Nope, but it slows the roast.
On Aug 8, 2013 8:27 AM, "Michael Baladi"  wrote:
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27) From: John Nanci
Clearly, YMMV applies here because that is exactly the opposite of 
what I experience.  My speeds up.
John
At 08:19 AM 8/8/2013, you wrote:
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28) From: ricky carter
Same here, my roast times were faster without the chaffe tray.
On Thu, Aug 8, 2013 at 11:21 AM, John Nanci wrote:
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