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Topic: "Rolling" was RE: +"Bracketing" roasts question (9 msgs / 198 lines)
1) From: Ted Kostek
I'm still getting a feel for what 1st and 2nd crack mean.  Does the term
"rolling" above have anything to do with the motion of the beans?  I
typically see the beans jump around pretty vigorously, and occasionally one
jumps out of the popper altogether.  Where does this "jumping" occur?  2nd
crack only?
Ted Kostek
765 494 2146 (desk)
765 494 1489 (engine room)
765 494 0787 (fax)
"Always keep in mind that your own resolution to succeed is more important
than any other thing."  Abraham Lincoln
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2) From: Gary Zimmerman
Ted Kostek wrote:
No, I don't think so.  But first crack especially is approached sort of 
like a bell curve.  There are a few outlier pops at the beginning, then the 
bulk of the pops, then they trail off to, usually, a distinct silent pause 
before the second crack begins (which sounds more like a sizzling than a 
popping).  With some coffee blends, you might have a few isolated beans pop 
very early on, then wait for another minute or two before hearing any more.
Because of this, folks on the list usually take "first crack" to be when 
there is frequent, constant popping.  I believe one person characterized it 
as at least one popping sound every ten seconds.  I'm not nearly that 
methodical - but "rolling" just means a constant popping noise, as opposed 
to just one or two isolated pops.  I "just know" when it's happening, and 
don't count the roast as having hit first crack until the pops are 
relatively constant and continual.
-- garyZ
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3) From: R.N.Kyle
Gary's explanation was good, this is what I perceive as first and 2nd crack,
some coffee beans will have a really loud first crack, and it is more like a
popping sound, like Gary said there is usually a few beans at the outset,
then the popping become closer together, and eventually will trail off, then
their is usually a pause 20 sec to 3 min. it varies, some beans go from 1st
right into 2nd with little of no pause. the 2nd crack is not as loud,
instead of a pop it sound like a crackle slow at first and then it becomes
more rapid, and goes into a rolling 2nd crack like Gary said it sounds like
a sizzle.the cracks a very rapid, one on top of the other, hope this helps
Ron Kyle
a coffee roaster from South Carolina

4) From: Rick Farris
Ted wrote:
No, it's just a term used when the cracking noises are very vigorous, coming
like a drum roll.  On some beans it is more vigorous than on others.
The best way to get a handle on the cracks is to roast a couple of batches
pretty much to charcoal.  Depending on your roaster, after 3- to 10-
minutes, you'll hear a noise a lot like popcorn popping, but maybe not so
loud.  After a while that will go away.  From -30 seconds to +3 minutes from
the end of first crack you'll hear a softer sound, sort of like cellophane
crinkling.  That is second crack.  You may have to listen very carefully to
hear it.  See Ken David's book on Homeroasting for details as to what causes
the sounds.
Sounds like something is wrong, Ted.  Those beans ought to be flying around
from the very beginning, all the way through the end.
-- Rick
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5) From: TFisher511
Think more in terms of a drum roll, and just close your eyes to avoid the 
Terry F

6) From: Gary Zimmerman
Rick Farris wrote:
I don't have a lot of experience with fluid bed roasting, but I did 
recently modify an old Wear-Ever Popcorn Pumper for roasting, and have 
tried a few batches.
Based on some information from this list quite awhile back, I judge the 
amount of beans to use by pouring them into the running popper until there 
is just a hint of movement to the bean pile.  I use the long handle of a 
wooden spoon to manually agitate the beans for a few minutes until the 
beans have lost enough moisture and weight to agitate themselves (like we 
do on this list so often).
Seems to work for me.  I'd be afraid that if I put in a lesser quantity of 
beans to begin with, such that they flew around from beginning to end, 
their temperature wouldn't get hot enough fast enough to properly 
roast.  But I have not tried it that way either, so I can't say for certain.
-- garyZ
WhirleyPop (and occasional Popcorn Pumper)
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7) From: Ted Kostek
The beans start to jump around a little before I hear the very first
(outlier) crack, and they do in fact continue for the rest of the roast.
I'm using an air popper, and typically I'll hear a fairly loud "snap" after
about 2-3 min, and then some more cracks for a while, but I would not say
that I ever get a 'rolling' crack of the loud ones.  My popper is awful
loud, though, so I'm not sure if most of the cracks are just in the "noise".
Last night I did 1/2 cup batches of Kenyan Karani and probably heard about a
dozen or so loud, distinct cracks in each batch.  If the target rate is
something like 1 per 10 seconds, then I guess I'm hitting it.
I've been thinking of trying a stove top roast in a pan to try to get a
sense of the sounds, but my wife won't let me use our good pots and pans for
the job.  Guess I'll have to get a cheap-o tin or foil plate.
Ted Kostek
765 494 2146 (desk)
765 494 1489 (engine room)
765 494 0787 (fax)
"Always keep in mind that your own resolution to succeed is more important
than any other thing."  Abraham Lincoln
homeroast mailing listhttp://lists.sweetmarias.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast

8) From: David Jewett
In toxicologic terms, I thought that "rolling" involved hallucinogenic 
amphetamines and loud techno-music environments...
David Jewett/MI
I prefer my stimulants to be of the non-hallucinogenic sort.
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9) From: Charlie Herlihy
involved hallucinogenic 
amphetamines and loud techno-music environments...
David Jewett/MI<
 I could be a little behind the times here in rural
BC, but I believe you're thinking of "raving"
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